Author Topic: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves  (Read 118341 times)

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Online varoadking

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1600 on: March 04, 2019, 02:55:28 pm »
FWIW, Jesse D in the Kimbrel article today (or Boz in the chat) said the Nats think they are $20mm below, not the Cot's number. They can generate more space if they renegotiate with RZ, too. There may be ways to do a deal for Kimbrel if it's closer to 3/$52.

Isn't this how they went over the cap last year...not understanding the figures?

If you sign Kimbrel for $52MM and remain on the hook for Zimmerman money...whatever that is...don't you effectively say adios to Ant'ny?


Offline Mattionals

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1601 on: March 04, 2019, 03:23:19 pm »
Isn't this how they went over the cap last year...not understanding the figures?

If you sign Kimbrel for $52MM and remain on the hook for Zimmerman money...whatever that is...don't you effectively say adios to Ant'ny?

Not sure honestly. Assume next season that Dozier walks and his spot is filled by Kieboom/Garcia at league minimum. Howie and Hellickson walk too. That means 13.8M comes off the books. I suspect Miller, Glover, and Difo are all in a make or break case on if they are considered a part of the team and may be non-tendered missing out on arbitration. Assume some raises for Joe Ross, Barraclaugh, and Trea. I think that gives about 10M MORE wiggle room than this year.

Now my question I posted earlier was if you extend Zim to adjust his AAV for this season, how does that actually work. It's not like his current contract gets voided and a new one is signed. Bluestreak (I think) suggested a 3/27M extension. That makes his complete deal a 8/110 and change. That would move the AAV to something closer to 13.7M a season instead of 16.67M a season, but what happens with the 5 years of 3+ Million in tax the Nats got hit for? Does that roughly 14.5M get "discounted" back to the Nats over the final three years of Zim's deal? Does that make Zim's tax hit more like 9M? If that were true, then the Nats would open up 7M more in space this year by adding 9M a year for Zim the next two seasons.

If I understood more about how extensions affect the tax, I could much more concisely poise a scenario in which the Nats could get close to being under the threshold AND sign Kimbrel AND extend Rendon. As of now though, my best guess is that Zim will get his 2M instead of his option being picked up, and if the Nats really get in on Kimbrel, they are above the tax this year and still have a way to extend Rendon before the end of the season and be under the threshold next year.

Offline Greg_SRT

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1602 on: March 04, 2019, 03:31:41 pm »
Wasn't comparing Papelbon "when he came here." He was declining fast his last 3-4 years year (last one in Boston, and during his stint in Philly). I hated it when the Nats acquired him. I had about as much confidence in Pap as I did in Clippard and Storen during their end-time in DC.

Papelbon was very effective in his time at Philly  :shrug:

Offline Mattionals

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1603 on: March 04, 2019, 03:56:14 pm »
Papelbon was very effective in his time at Philly  :shrug:

His first season he had great numbers. After that it was smoke and mirrors. When a reliever starts to strike out less than 9 per 9, I get scared. Groundball relievers leave too much up to the fielders when the outs needed at that point in the game should be when the pedal hits the floor.

Offline Lazarchick 31

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1604 on: March 04, 2019, 04:04:05 pm »
Adding Kimbrel would be a slam dunk. After so many years of this teams bullpen killing them, why not completely load up.

Offline UMDNats

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1605 on: March 04, 2019, 04:36:49 pm »
miller has a messed up back (shocker!), i doubt we see him opening day.

sammy solis survives again!

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1606 on: March 04, 2019, 04:47:20 pm »
miller has a messed up back (shocker!), i doubt we see him opening day.

sammy solis survives again!
do you suppose that Solis is a master of the occult and, each year, hexes any roster competion?

Offline Truconfidence

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1607 on: March 04, 2019, 05:08:48 pm »
miller has a messed up back (shocker!), i doubt we see him opening day.


sammy solis survives again!
not necessarily  Vidal Nuno has pitched well.

Offline DCFan

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1608 on: March 04, 2019, 07:07:11 pm »
Adding Kimbrel would be a slam dunk. After so many years of this teams bullpen killing them, why not completely load up.

+1. There is no such thing as too many quality relievers.

Offline Elvir Ovcina

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1609 on: March 05, 2019, 09:31:09 am »
+1. There is no such thing as too many quality relievers.

There is such thing as too many albatross contracts. 

Online varoadking

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1610 on: March 05, 2019, 03:25:34 pm »
Vidal Nuno has pitched well.

Check that...

Online imref

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1611 on: March 05, 2019, 05:21:32 pm »
Check that...

yeah, if we're counting on Vidal Nuno as a reliable LHP we are in trouble.

Offline sixthree175

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1612 on: March 05, 2019, 07:59:01 pm »
There is such thing as too many albatross contracts.
The current bullpen is not going to win the NL East.  What are the chances Kyle Barraclough has a career year, which is what is needed from him?  Beggars can't be choosers.  Waiting until the trading deadline this year will prove to be unwise.   

Offline Slateman

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1613 on: March 05, 2019, 08:29:46 pm »
The current bullpen is not going to win the NL East.  What are the chances Kyle Barraclough has a career year, which is what is needed from him?  Beggars can't be choosers.  Waiting until the trading deadline this year will prove to be unwise.   

We don't need Barraclough to have a career year. We need him to be better than last year, but he doesn't have to have a career year.

Honestly, this team's biggest "need" is to simply stay healthy through the season. The team stays healthy and they can win the division.

Offline bluestreak

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1614 on: March 05, 2019, 08:40:28 pm »
If Rosenthal is early 2017 Rosenthal and Doolittle is healthy that goes a long way.

Offline Expos

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1615 on: March 06, 2019, 10:43:09 am »
If Rosenthal is early 2017 Rosenthal and Doolittle is healthy that goes a long way.

And what are the chances both of those happen??

You're willing to bet the whole season on 2 relievers staying healthy?? I'm sure as heck not.

Offline Trea Burner

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1616 on: March 06, 2019, 11:16:43 am »
Ah the nats...always spending big money on starting pitching only to support it with a trash bullpen.

Offline Duke of Earl

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1617 on: March 06, 2019, 11:16:57 am »
  Vidal Nuno has pitched well.

Vidal Sassoon could probably pitch better.

Offline Elvir Ovcina

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1618 on: March 06, 2019, 11:22:07 am »
And what are the chances both of those happen??

You're willing to bet the whole season on 2 relievers staying healthy?? I'm sure as heck not.

I'm with you that far, but I'm still not seeing how any of this equates to "pay Craig Kimbrel 18 million dollars for the next six years." 

Offline Squab

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1619 on: March 06, 2019, 11:28:21 am »
something to keep in mind, relievers are the easiest thing to acquire at the deadline.

if we could have Kimbrel for 3 years at ~market value I'd be into it. but when the bullpen eventually becomes a problem, ol' Mike will have to do something about it.

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/free-agents/2020/relief-pitcher/

Offline nfotiu

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1620 on: March 06, 2019, 12:59:03 pm »
What are the odds of a 100 mph closer being healthy and effective when you need him most at the end of the year, let along multiple years?  It sure doesn't seem like it is better than 50%.  Every year around this time when we are fantasizing about which elite closer we should sign, it seems that more than half of them either get hurt or end up sucking that year, and I always think "good thing we didn't sign that guy".   

Offline Slateman

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1621 on: March 06, 2019, 01:00:38 pm »
What are the odds of a 100 mph closer being healthy and effective when you need him most at the end of the year, let along multiple years?  It sure doesn't seem like it is better than 50%.  Every year around this time when we are fantasizing about which elite closer we should sign, it seems that more than half of them either get hurt or end up sucking that year, and I always think "good thing we didn't sign that guy".   
Kimbrel has a steady history of being healthy. The problem is that he wants a massive deal and hes already losing velo

Offline nfotiu

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1622 on: March 06, 2019, 01:06:28 pm »
Kimbrel has a steady history of being healthy. The problem is that he wants a massive deal and hes already losing velo
I'm not a big believer in injury history being a good predictor of future health.  Chapman had a steady history of being healthy until he didn't.

Offline Expos

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1623 on: March 06, 2019, 01:48:44 pm »

So we shouldn't sign an elite closer now because he might get hurt?

Seems like a good plan...

Offline hotshot

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Re: 2018-2019 Offseason Moves
« Reply #1624 on: March 06, 2019, 01:52:14 pm »
Kimbrel and elite closer no longer belong in the same sentence. Price needs to drop  -- a lot!