The Garage

[PANatsFan]

The high performance flappy paddle gearboxes are really automated manuals.  They have a clutch like a manual, it's just controlled by computer.  That's different than what you get in say the Mazda 5 where it's a regular old torque converter automatic where you can select the gear yourself if you choose.

Huh, I never thought about using that to increase the gear on a highway. I hate when I don't hit 5 gear until like 80mph.

[Nathan]

Some of those are notorious for not really listening to what you tell it to do, for instance downshifting if you press the accelerator even when you don't want it too.  The one in the Mazdas is pretty decent though.  In the rental I had, it's sit there bouncing off the rev limiter all day if I put it in manual mode and left it in first.

[MarquisDeSade]

I've got winding mountain roads a mile away.  Admittedly, I don't drive in DC traffic.

If I didn't have to deal with 495-295 and back every day I'd probably get something sporty.  I just can't see a lot of utility is having "horsepower" when you're averaging 32mph every day.

[PANatsFan]

If I didn't have to deal with 495-295 and back every day I'd probably get something sporty.  I just can't see a lot of utility is having "horsepower" when you're averaging 32mph every day.

That's why my Mazda kicks butt. You can load it up with kids and be safe or drive for real on mountain roads by yourself, and it will really respond. Passing people on a 2-lane road in a Mazda5 gets awesome reactions.

[Nathan]

If I didn't have to deal with 495-295 and back every day I'd probably get something sporty.  I just can't see a lot of utility is having "horsepower" when you're averaging 32mph every day.

I drive a Mazda 3, I don't have "horsepower"   I've got a 2.3 liter with 160 horsepower.  That doesn't mean it's not sporty.  It's more about the handling, heel and toe downshifts going into corners, rev matching, putting the power down coming out of the corner, etc.  It doesn't have to have 400+ HP and go 0-60 in 4 seconds to be sporty.

[tomterp]

Originally yes, but my dad (who currently has it) put in a Hurst on the floor. 

 

[MarquisDeSade]

Yeah, I never understood why it came with a 396 but was a three speed automatic.  The Hurst is a beast.  

[PANatsFan]

I drive a Mazda 3, I don't have "horsepower"   I've got a 2.3 liter with 160 horsepower.  That doesn't mean it's not sporty.  It's more about the handling, heel and toe downshifts going into corners, rev matching, putting the power down coming out of the corner, etc.  It doesn't have to have 400+ HP and go 0-60 in 4 seconds to be sporty.

The Mazda5 is horrible off the starting line.

[tomterp]

I don't know, maybe you guys have better commutes than me but I just don't see the purpose in having a "sporty" car if you're going to be stuck in traffic all the time. 

The first 5 miles outbound in the morning (last 5 coming home) are where I can let it rip.

[Nathan]

The Mazda5 is horrible off the starting line.

That's because it's a slushbox

[PANatsFan]

The first 5 miles outbound in the morning (last 5 coming home) are where I can let it rip.

As soon as you are away from the wife or the boss.

[tomterp]

Unless you get one of those fancy ones like VW's DSG or Ford's new PowerShift gearbox.

This is why VW isn't selling very many manual shifts.  The DSG is a cut above the traditional automatic, but still, I want to choose my own gear, not have a computer do it.  When I'm descending a steep hill, I want the engine brake the way I like it, not having it automatically shift away from my intent.

[tomterp]

As soon as you are away from the wife or the boss.

Near my house, the Oakton / Reston area, are lots of tight winding roads, one-lane bridges, oak trees in my way, etc.

[Nathan]

This is why VW isn't selling very many manual shifts.  The DSG is a cut above the traditional automatic, but still, I want to choose my own gear, not have a computer do it.  When I'm descending a steep hill, I want the engine brake the way I like it, not having it automatically shift away from my intent.

You can do that with the DSG in manual shift mode.  And it shifts faster than a human can.  But still, I'm with you, I like having my 3 pedals and stick shift.

[PANatsFan]

Near my house, the Oakton / Reston area, are lots of tight winding roads, one-lane bridges, oak trees in my way, etc.

You missed the fart joke, sir.

[Nathan]

You missed the fart joke, sir.

I didn't.  I'm so mature!

[GburgNatsFan]

It is much more fun to drive a "slow" car fast than to drive a fast car slow.

I drive a Mazda 3, I don't have "horsepower"   I've got a 2.3 liter with 160 horsepower.  That doesn't mean it's not sporty.  It's more about the handling, heel and toe downshifts going into corners, rev matching, putting the power down coming out of the corner, etc.  It doesn't have to have 400+ HP and go 0-60 in 4 seconds to be sporty.

[tomterp]

Yeah, I never understood why it came with a 396 but was a three speed automatic.  The Hurst is a beast.  

The greater the horsepower, the fewer gears needed.  

[Nathan]

It is much more fun to drive a "slow" car fast than to drive a fast car slow.

I'm much more capable of pushing something like a Mazda 3 to its limits than something like a Gallardo Superleggera.

[GburgNatsFan]

Perhaps, but I think in the practical life of the car (say 150K, the point at which you'd probably be itching for a new car anyway), autos are less likely to be trouble. No clutches to replace.

I know. I'm starting a Holy War. Go ahead, rail away.

I've lived in the DC area since 1974 and every car I've ever owned has been a manual. My right leg gets way more tired from being on the brake all the time in DC-area traffic than my left leg does from working the clutch, but having to brake all the time is something you have to do regardless of which type of transmission you have.

[Nathan]

I've never replaced a clutch on any car I've owned.  Not my 95,000 mile Wrangler nor my 150,000 mile Chevy Crapalier.

[tomterp]

Perhaps, but I think in the practical life of the car (say 150K, the point at which you'd probably be itching for a new car anyway), autos are less likely to be trouble. No clutches to replace.

I know. I'm starting a Holy War. Go ahead, rail away.

I've never had to replace a manual clutch.  Got 171k on my BMW now.  Have taken an '81 Civic, 88 Jetta and '90 Cherokee well past 100k, no issues.

I would think a clutch has a lot fewer working parts than any of these highly complex new hybrid jobs. 

[MarquisDeSade]

I've never replaced a clutch on any car I've owned.  Not my 95,000 mile Wrangler nor my 150,000 mile Chevy Crapalier.

My 150K VW Golf is going to need one (it slips once it gets hot) once the warm weather comes back but it's getting retired once my divorce with the IRS is complete. 

[GburgNatsFan]

You could be right. I could be comparing older, poorer clutches to newer, more reliable autos, too.

I've never had to replace a manual clutch.  Got 171k on my BMW now.  Have taken an '81 Civic, 88 Jetta and '90 Cherokee well past 100k, no issues.

I would think a clutch has a lot fewer working parts than any of these highly complex new hybrid jobs. 

[tomterp]

You could be right. I could be comparing older, poorer clutches to newer, more reliable autos, too.

But don't get me started on the reliability of automated window openers.