Washington Redskins thread (2013)

[HalfSmokes]

i have a friend that consistently compares orakpo to demarcus ware and terrell suggs and i never really know what to say.

you can compare Blain Gabbert to Peyton Manning and Tom Brady- that doesn't mean he's in the same class they are

[spidernat]

Armstrong could actually catch. I wish Robinson were the next Anthony Armstrong.

Only if he suffers the same fate as Armstrong.

i have a friend that consistently compares orakpo to demarcus ware and terrell suggs and i never really know what to say.

He doesn't know what the freak he's talking about so you're probably better off laughing at him and not even engaging in discussion.

[madj55]

Armstrong could actually catch. I wish Robinson were the next Anthony Armstrong.

Armstrong definitely would've hauled in that bomb. However, he was a wussy ass nag who was scared to run anything but a go route. RGIII isn't the reason we lost. Yeah, he made two big mistakes, but the interception would've been avoided had there not been a holding call on a huge Alfred Morris run a couple of plays before. The fumble was just bad, but now he better slide feet first for the rest of the year. Why the freak isn't Alfred Morris getting the ball more? Makes no sense why we just abandoned the running game.

We need someone who can actually return kicks/punts. We're getting crappy ass field position every new possession.

[spidernat]

Armstrong definitely would've hauled in that bomb. However, he was a wussy ass nag who was scared to run anything but a go route.

That sounds about right.

Yeah, he made two big mistakes, but the interception would've been avoided had there not been a holding call on a huge Alfred Morris run a couple of plays before. 

  That in no way absolves Griffin from throwing the interception. They may need to come up with a new stat and call it "earned interceptions" to absolve QB's from making idiotic plays. Plain and simple it was an awful decision. Besides, what you're referring to was a 10 yard run by Morris that was brought back because of an illegal formation penalty. However, on the very next play Jordan Reed caught an 11 yard pass that moved the chains. Griffin proceeded to turn the ball over on the very next play.

[Terpfan76]

That sounds about right.

  That in no way absolves Griffin from throwing the interception. They may need to come up with a new stat and call it "earned interceptions" to absolve QB's from making idiotic plays. Plain and simple it was an awful decision. Besides, what you're referring to was a 10 yard run by Morris that was brought back because of an illegal formation penalty. However, on the very next play Jordan Reed caught an 11 yard pass that moved the chains. Griffin proceeded to turn the ball over on the very next play.

There's plenty of blame to go around and the only player that may be absolved from most if not all, is Ryan Kerrigan. He's played like one of the best in the business. We need more than just him. Griffin needs to sack up and make some crap happen. Don't talk, do. Garcon? Go out there get open and catch the damn ball. They are professional athletes paid handsomely to play a game. Do the job. Get back to what got us rolling last year, Alford Morris. If he's not getting 20+ carries, the Shanahan's aren't doing there job. As much as the team hinges on RGIII, Morris is the guy that makes things open up for Griffin as much as Griffin opens up lanes for Morris. They need to play off of each other.


More than anything, the defense needs to get it's collective head out of it's ass and play some goddam football. Can Hall play FS? It might be worth a look. I really think Rambo is out of position at FS. He comes across more as more of a SS to me. Kind of like when we had Landry playing FS when he was clearly better suited to play close to the line. Amerson has improved some but Jebus, we need some freaking tackling drills or something. When did shoulder lunges become the substitute for wrap up tackling?

[spidernat]

Morris is the real deal in my opinion but it's the threat of Griffin that helped him get to 1600+ yards last season. Now that threat is gone. No defenses respect the option so if they aren't going to run that they need to return to the stretch zone read rushing attack.

No freaking way in hell do I want to see Hall playing safety. But you may be right about Rambo.

[HalfSmokes]

Rambo went to a major program and slipped to the sixth round, he's not a diamond hidden away at multi directional State U. He was the 18th safety taken in the draft, unless every GM was totally wrong, I think it's possible that he just isn't very good

[Terpfan76]

Morris is the real deal in my opinion but it's the threat of Griffin that helped him get to 1600+ yards last season. Now that threat is gone. No defenses respect the option so if they aren't going to run that they need to return to the stretch zone read rushing attack.

No freaking way in hell do I want to see Hall playing safety. But you may be right about Rambo.

I agree on the zone stretch running game. Griffin had lanes to throw through on play action. If we could run play fakes and roll outs with rexy, we should be able to be prolific with RGIII.

I think your under selling Rambo. He's raw and got by and physical talent alone in college. I think he was drafted as a future starter but as depth for now. Phillip Thomas and Meriwether were probably to start this year. I think Rambo can be a player but he needs time to learn the position at the pro level and he needs to play SS where his physicality is better suited. Draft position isn't always indicative of talent... Alfred Morris says hi.

[HalfSmokes]

Alfred Morris went to Florida Atlantic,  not exactly the same volume as scouting as the SEC.  On another note,  remember how Shanny was drastically improving the level of talent on the roster,  what happened with that?

[spidernat]

Tom Brady was also a 6th rounder. I'm going to hold out hope on Rambo for the time being.

[Terpfan76]

Tom Brady was also a 6th rounder. I'm going to hold out hope on Rambo for the time being.

Terrell Davis? Good players can be found in any round.

[HalfSmokes]

Terrell Davis? Good players can be found in any round.

If you really think that great,  I guess having no first rounders is no big deal,  maybe they can flip the second for a few seventh rounders. 

[Terpfan76]

If you really think that great,  I guess having no first rounders is no big deal,  maybe they can flip the second for a few seventh rounders. 

Seriously??? Rambo fell because of off the field issues. Sure it be great to have first round picks but if we hadn't got griffin you'd probably by nagging because we didn't trade up to get Griffin or luck. Or we could have used that first rounder on Weeden or maybe Jake Locker a year earlier.

[Terpfan76]

And yeah, I do feel that way. Good players are found in every round otherwise why bother scouting and drafting past round 3?

[HalfSmokes]

Because the majority of early round picks succeed and the majority of late round picks fail.  Before you bash locker,  you might want to look at his numbers.  RG3 is good,  but the lack of talent on the team is starting to show- one great OLB doesn't make a defense.  As far as Rambo goes,  in a league full of guys with issues,  if a player has talent they get drafted,  the Redskins aren't the only team that doesn't care about off the field issues

[spidernat]

[Smithian]

Tom Brady was also a 6th rounder. I'm going to hold out hope on Rambo for the time being.

So was Jim Molinaro. He's young but if sucks don't be like, "He may be Tom Brady!"

[madj55]

That sounds about right.

  That in no way absolves Griffin from throwing the interception. They may need to come up with a new stat and call it "earned interceptions" to absolve QB's from making idiotic plays. Plain and simple it was an awful decision. Besides, what you're referring to was a 10 yard run by Morris that was brought back because of an illegal formation penalty. However, on the very next play Jordan Reed caught an 11 yard pass that moved the chains. Griffin proceeded to turn the ball over on the very next play.

Guess I mixed up the plays. Anyways, after reading this article: http://www.hogshaven.com/2013/9/24/4766978/what-happened-on-robert-griffin-iiis-interception-vs-detroit it isn't as bad of a decision as you think. Maybe if Pierre Garcon and RGIII quit talking to the media about the knee injury and work more together on finishing plays crap like this won't happen.

[Terpfan76]

You also need to take into consideration the ridiculous cap penalty that was levied after the draft. If you don't think the inability to sign free agents hasn't hampered the talent level off the team, I don't know what else to say. The defense is the area in most desperate need of help and hopefully, the returns of Rob Jackson and Jarvis Jenkins helps a bit. Especially Jenkins. He does a good job of generating pressure up the middle

[HalfSmokes]

You also need to take into consideration the ridiculous cap penalty that was levied after the draft. If you don't think the inability to sign free agents hasn't hampered the talent level off the team, I don't know what else to say. The defense is the area in most desperate need of help and hopefully, the returns of Rob Jackson and Jarvis Jenkins helps a bit. Especially Jenkins. He does a good job of generating pressure up the middle

the cap penalty was the direct result of moving contracts forward - they were told not to and they did it anyway- maybe they were banking on the union standing (has the NFLPA ever taken a stand?) with them, but it didn't work out. If they didn't move the contracts forward they would have had an enormous cap hit. I blame their drafting (and lack thereof) more than the cap hit- great defenses may have free agents, but they have a lot of home grown talent. McNabb/Jamal Brown likely cost them at least one productive starter and RGIII has probably cost them multiple productive starters - I'm not saying that means he wasn't worth it (that's a separate conversation), but to both support the trade and wonder why they have a  dearth of young talent is ridiculous.

[Terpfan76]

the cap penalty was the direct result of moving contracts forward - they were told not to and they did it anyway- maybe they were banking on the union standing (has the NFLPA ever taken a stand?) with them, but it didn't work out. If they didn't move the contracts forward they would have had an enormous cap hit. I blame their drafting (and lack thereof) more than the cap hit- great defenses may have free agents, but they have a lot of home grown talent. McNabb/Jamal Brown likely cost them at least one productive starter and RGIII has probably cost them multiple productive starters - I'm not saying that means he wasn't worth it (that's a separate conversation), but to both support the trade and wonder why they have a  dearth of young talent is ridiculous.

Come on, the penalty was ridiculous. Stay under the non-existing cap... WTF?? Either way, I'm not wondering why we have a "dearth" of talent although I find that to be a bit strong. Our secondary has been mismanaged for years. The front seven I don't really have an issue with, especially when Jenkins comes back. The secondary though... Sure, the draft picks could have been used there, and assuming they were used there, our defense would probably be a lot better, if the picks panned out. Where would we be at QB though?

I believe that if the offense continues to improve and it should, it couldn't get too much worse (I hope), that should ease some pressure off of the defense. We know they are bad, but they are even worse when they are forced to remain on the field too long.

[Slateman]

the cap penalty was the direct result of moving contracts forward - they were told not to and they did it anyway- maybe they were banking on the union standing (has the NFLPA ever taken a stand?) with them, but it didn't work out. If they didn't move the contracts forward they would have had an enormous cap hit. I blame their drafting (and lack thereof) more than the cap hit- great defenses may have free agents, but they have a lot of home grown talent. McNabb/Jamal Brown likely cost them at least one productive starter and RGIII has probably cost them multiple productive starters - I'm not saying that means he wasn't worth it (that's a separate conversation), but to both support the trade and wonder why they have a  dearth of young talent is ridiculous.

That's known as collusion.  But Danny didn't want to bite the hands that feed him. Stupid.

[HalfSmokes]

Come on, the penalty was ridiculous. Stay under the non-existing cap... WTF?? Either way, I'm not wondering why we have a "dearth" of talent although I find that to be a bit strong. Our secondary has been mismanaged for years. The front seven I don't really have an issue with, especially when Jenkins comes back. The secondary though... Sure, the draft picks could have been used there, and assuming they were used there, our defense would probably be a lot better, if the picks panned out. Where would we be at QB though?

I believe that if the offense continues to improve and it should, it couldn't get too much worse (I hope), that should ease some pressure off of the defense. We know they are bad, but they are even worse when they are forced to remain on the field too long.

We have good OLBs and a decent to good front three. The entire secondary is terrible, Fletcher looks done, and as much as I like Riley, I don't think he's anything special. As far as the cap penalty, the only way they were winning that one was going to be to sue the NFL (very doubtful) or if the NFLPA made a stand (again, has that ever happened?)- they were warned and gambled that nothing would happen, they were wrong. As far as the picks, isn't shannahan supposedly a great judge of QB talent, he thought there was none in the draft when he passed on Kapernick and went with Beck, and he thought he needed to move up for Griffen (Wilson was available without moving and everyone knew he would have been available). Shannahan either panicked when he traded for Griffen or he gambled that he was a good enough at drafting to assemble talent around him in order to be competitive.

[HalfSmokes]

That's known as collusion.  But Danny didn't want to bite the hands that feed him. Stupid.

the NFLPA had standing to do something about it, they chose to not make it an issue. If it was the MLBPA, things might have been very different

[Terpfan76]

Who is truly sold on Kapernick? Not only that, but when he was drafted, he was a project and evidently, Shanahan didn't want to draft a project qb.  As for Wilson, he's looked good, very good but again, he was drafted in the 3rd and we all know that lower round picks aren't as likely to succeed as first rounders?? Right??

For what it's worth, I think Kapernick could become a very good qb, he has the tools, but I just don't know that he will. Luck, Wilson and Griffin are far more polished at playing qb than Kapernick. It's a toss up though who has the stronger arm, Griffin or Kapernick. I think one of Kapernick's biggest issues is putting touch on the ball. Seems like every throw he makes is a damn laser beam. Maybe that is soft tossing for him