Wasting away in Detwilerville

[Mattionals]

Might as well flip him for AAA depth.  Promote Cedeno when he gets healthy, move up Gonzalez to the 40 man or promote Solis.

[mmzznnxx]

Start him or DFA him.

Personally, I'd start him. I'm wholly unimpressed with Treinen. He has a big fastball, that's it. Breaking ball is painfully average. No change.

I think Treinen can be a good ML starter, but not seeing it yet. He had one walk that should have absolutely been a strikeout tonight, and one was an intentional walk, but he still needs more command. Detwiler has command issues too, but we've seen even with his offspeed pitches not working for him he can be a pretty good starter, which speaks to how good his fastball is. And his offspeed probably won't ever be consistent, but when it works he's amazing, and when not he's serviceable to good. Plus it would help his confidence which probably needs a good boost right now.

I'd flip him if we could, but I don't think we could get anything worth the potential at this point with the way he's pitched out of the pen right now. Put him in the #5, let him get back to 2012/early 2013 as he can, and get some decent return or live with him. At this point, he's probably not happy with the Nats and wouldn't stay here even if asked, so give him a good tryout for someone—anyone.

With the way the offense is hitting right now, giving 1/5 starts to Detwiler I don't believe will be the difference between winning or losing the division. Just let him do what he's used to for a while. Hopefully it works out for both him and us, but if not, I don't think we're losing too much, even though starting in the majors would be good learning experience for Treinen or any pitcher.

[blue911]

Why do people believe Detwiler's ineffectiveness is caused by his switch to the bullpen and not his back injury?

[Ray D]

giving 1/5 starts to Detwiler I don't believe will be the difference between winning or losing the division.

It could.    A Detwiler start will be five innings, four runs.  I.e., we concede a loss and burn up the pen.  At this stage, we cannot afford that damage.

[Slateman]

Why do people believe Detwiler's ineffectiveness is caused by his switch to the bullpen and not his back injury?

Is his back hurt now? First I've heard of it.

[blue911]

Is his back hurt now? First I've heard of it.

I didn't say that his back hurt but he missed 3 months last season due a back injury and was terrible for 2 months before going on the DL.

[Slateman]

I didn't say that his back hurt but he missed 3 months last season due a back injury and was terrible for 2 months before going on the DL.

Right, but he should be healthy now, right? I fail to see how an injured back last year would affect performance this year. Unless he's still hurt. In which case, why hasn't anyone noticed, why hasn't he said anything, and why isn't he on the DL. He's throwing 93-95. He's just not locating.

And his body language doesn't say he's hurt. Is body language says he doesn't want to be a reliever. So like I said, Treinen still isn't ready. Start Detwiler, build up some value, trade him away.

[blue911]

Right, but he should be healthy now, right? I fail to see how an injured back last year would affect performance this year. Unless he's still hurt. In which case, why hasn't anyone noticed, why hasn't he said anything, and why isn't he on the DL. He's throwing 93-95. He's just not locating.

And his body language doesn't say he's hurt. Is body language says he doesn't want to be a reliever. So like I said, Treinen still isn't ready. Start Detwiler, build up some value, trade him away.

He didn't have a drop in velocity last season and pitched for two months with it. Location goes first not velocity.

[Slateman]

He didn't have a drop in velocity last season and pitched for two months with it. Location goes first not velocity.

Well make up your mind then. Either he's hurt or he's not. If he's hurt, he should be on the DL.

Regardless, he clearly does not want to be a reliever. He clearly does not know how to be a reliever. Either start him or DFA him, but having him in the pen has been an awful experiment.

[Mathguy]

Blue can only make up his mind when it comes to beer selection

Well make up your mind then.

[blue911]

Well make up your mind then. Either he's hurt or he's not. If he's hurt, he should be on the DL.

Regardless, he clearly does not want to be a reliever. He clearly does not know how to be a reliever. Either start him or DFA him, but having him in the pen has been an awful experiment.

He doesn't like getting his ass kicked. Who would? He hasn't pitched well since he injured his back, why overlook the obvious?

[Slateman]

He doesn't like getting his ass kicked. Who would? He hasn't pitched well since he injured his back, why overlook the obvious?

Then he's hurt, and needs to go on the DL. He wasn't walking a lot of batters in Spring Training. He wasn't walking this many batters last season when he was hurt.

I don't think he's hurt. I think he hates being a reliever and is pissed because the number 5 spot was his and when he's healthy, he's good. Now he's more pissed because when Gio goes down, he feels he should have gotten the spot starts. Couple that with not knowing how to prepare in the pen and you get this version of Detwiler.

If he were hurt, I would think the Nationals would leap at the chance to DL him and put him in the minors for rehab starts. It's what he needs. More time to work on being a relief pitcher.

[tomterp]

If he were hurt, I would think the Nationals would leap at the chance to DL him and put him in the minors for rehab starts. It's what he needs. More time to work on being a relief pitcher.

Just like they wasted no time DL'ing Haren last season when he stunk it up early?

[Slateman]

Just like they wasted no time DL'ing Haren last season when he stunk it up early?

Haren wasn't actually injured. Blue is maintaining that Detwiler is still suffering back issues.

[tomterp]

Haren wasn't actually injured. Blue is maintaining that Detwiler is still suffering back issues.

He sure did pitch a lot better after his rehab was over.

[Slateman]

He sure did pitch a lot better after his rehab was over.

I think we both know it was a mental break.

[tomterp]

I think we both know it was a mental break.

At the time they DL'd him it seemed like that but I seem to recall later he admitted that his injury had been an issue, though he thought he could pitch through it initially.

I'm going to stick to that position for now until Blue actually looks it up for us.

[HalfSmokes]

I think we both know it was a mental break.

he got a cortisone shot

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/nationals-journal/wp/2013/06/25/nationals-recall-tyler-moore-officially-place-dan-haren-on-disabled-list/

maybe it was just for the hell of it, but he did get some kind of treatment

[Slateman]

At the time they DL'd him it seemed like that but I seem to recall later he admitted that his injury had been an issue, though he thought he could pitch through it initially.

I'm going to stick to that position for now until Blue actually looks it up for us.

Either way, if Detwiler is hurt, he isn't serving an essential  function. Williams isn't Johnson. He's been far more willing to DL guys this season.

I see no reactions that show Detwiler in pain. I see no evidence that any injury has an effect on his ability to throw strikes. He was throwing strikes last season, with an injury. He threw strikes in Spring Training.

[nfotiu]

Then he's hurt, and needs to go on the DL. He wasn't walking a lot of batters in Spring Training. He wasn't walking this many batters last season when he was hurt.

I don't think he's hurt. I think he hates being a reliever and is pissed because the number 5 spot was his and when he's healthy, he's good. Now he's more pissed because when Gio goes down, he feels he should have gotten the spot starts. Couple that with not knowing how to prepare in the pen and you get this version of Detwiler.

If he were hurt, I would think the Nationals would leap at the chance to DL him and put him in the minors for rehab starts. It's what he needs. More time to work on being a relief pitcher.

He did suck in his spring training starts this year.  He may have not walked many but everyone hit him then and they still are now.  Maybe he is walking more because he is too afraid of getting rocked when he gets it over the plate. 

What surgery did he have and when did he have it?  Back surgery can be pretty slow to recover from, and he may have not had a chance to have much activity coming into spring training.  So maybe there is hope he'll rebound at some point.  But so far, he has been a pretty bad pitcher.

[Slateman]

He had a pinched nerve in his back. Nothing to say he had surgery on it. If he did, the healing time should be less than six weeks. Like I said, if it's still bothering him, then he needs to go on the DL. And if there is a team doctor that is telling him that a pinched nerve in the back is no big deal and can be played through, that doctor should have his/her medical license revoked.

The coaching staff seems pretty emphatic that he's not hurt. I think by now we would have heard something about it. Again, his body language isn't that of someone who is hurt. It's of someone who doesn't want to be there.

[HalfSmokes]

somehow I see this ending with him being DFA'd in another month. He probably could start for a team looking for a back end starter, but he's not going to get that chance here and he's just not good in the bullpen.

[nfotiu]

He had a pinched nerve in his back. Nothing to say he had surgery on it. If he did, the healing time should be less than six weeks. Like I said, if it's still bothering him, then he needs to go on the DL. And if there is a team doctor that is telling him that a pinched nerve in the back is no big deal and can be played through, that doctor should have his/her medical license revoked.

The coaching staff seems pretty emphatic that he's not hurt. I think by now we would have heard something about it. Again, his body language isn't that of someone who is hurt. It's of someone who doesn't want to be there.

Detwiler, 28, pitched to a 3.40 ERA in 2012, mostly as a starter. Last year, he punched up roughly the same results before he pitched through a back injury that eventually required season-ending surgery.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/nationals-journal/wp/2014/04/28/nationals-must-figure-out-ross-detwilers-role/

Having been through a microdiscectomy, which I assume is what he had.  Not a lot of details, but sounds like he had a herniated disc poking on the nerve.  It is a pretty slow recovery, where they don't want you to do much of anything for a couple months so as to not re-herniate.  And then takes some time for the nerve to completely heal.  It's not out of realm of possibility that he is feeling good now, but isn't fully ramped up yet in terms of mid season conditioning.

[Slateman]

Mid season conditioning? What? He's a reliever. He can't throw his breaking ball for strikes and his fastball isn't sinking.

If he were hurt, they would DL him. It would solve the Nationals problem because they could DL him for two to three weeks, then give him two weeks of bullpen sessions and rehab games, effectively working on his preperation in the pen. A DL stint would literally be a gift the Nationals are looking for as it would sove all their problems. The fact that they haven't put him on the DL and no one is reporting that he's getting treatment shows that he isn't hurt. He simply sucks.

[aspenbubba]

Either way, if Detwiler is hurt, he isn't serving an essential  function. Williams isn't Johnson. He's been far more willing to DL guys this season.

 

I don't think it is MW decision. It is Rizzos and his alone. He may ask what MW thinks but that is it. Rizzo constructs the roster and MW plays them how he sees fit.