PB69 presents "Fire Dave Martinez" (2018)

[NatsAllThe Way]

Just heard his post-game presser.  "Just gotta get our starting pitchers to keep us in the game.  We kept it close.  Our offense has come around, we just need our pitching to keep us in games and we'll be fine."
He needs to be fired just for being so disconnected from reality.  How could someone say that?

[rileyn]

Just heard his post-game presser.  "Just gotta get our starting pitchers to keep us in the game.  We kept it close.  Our offense has come around, we just need our pitching to keep us in games and we'll be fine."
He needs to be fired just for being so disconnected from reality.  How could someone say that?

I feel the same way.  Show a pulse.  Gimme something.  Your approach so far has not worked.  Flip over a damn table just for effect. 

[mitlen]

I feel the same way.  Show a pulse.  Gimme something.  Your approach so far has not worked.  Flip over a damn table just for effect. 

It's too late to flip a table.     Everybody would know it's an act.

[Slateman]

flip a table? For real? Y'all watch too many movies.

[PowerBoater69]

It's too late to flip a table.     Everybody would know it's an act.

Yes and no, too late for 2018 but Martínez needs to operate like he'll be back next season and start setting a different tone for 2019. No one more goof ball antics, no more buddy buddy relationships, no more tolerating the type of on field performance that will get him fired. Problem is I doubt that he can pull it off, he's gone into a shell, waiting for it to all be over. After the game on Monday he said that he rewatches the games at night, the poor bastard is punishing himself instead of his players and staff.

[aspenbubba]

I didn’t mind them letting him go. But it was certainly done in a very unprofessional manner. That reflects badly on the ownership and management. And would make it hard to attract an established manager such as Girardi.

I posted something like this a while back. Perhaps the decision to not renew Bakers contract was not done overnite and took many days to form a consensus between ownership , Rizzo and others. There was also an issue of who was available and would they be interested. We just don't know what transpired between the last game and a decision to seek someone else. Remember that Dusty was a fall back hire. I thought he did a great job with many young players and overcoming injuries. Yes , on the face of it he could have been treated better but he left town. Should someone have flown out to Ca. and tell him in person ?

[rileyn]

flip a table? For real? Y'all watch too many movies.

He doesn't literally have to flip a table, but he needs grow a nutsack and show some fight.  He comes across as meek whenever the cameras are on him.

One of my favorite Joe Gibbs anecdotes is when he went nuts at halftime in Philadelphia one year.  According to the players he punched his hand through a chalkboard and went on a 5 minute tirade.  Totally out of character for him, but the players responded.

I played football through college (albeit 25 years ago) so I get the dynamic.  Different approaches work for different teams/managers.  You can't fake it or the players will see right through you, but Davey is just a wuss.  At least Maddon was a weird wuss.  Davey needs to get weird.

[mitlen]

He doesn't literally have to flip a table, but he needs grow a nutsack and show some fight.  He comes across as meek whenever the cameras are on him.

One of my favorite Joe Gibbs anecdotes is when he went nuts at halftime in Philadelphia one year.  According to the players he punched his hand through a chalkboard and went on a 5 minute tirade.  Totally out of character for him, but the players responded.

I played football through college (albeit 25 years ago) so I get the dynamic.  Different approaches work for different teams/managers.  You can't fake it or the players will see right through you, but Davey is just a wuss.  At least Maddon was a weird wuss.  Davey needs to get weird.

Jack Lambert threatened to kick everybody's ass if the team didn't play better.   

[PowerBoater69]

He doesn't literally have to flip a table, but he needs grow a nutsack and show some fight.  He comes across as meek whenever the cameras are on him.

One of my favorite Joe Gibbs anecdotes is when he went nuts at halftime in Philadelphia one year.  According to the players he punched his hand through a chalkboard and went on a 5 minute tirade.  Totally out of character for him, but the players responded.

I played football through college (albeit 25 years ago) so I get the dynamic.  Different approaches work for different teams/managers.  You can't fake it or the players will see right through you, but Davey is just a wuss.  At least Maddon was a weird wuss.  Davey needs to get weird.

Part of the problem is that Martinez only ever coached under Maddon and Davey can't pull off weird. Martinez needs to figure out his own style and he needs to find a balance of not accepting the losing while relaxing a little, the post game interviews are too hushed, no one has died from bad managing,

[mitlen]

Yes and no, too late for 2018 but Martínez needs to operate like he'll be back next season and start setting a different tone for 2019. No one more goof ball antics, no more buddy buddy relationships, no more tolerating the type of on field performance that will get him fired. Problem is I doubt that he can pull it off, he's gone into a shell, waiting for it to all be over. After the game on Monday he said that he rewatches the games at night, the poor bastard is punishing himself instead of his players and staff.

I don't disagree but I'm afraid it's too late to do all this.   I made the comment back somewhere that a tough manager can lighten up but it's almost impossible for a Martinez type manager to get tougher.     I don't think the players will buy it.    I don't think a large portion of the fan base will buy it.     Rizzo doesn't matter because Mark Lerner might buy it.   He appears to be cut from the same whole cloth as dave.    If the Nats win, it won't matter at all.    We all know if the Nats were 10 games up, we'd be yucking it up and thinking how cute dave's management style is.    We'd be callin' him a genius.    What an innovative and 21st century approach to managing men.     

[PowerBoater69]

I posted something like this a while back. Perhaps the decision to not renew Bakers contract was not done overnite and took many days to form a consensus between ownership , Rizzo and others. There was also an issue of who was available and would they be interested. We just don't know what transpired between the last game and a decision to seek someone else. Remember that Dusty was a fall back hire. I thought he did a great job with many young players and overcoming injuries. Yes , on the face of it he could have been treated better but he left town. Should someone have flown out to Ca. and tell him in person ?

They told him that the night before he left that they were undecided, then let him go as soon as his plane landed the next morning. Major jerk move by Lerner and Rizzo.

[PowerBoater69]

I don't disagree but I'm afraid it's too late to do all this.   I made the comment back somewhere that a tough manager can lighten up but it's almost impossible for a Martinez type manager to get tough.     I don't think the players will buy it.    I don't think a large portion of the fan base will buy it.     Rizzo doesn't matter because Mark Lerner might buy it.   He appears to be cut from the same whole cloth as dave.

You are probably right, just pointing out what he should do, clearly doubtful that he is capable of changing.

[Baseball is Life]

I feel the same way.  Show a pulse.  Gimme something.  Your approach so far has not worked.  Flip over a damn table just for effect. 

I suggest kicking a bucket of balls while he's at it. You really need to do both for maximum effect.

[mitlen]

You are probably right, just pointing out what he should do, clearly doubtful that he is capable of changing.

Sittin' here gettin' ready to go to the driving range and thinking.    He would have to do it incrementally.    Using your process could pull it off.    Flippin a table may not work but installing a new "approach" over the rest of this season may make a difference in '19.    The new ground would be set by the time ST started.   However, we both believe it's a heavy lift for him.

"Just win baby."    Al Davis

[Slateman]

The team is still engaged. They're still grinding out at bats. Sorry, but rumors of Martinez losing the clubhouse are greatly exaggerated.

[Natsinpwc]

The team is still engaged. They're still grinding out at bats. Sorry, but rumors of Martinez losing the clubhouse are greatly exaggerated.

People can just not accept when teams and players have bad years. They have to blame lack of effort or something else.  It’s just not their year.  I blame fate.

[Smithian]

People can just not accept when teams and players have bad years. They have to blame lack of effort or something else.  It’s just not their year.  I blame fate.

I am reaching the point of just shrugging about this season. A bunch of worst case scenarios came true at the same and they are still hanging around .500. A couple smart moves this offseason and I look forward to a huge bounce back. This feels like 2013.

[bluestreak]

I posted something like this a while back. Perhaps the decision to not renew Bakers contract was not done overnite and took many days to form a consensus between ownership , Rizzo and others. There was also an issue of who was available and would they be interested. We just don't know what transpired between the last game and a decision to seek someone else. Remember that Dusty was a fall back hire. I thought he did a great job with many young players and overcoming injuries. Yes , on the face of it he could have been treated better but he left town. Should someone have flown out to Ca. and tell him in person ?

According to the reports l, he waited around and repeatedly asked if he should renew his lease for the next year. They kept putting him off. When he finally went home,  they basically waited until he left town then they immediately called him to let it go.

[UMDNats]

I am reaching the point of just shrugging about this season. A bunch of worst case scenarios came true at the same and they are still hanging around .500. A couple smart moves this offseason and I look forward to a huge bounce back. This feels like 2013.

A bunch of guys - about half -  in our lineup are going to finish with an OPS+ over 110 (Zimm, Harper, Murphy, Rendon, Soto) with other contributors like Adams, Turner, Reynolds, Eaton over or around there, too.

Our rotation has 5 guys (counting Stras) with ERA+ over 100. A number of relievers are going to finish with ERA+ over 100 (Doolittle, Miller, Grace, Collins, Suero, maybe Hollard or Glover).

But yet, we suck. Weird year. Timing seems like it was most important as we have never had all the facets clicking.

[mitlen]

I am reaching the point of just shrugging about this season.

I'm almost there.   I'm really glad I like baseball.    No matter what happens, I'll be there enjoyin' a ball game (several) in September.

[HalfSmokes]

It’s funny, as the kids pick up more activities, I find myself watching fewer and fewer sports and not missing it -baseball this year was the execption thanks to night games. Redskins season is awesome since both soccer and lax are on Sunday this fall

[KnorrForYourMoney]

flip a table? For real? Y'all watch too many movies.

???

Even Joe Gibbs once broke a chalkboard at halftime.

[Baseball is Life]

People can just not accept when teams and players have bad years. They have to blame lack of effort or something else.  It’s just not their year.  I blame fate.

I am reaching the point of just shrugging about this season. A bunch of worst case scenarios came true at the same and they are still hanging around .500. A couple smart moves this offseason and I look forward to a huge bounce back. This feels like 2013.

This is where I'm at. It's just baseball. I learned to keep my emotions in check after 2012. I was depressed for weeks after that season.

I really think they can compete next year. Too many good young players (Turner, Rendon, Eaton, Soto, Robles) and pitchers (Max, Stras) that form a core. The pen is an easy fix in the offseason, and hopefully they sign Harper and Murphy for reasonable money, pick up a couple of SP, and saddle up again.

[bluestreak]

???

Even Joe Gibbs once broke a chalkboard at halftime.

That's Joe Gibbs though, he had the Gravitas to do whatever he wanted, and I bet it was more effective given the demeanor he had shown for the years and years prior and I imagine he didn't do it often. If Martinez did it, I imagine he'd be laughed out of the room.

[Baseball is Life]

That's Joe Gibbs though, he had the Gravitas to do whatever he wanted, and I bet it was more effective given the demeanor he had shown for the years and years prior and I imagine he didn't do it often. If Martinez did it, I imagine he'd be laughed out of the room.

How do we know he has not done it already?