Author Topic: The Nats are...For Sale?!?  (Read 26538 times)

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Online HalfSmokes

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #625: November 28, 2022, 06:02:50 PM »
Which makes me wonder who is responsible for saying the court system is broken, here's what we need to do to fix it.

This is New York State. I doubt anyone cares about lawyers billing a Washington team suing a Baltimore team

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #626: November 28, 2022, 06:25:10 PM »
If the Lerners have a figure in mind but no offers they either need to lower expectations or hang onto the team.

Online HalfSmokes

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #627: November 28, 2022, 08:31:14 PM »
If the Lerners have a figure in mind but no offers they either need to lower expectations or hang onto the team.

Worst case is they keep the team, but run it with expenses cut to the bone

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #628: November 28, 2022, 08:40:58 PM »
Worst case is they keep the team, but run it with expenses cut to the bone
Of course that would be really dumb as it would drive down the value more. I think the question is why do they want to sell?  Tired of the toy already? The younger kids don’t want to take it over?  So how motivated are they to sell now. Hope the answer is very.

Offline Slateman

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #629: November 28, 2022, 08:45:36 PM »
The civil court system at this level is designed for lawyers to accrue as many billable hours as possible so the lawsuit is going as planned for those who really matter, the lawyers.
Yep. Whatever money gets paid out is going to the lawyers at this point

Offline nfotiu

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #630: November 28, 2022, 09:18:06 PM »
Yep. Whatever money gets paid out is going to the lawyers at this point
Well, that's the rub, isn't it?

If the team is worth 2 billion, comes with 500 million in debt, is likely owed north of 500 million for past season tv rights, but it is likely going to take a few hundred million in legal fees to eventually get paid, how much is it worth?   Oh, and a third of the projected future revenue of the business will likely be tied up in lawsuits for years that will take hundresd of million of legal fees to collect at some unknown time.

How do you put a value on that company?  Who the hell would want to take that on?  Is it even a good investment to take on for nothing?  I wonder if at some point the Lerners consider or threaten to declare bankruptcy to try to force a resolution to the mess.

Offline PowerBoater69

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #631: November 28, 2022, 09:27:30 PM »
...but it is likely going to take a few hundred million in legal fees to eventually get paid...

Lawyers are expensive but not that expensive.

Offline PowerBoater69

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #632: November 28, 2022, 09:31:18 PM »
Worst case is they keep the team, but run it with expenses cut to the bone

Contributing to that issue is that the Lerner family has always run the team by consensus, they meet and agree upon a course of action, but that model no longer appears to be working. I can't believe that Mark wants to sell, so is it the sisters or brother-in-law's pushing the family to sell? Kind of like what is happening up in Baltimore, the patriarch is getting older and the heirs are starting to eye their slice of the family fortune.

Offline PowerBoater69

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #633: November 28, 2022, 09:33:09 PM »
Manfred can remind Angelo’s that ownership transfers require approval and that the MASN uncertainly isn’t the best time for it to occur

The Angelos family is waiting for Peter to pass away before selling the team, only at that point will they be motivated to resolve the MASN dispute.

Offline nfotiu

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #634: November 28, 2022, 10:03:27 PM »
Lawyers are expensive but not that expensive.
Agreed. It just brings up the question of how to agree on a the value of 500 million in accounts receivable that requires years of litigation that may get paid out this decade (optimistically).  And then they have to figure out the value of a very significant chunk of future revenues that are subject to the same conditions and uncertainty.

   

Online Five Banners

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #635: November 28, 2022, 11:03:38 PM »
Agreed. It just brings up the question of how to agree on a the value of 500 million in accounts receivable that requires years of litigation that may get paid out this decade (optimistically).  And then they have to figure out the value of a very significant chunk of future revenues that are subject to the same conditions and uncertainty.

 

Just have the balance of the $500 million given to them in red carpet rewards

Offline aspenbubba

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #636: November 29, 2022, 07:25:01 AM »
Lawyers are expensive but not that expensive.

Also we don't know if the losing side has to pay "reasonable " attorneys fees to the winner

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #637: November 29, 2022, 08:29:23 AM »
The Angelos family is waiting for Peter to pass away before selling the team, only at that point will they be motivated to resolve the MASN dispute.
It seems he is incapacitated. But he could hang on for years. We don’t know what his medical prospects are. There are legal fights already between the sons so it will get ugly for sure. Don’t think they can necessarily wait for him to kick the bucket until they sell. 

Offline PowerBoater69

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #638: November 29, 2022, 09:11:24 AM »
It seems he is incapacitated. But he could hang on for years. We don’t know what his medical prospects are. There are legal fights already between the sons so it will get ugly for sure. Don’t think they can necessarily wait for him to kick the bucket until they sell. 

Apparently they'll get killed in taxes if they sell before he dies so they are holding out.

Offline nfotiu

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #639: November 29, 2022, 10:28:18 AM »
So our off season (which may last a few years) is spent hoping for an old man to die, so our checked out old men can sell.   Woohoo, fun!  :old:

Offline imref

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #640: November 29, 2022, 12:04:48 PM »
FWIW, Mark Lerner was courtside last night at the Wizards game with Ted Leonis's son (who looks just like him).  Lerner looks to be in terrible shape. I wonder if that has something to do with the sale.

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #641: November 29, 2022, 12:35:35 PM »
Apparently they'll get killed in taxes if they sell before he dies so they are holding out.

Found this article. It seems available without a subscription.

https://theathletic.com/3623328/2022/09/23/baltimore-orioles-goldman-sale-angelos/?amp=1

What’s a bit confusing is that they mention that the wife will inherit the team if the old man dies. So wouldn’t she be the one selling it then and also subject to capital gains taxes.

Not an expert on tax laws but it seems just insane that a family could perhaps realize a $2 billion gain and largely avoid taxes through stepped-up basis.   The rich get richer. The article also mentions that he bought the team with other individuals including Tom Clancy (deceased) and Pam Shriner (not deceased). Did he buy the other partners out??

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #642: November 29, 2022, 12:40:39 PM »
FWIW, Mark Lerner was courtside last night at the Wizards game with Ted Leonis's son (who looks just like him).  Lerner looks to be in terrible shape. I wonder if that has something to do with the sale.
So Ted’s son looks just like Mark Lerner? Hmmm.

Online Five Banners

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #643: November 29, 2022, 12:54:47 PM »
FWIW, Mark Lerner was courtside last night at the Wizards game with Ted Leonis's son (who looks just like him).  Lerner looks to be in terrible shape. I wonder if that has something to do with the sale.

There was something that looked markedly worse from the shots from him previously in the 2019 coverage beyond the walking assistance needed and pale-ish complexion?

Offline nfotiu

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #644: November 29, 2022, 01:12:43 PM »

Offline imref

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #645: November 29, 2022, 02:11:14 PM »
I wonder if this is related to the Nats...

https://sports.yahoo.com/billionaire-jeffrey-skoll-buying-wizards-160038106.html

Does this mean a "Skoll" chant at Wizards games from now on?

(BTW, when posting links, you can delete the question mark and everything afterwards, that's just to capture tracking information.)

Offline Duke of Earl

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #646: November 29, 2022, 05:08:50 PM »
So Ted’s son looks just like Mark Lerner? Hmmm.
so was Ted fiddling around with Lerner's wife?  Or vice versa.

Offline imref

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #647: November 29, 2022, 05:36:27 PM »
There was something that looked markedly worse from the shots from him previously in the 2019 coverage beyond the walking assistance needed and pale-ish complexion?

Mark has had a lot of health issues and had part of a leg amputated a few years ago.

so was Ted fiddling around with Lerner's wife?  Or vice versa.

Maybe I could have phrased that better? :)

Online Five Banners

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #648: November 29, 2022, 06:05:37 PM »
Mark has had a lot of health issues and had part of a leg amputated a few years ago.


That was all known and discussed 2019, which was why I was asking if there were something beyond that which prompted the comment about being in terrible shape beyond the already known challenges. Hopefully the fact that he’s getting out to games is a good sign

Offline imref

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Re: The Nats are...For Sale?!?
« Reply #649: November 29, 2022, 06:08:17 PM »
That was all known and discussed 2019, which was why I was asking if there were something beyond that which prompted the comment about being in terrible shape beyond the already known challenges. Hopefully the fact that he’s getting out to games is a good sign

i can't find the picture, but i just thought he didn't look very good, he looked like he put on a lot of weight.