Author Topic: 2018 bullpen (Read 44703 times)

GburgNatsFan · « **Reply #250 on:** May 10, 2018, 10:16:39 am »

the hypen is everything. C'mon, man.

Quote from: aspenbubba on May 10, 2018, 10:14:54 am

If you have time could you enumerate the 9 blown saves and who was responsible. I think we got rid of a few already ( Romero and Adams)but the remaining suspects should be performance-shamed.

Slateman · « **Reply #251 on:** May 10, 2018, 10:17:33 am »

Quote from: Natsinpwc on May 10, 2018, 10:11:10 am

If Solis is 98 and there are 30 teams doesn't that mean he is a number 3-4 bullpen guy on average?

Solis is a LOOGY. He's being treated like a standard reliever and he isn't.

Greg_SRT · « **Reply #252 on:** May 10, 2018, 10:17:44 am »

The pitching staff allowed 2 runs over 8 innings... The offense scored 1 over 9. Gott to realize that you don't win if you don't score.

Also over 2/3's of the league would love to have Soli's in their big league bullpen.

DPMOmaha · « **Reply #253 on:** May 10, 2018, 10:19:02 am »

The pen will get fixed, but the inability to address it in the offseason for a few years in a row is a big reason the farm system isn't as deep as it should be. It's just been a slow drain.

JCA-CrystalCity · « **Reply #254 on:** May 10, 2018, 10:41:30 am »

I'm disappointed by the results, but you have to figure out what you have in the system. most of these guys (Suero, Gott, Adams) had decent records in the minors, so you aren't going to know how they can do in the majors until we play them. Other guys (Kelley, Solis) have had some success in the majors. You could say that, going into the year, it looked like we had depth, could try guys, and hope two or three would work out to augment the 3 prime guys. This process will go on for a while, but I'm confident that in June and July, you'll see deals if there's a need. I agree with DPM that stripping the system can only go on so long.

Mattionals · « **Reply #255 on:** May 10, 2018, 11:16:57 am »

Quote from: JCA-CrystalCity on May 10, 2018, 10:41:30 am

I'm disappointed by the results, but you have to figure out what you have in the system. most of these guys (Suero, Gott, Adams) had decent records in the minors, so you aren't going to know how they can do in the majors until we play them. Other guys (Kelley, Solis) have had some success in the majors. You could say that, going into the year, it looked like we had depth, could try guys, and hope two or three would work out to augment the 3 prime guys. This process will go on for a while, but I'm confident that in June and July, you'll see deals if there's a need. I agree with DPM that stripping the system can only go on so long.

I think we are all comfortable enough with Doolittle, Madson, Kintzler, and Solis. Who knows if Kelley is actually healthy or not. Suero looks to be the best of the rest, and that doesn't mean much. Everyone else is a AAAA guy.

Stammen should totally be a target at the deadline (or before since the Padres aren't competing this season). Brad Hand would be great, but he is on an extremely team friendly deal locked up until 2020 at the earliest and will take a haul. Kelvin Herrera is also going to bring the Royals a good prospect as he is pitching great and is on an expiring deal.

I think the list of things that the team needs at the deadline completely hinges on health. It could be that only the Nats need a long man at the deadline, but that would mean that Kelley and Glover are healthy and effective. I still don't trust the catching tandem (Severino has a .375 BABIP and Wieters isn't the guy) and the starter situation still scares me, both the rotation and if they can ever get Murphy and Eaton both healthy.

dcpatti · « **Reply #256 on:** May 10, 2018, 11:51:06 am »

I think it's a safe bet that there will be a trade for a relief arm at some point, and that it will probably be someone we don't expect until the deal is close to done. Nobody had that dipcrap Papelbon on the come-to-dc radar before it happened. Nobody had Melancon, Doolittle, or Madson on their radar. Even the Howie Kendrick deal came outta nowhere, and while he's not a reliever, he was a fantastic pickup (and if Dusty had actually let him play in October, he woulda been even more fantastic) that absolutely nobody predicted.

DPMOmaha · « **Reply #257 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:00:24 pm »

Quote from: dcpatti on May 10, 2018, 11:51:06 am

I think it's a safe bet that there will be a trade for a relief arm at some point, and that it will probably be someone we don't expect until the deal is close to done. Nobody had that dipcrap Papelbon on the come-to-dc radar before it happened. Nobody had Melancon, Doolittle, or Madson on their radar. Even the Howie Kendrick deal came outta nowhere, and while he's not a reliever, he was a fantastic pickup (and if Dusty had actually let him play in October, he woulda been even more fantastic) that absolutely nobody predicted.

All those relievers were speculated before they happened. The bigger surprise was that they got BOTH Doolittle and Madson. Both were speculated individually. The bigger surprise was Kintzler since they'd already done the move with the A's.

I think they go get Herrera in June, fwiw.

Greg_SRT · « **Reply #258 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:06:45 pm »

The one that got away. I never agreed with the trade. Even at the time.

Slateman · « **Reply #259 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:18:19 pm »

Quote from: Greg_SRT on May 10, 2018, 12:06:45 pm

The one that got away. I never agreed with the trade. Even at the time.

He had a 4.53 ERA when he was traded.

DPMOmaha · « **Reply #260 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:19:27 pm »

I got it at the time. There were serious questions about whether it'd ever click for him. You could see the promise, though.

Greg_SRT · « **Reply #261 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:22:49 pm »

Quote from: Slateman on May 10, 2018, 12:18:19 pm

He had a 4.53 ERA when he was traded.

He was 24 or 25 iirc. And he had a good prior year. He seemed like he would be an above average pitcher. All signs pointed to it imo. He should have been in our future

Slateman · « **Reply #262 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:42:26 pm »

Quote from: Greg_SRT on May 10, 2018, 12:22:49 pm

He was 24 or 25 iirc. And he had a good prior year. He seemed like he would be an above average pitcher. All signs pointed to it imo. He should have been in our future

First two seasons:
Pitcher A - 3.59 ERA, 1.157   WHIP, 3.2 BB/9,   9.7 K/9
Pitcher B - 2.74 ERA, 1.299   WHIP, 3.6 BB/9, 9.2 K/9

One of these is Felipe Vazquez. The other is Sammy Solis.

Slateman · « **Reply #263 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:43:14 pm »

Quote from: DPMOmaha on May 10, 2018, 12:19:27 pm

I got it at the time. There were serious questions about whether it'd ever click for him. You could see the promise, though.

We saw the promise for Hector Rodrizguez. And Enny Romero. And Drew Storen. It wasn't happening. They needed someone for that season.

Elvir Ovcina · « **Reply #264 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:44:14 pm »

Quote from: Greg_SRT on May 10, 2018, 12:22:49 pm

He was 24 or 25 iirc. And he had a good prior year. He seemed like he would be an above average pitcher. All signs pointed to it imo. He should have been in our future

He was useless at the time and the team was in absolutely desperate need of someone who was useful then, not now. Both teams got exactly what they wanted in terms of the players in that deal.

welch · « **Reply #265 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:48:25 pm »

Quote from: Elvir Ovcina on May 10, 2018, 12:44:14 pm

He was useless at the time and the team was in absolutely desperate need of someone who was useful then, not now. Both teams got exactly what they wanted in terms of the players in that deal.

Nats probably expected a recovery by The Pitcher Formerly Known as Koda Glover.

Ray D · « **Reply #266 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:49:27 pm »

Need to be careful with our terminology. Last night was not a blown save.

DPMOmaha · « **Reply #267 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:52:24 pm »

Quote from: Slateman on May 10, 2018, 12:43:14 pm

We saw the promise for Hector Rodrizguez. And Enny Romero. And Drew Storen. It wasn't happening. They needed someone for that season.

I agree.

Ray D · « **Reply #268 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:55:54 pm »

Quote from: Slateman on May 10, 2018, 12:43:14 pm

We saw the promise for Hector Rodrizguez. And Enny Romero. And Drew Storen. It wasn't happening. They needed someone for that season.

You can't put Storen in the same category as Rodrigues and Romero. Storen clearly reached his potential, just couldn't maintain it.

varoadking · « **Reply #269 on:** May 10, 2018, 12:59:09 pm »

Quote from: Ray D on May 10, 2018, 12:49:27 pm

Need to be careful with our terminology. Last night was not a blown save.

I think we're referring to blown leads...

Quote from: Expos on May 09, 2018, 11:28:12 pm

Trevor Gott blows another one with the help of Weiters.

#9 blown lead by the pen already

Ray D · « **Reply #270 on:** May 10, 2018, 01:01:38 pm »

Quote from: varoadking on May 10, 2018, 12:59:09 pm

I think we're referring to blown leads...

He didn't blow a lead. Gio did. So it wasn't the bullpen. I'm not trying to take away any blame, Gott's job was to preserve the tie and he blew that, but let's not chalk up a blown save tot the bullpen when there wasn't one.

varoadking · « **Reply #271 on:** May 10, 2018, 01:02:32 pm »

Quote from: Ray D on May 10, 2018, 01:01:38 pm

He didn't blow a lead. Gio did. So it wasn't the bullpen.

Good point...

Would it then have been the 9th bullpen loss?

Ray D · « **Reply #272 on:** May 10, 2018, 01:54:45 pm »

Quote from: varoadking on May 10, 2018, 01:02:32 pm

Good point...

Would it then have been the 9th bullpen loss?

I don't know the number, but yes, bullpen losses is definitely a meaningful statistic.

aspenbubba · « **Reply #273 on:** May 10, 2018, 02:10:49 pm »

Quote from: Slateman on May 10, 2018, 12:43:14 pm

We saw the promise for Hector Rodrizguez. And Enny Romero. And Drew Storen. It wasn't happening. They needed someone for that season.

Absolutely

catocony · « **Reply #274 on:** May 11, 2018, 12:05:14 am »

I don't think we'll ever see Koda Glover pitch for the Nats again. For a young guy, he has a lot of old guy injuries. Hip, shoulder, all the rest - each one is a bad injury for a pitcher. Add it all up, I doubt if we'll see him again. At this point, I think Aaron Barrett is closer to coming back than Glover.

Suero has talent and I think he'll continue to improve. Torres is a warm body and will be gone as soon as either Grace comes back or they decide to go back to a 5-man bench. Gott is a spaz with a very complicated delivery. He has good raw stuff, but like Adams now and H-Rod and Romero in past seasons, high heat and lots of movement is a waste if there's no control.

The Nats are really thin on relievers throughout the system. They'll certainly trade for someone later in the season, but for now, I would increase Suarez's workload, ride Kelley like a cheap whore and kick him to curb when his arm goes out again, wait for Grace who is somewhat dependable and see if someone rises to the top from the minors.

One other thing I would do is bring Ross back in the bullpen when he finishes rehab. I don't really see him as a starter, and the way the rotation is at the moment, there's no room for another starter barring injury to someone.