Author Topic: 2021-2022 Offseason Discussion/Signings/Trades/Rumors  (Read 18291 times)

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Online Slateman

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not a sph anymore.

But, my basic point is that there is a difference between tanking and putting building blocks in place. I don't see the building blocks being put in place, nor do I see them even following last year's approach of bringing in flippable assets
Last year they made those moves with the intention of competing. This year there is no reason to attempt it. 2022 is an extended spring training. They have to know about Strasburg, Robles, and Kieboom. They have to give Ruiz his time to develop. Same for Gray and Cavalli (and to a lesser extent, Henry).

There were two building blocks available this offseason: Rodriguez and Seager. And there was no way the Lerners were going to greenlight big spending with so many question marks. Not after essentially saying they werent willing to spend on Turner and getting burned in the Strasburg contract.

Online zimm_da_kid

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We’re closer than the Cubs and the Cubs just signed stroman. 

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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There are 8 positions besides pitcher, 9 of you count dh. There are 3 regulars locked in- soto, bell, and ruiz - for 22. There are 3 guys they ate making a call on- Robles , Kieboom,  and Garcia. Picking up a competitive Ss and Lf won't block anyone. You are going to have to spend or deal to fill those slots at some point.

Offline Elvir Ovcina

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We’re closer than the Cubs

How?  They have a better major league roster and a better farm system, with their top prospects closer to the majors and fewer albatross contracts.  There's only one Soto.

Online zimm_da_kid

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Buy low on moustakis?

Online Slateman

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Buy low on moustakis?
Unless they're packaging him with a prospect, why?

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Buy low on moustakis?
I think Hernandez is probably the last starter they are picking up for the infield.  I expect Kieboom at 3rd, Garcia at either SS or 2nd, and Hernandez or Escobar starting in the other spot.

Online Slateman

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https://mobile.twitter.com/jeffpassan/status/1469812763149185030?s=21

Quote
Utilityman Dee Strange-Gordon and the Washington Nationals are in agreement on a minor league contract, a source familiar with the deal tells ESPN. Strange-Gordon was eligible to sign after not playing in big leagues last season. Minor league deals are allowed during the lockout.

Offline imref

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Nats sign 3B Maikel Franco to a minor league contract.

Online Natsinpwc

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Nats sign 3B Maikel Franco to a minor league contract.

Playoffs baby.

Online Slateman

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Alcides Escobar, Dee Gordon, and Maikel Franco.... man, the 2016 Nationals are gonna be lit

Offline Five Banners

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Nats sign 3B Maikel Franco to a minor league contract.

Just wait until Long and even Howie get to weigh in on his swing…

Oh wait…

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Alcides Escobar, Dee Gordon, and Maikel Franco.... man, the 2016 Nationals are gonna be lit
2022 team nickname - Juan Soto and the Replacements.

Literally bringing in replacement players in case the 3rd year of tryouts in the infield bomb.

Offline aspenbubba

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2022 team nickname - Juan Soto and the Replacements.

Literally bringing in replacement players in case the 3rd year of tryouts in the infield bomb.

I think the messages to Kiebust and Garcia are painfully clear. Either have a great ST or get ready for the cold Spring in Rochester.

Online Slateman

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I think the messages to Kiebust and Garcia are painfully clear. Either have a great ST or get ready for the cold Spring in Rochester.
Eh, I dont think they'll get sent down to Rochester from ST unless they are woeful in ST. But it does seem clear that they have to show something to start the season.

Offline aspenbubba

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Eh, I dont think they'll get sent down to Rochester from ST unless they are woeful in ST. But it does seem clear that they have to show something to start the season.
What is your definition of woeful or show something? Kiebusts performance at the ML level is Websters' defintion of woeful. Garcia has shown something and neither will make the trip North unless they turn it around from past performances.

Offline imref

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What is your definition of woeful or show something? Kiebusts performance at the ML level is Websters' defintion of woeful. Garcia has shown something and neither will make the trip North unless they turn it around from past performances.

Garcia locked down a starting spot with his performance last year, including .271 /.291 / .477 in the month of September.  He'll only be 21 at the start of next season.

Offline Kevrock

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not a sph anymore.

But, my basic point is that there is a difference between tanking and putting building blocks in place. I don't see the building blocks being put in place, nor do I see them even following last year's approach of bringing in flippable assets

I'm with JCA. You can't do it all in one off-season. There were some nice pieces in free agency that would have helped in 2023.

I know there are reasons why the Lerners or Rizzo are approaching it this way, I just don't agree with them.

Online Slateman

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What is your definition of woeful or show something? Kiebusts performance at the ML level is Websters' defintion of woeful. Garcia has shown something and neither will make the trip North unless they turn it around from past performances.
Both Garcia and Kieboom have shown flashes at the ML level, and given that we have no delusions of grandeur, it would take a monumentally poor showing to break camp with Franco or Gordon-Strange in a starting role.

Offline nfotiu

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I'm with JCA. You can't do it all in one off-season. There were some nice pieces in free agency that would have helped in 2023.

I know there are reasons why the Lerners or Rizzo are approaching it this way, I just don't agree with them.
There is still a whole pile of free agents left to find a home.   We weren't alone in waiting out the lockout deadline, as most of the pre-lockout frenzy came from a handful of teams.  There are a lot of unknowns about when and what the post lockout mlb will look like, so I'm willing to give them a bit of a benefit of the doubt before judging this off season.

https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/nationals/mlb-free-agent-tracker-full-list-2021-22-free-agent-players


Offline imref

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There is still a whole pile of free agents left to find a home.   We weren't alone in waiting out the lockout deadline, as most of the pre-lockout frenzy came from a handful of teams.  There are a lot of unknowns about when and what the post lockout mlb will look like, so I'm willing to give them a bit of a benefit of the doubt before judging this off season.

https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/nationals/mlb-free-agent-tracker-full-list-2021-22-free-agent-players

Signing Kris Bryant seems like a Rizzo move. I assume Davey has a strong opinion on him one way or the other from their time in Chicago.

Online HondoKillebrew

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Signing Kris Bryant seems like a Rizzo move. I assume Davey has a strong opinion on him one way or the other from their time in Chicago.

I don't see him fitting in given where the Nats are in the rebuilding process. 

Offline imref

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I don't see him fitting in given where the Nats are in the rebuilding process. 

Probably not, unless he gets a Werth-type long-term deal.  The 2011 team was pretty awful, even after we signed Werth.
Ramos C
Morse / LaRoche 1B
Espinosa 2B
Desmond SS
Zimmerman 3B
Nix LF
Ankiel / Bernadina CF
Werth RF

Rotation: Lanan / Livan / JZ / Maquis / CMW

Our bullpen that year featured H-Rod.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Probably not, unless he gets a Werth-type long-term deal.  The 2011 team was pretty awful, even after we signed Werth.
Ramos C
Morse / LaRoche 1B
Espinosa 2B
Desmond SS
Zimmerman 3B
Nix LF
Ankiel / Bernadina CF
Werth RF

Rotation: Lanan / Livan / JZ / Maquis / CMW

Our bullpen that year featured H-Rod.
Well, Stras was on the mend, and Harper was in the system, so that LF combo was a place holder.  Detwiler was on his way up, too, and Storen didn't stink yet  That lineup was essentially the 2012 lineup, minus Harper and whoever our White Whale was in 2012 (Span?). 

This is not 2011.  Even in 2011, we had made the move not only for Werth but also LaRoche.  Call Kieboom, Garcia, and Ruiz a wash with Espinosa, Desmond, and Ramos, and both teams in search of a White Whale CF.  After that, it's not close. Soto is a 3 year piece, not long term like Werth or Zimmerman.  We do not have a second outfielder on the way (like we had in Harper), and we don't have a SS in that Soto window (maybe Garcia, but then there's a hole at 2nd).  Gray is maybe the equivalent of JZ coming off an injury, but Stras is much less likely to be physically able to pitch than he was in 2011 forward.  Corbin / Lannan, but with an albatross contract.

Offline imref

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Well, there is Cavalli. Rutledge is still a huge question mark.  House is probably 2-3 years away. So if they make a splash for someone like Bryant, it's with 2023 in mind and a hope that he's productive through his age 36 season.  The nice thing about Bryant is that he could fill the hole at 3B, play some LF, and possibly shift over to 1B if needed.

I don't think signing Bryant is a great move given where this team is, but it wouldn't surprise me to see Rizzo make a splash and land him on a 6 or 7 year deal.