Author Topic: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?  (Read 1418 times)

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Offline Ali the Baseball Cat

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #50: January 22, 2024, 12:37:39 AM »
Langerhans, wow.  I think we traded that Snelling bloke (half the Vidro return from Seattle) for Langerhans before sending him to Seattle for Morse.  It's like fricking Milo Minderbender's egg racket in Catch 22

 

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #51: January 22, 2024, 07:13:32 AM »
The hell is AA?
Atlanta GM.  Alex A…

Offline Smithian

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #52: January 22, 2024, 09:57:12 AM »
Denard Span was a stud for the Nationals. His 2014 season was great, and I felt like the analytics hated his defense unfairly.

Nick Johnson born five years later is probably a multiple time All Star.

I don't think we appreciated what we had in Tanner Roark. Just a good, competent pitcher in the mid-rotation.

Online JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #53: January 22, 2024, 10:23:21 AM »
The hell is AA?
I was thinking Alex Anthopolous, but he was not with Seattle so I'm wrong. Looking it up, it was Jack Zduriencik. Story goes that a deal for Langerhans was suggested in a chat or some other fan forum, and he made the deal within a week.

Another quick google dug up a defense of the deal from the Mariners perspective. Via Lookout Landing, the precursor the Fangraphs, I think:
https://www.lookoutlanding.com/2011/7/29/2304038/ryan-langerhans-mike-morse-reflections

Quote
As we've said a million times, a front office can only operate with the knowledge it has at the time of a move. When Morse was traded for Langerhans, the Mariners were in the AL West running, but they were down a speedy left-handed outfielder after Endy Chavez got obliterated by our shortstop. The team had a need, and Langerhans fit as a guy who could get on base and play all three positions.

To get Langerhans, the Mariners gave up a guy who wasn't highly thought of at the time. Morse was a poor defensive 27-year-old infielder in triple-A hitting for a high average. He wasn't much in the field, he didn't walk, and his power was limited, meaning his value was mostly tied up in singles and doubles. That wasn't much of a package. Morse had his supporters, but it did not look like he had a Major League future - at least not as a starter. It was easy to see him as a pinch-hitter or something.

And then, in 2010, Morse kicked it up. To illustrate what happened, here are Morse's PA per home run (combined) in triple-A and the Majors:

2007-2009: 36.0
2010-2011: 20.1

Morse was always projectable. He was always toolsy. Morse is a big dude, and big dudes are expected to be able to hit the ball a long way. In isolation, it is not surprising that Mike Morse is a decent power hitter now with the Nationals.

Online JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #54: January 22, 2024, 10:38:20 AM »
It's actually kind of fun to look back at the first period of lousy Nats for the desperate sort of reshuffling the deck chairs kind of deals Bowden and early Rizzo did. Perpetual motion of swapping filler for filler with the hope of coming up with a gem. Langerhans had been acquired for Chris Snelling in 2007 (as pointed out up thread), who turned into Michael Morse. The Guzman deal turned into Tanner Roark. Blake Treinen was another deal. Really, through about 2015, the deals built much of the complementary players beyond Stras, Harper, and Rendon.

Offline GataNats

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #55: January 22, 2024, 10:10:22 PM »
Atlanta GM.  Alex A…

We are supposed to know some obscure GM by his initials?

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #56: January 23, 2024, 07:10:01 AM »
We are supposed to know some obscure GM by his initials?
He’s one of the top GMs in baseball.  So.  Yes. 

Online JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #57: January 23, 2024, 07:23:47 AM »
We are supposed to know some obscure GM by his initials?
it's kind of a popular nickname/ reference on blogs and tv, but yes, he has had nothing to do with Seattle, so I can see the confusion.

Offline captkirk42

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #58: January 23, 2024, 10:43:32 AM »
Michael Morse
Loved him. My greatest memory was that "invisible" home run. One of the all time best moments in Nats history.

Offline imref

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #59: January 23, 2024, 12:55:39 PM »
i still think that 2012 team was the best one we had. Morse deserves a ring. :)

Online JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #60: January 23, 2024, 01:48:19 PM »
i still think that 2012 team was the best one we had. Morse deserves a ring. :)
2014.

Offline GataNats

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #61: January 23, 2024, 10:22:24 PM »
He’s one of the top GMs in baseball.  So.  Yes.

I’ve never heard of him.  Certainly wouldn’t know who he is by his initials with no context

Offline sixthree175

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #62: January 24, 2024, 04:59:03 AM »
Denard Span was a stud for the Nationals. His 2014 season was great, and I felt like the anal..

Nick Johnson born five years later is probably a multiple time All Star.

I don't think we appreciated what we had in Tanner Roark..

God NO, on all three.
Remember how Span exited the scene?  It was a sham.  And his arm was noodle like.
Nick Johnson collapsed each and every year, sometimes in April, sometimes in May, and occasionally in June.
Tanner Roark was useless in the post season

I agree with previous comments --- Doug Foster [sic] comes to mind.  Always in Max's shadow




Offline IanRubbish

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #63: January 24, 2024, 11:04:25 PM »
Gio

Offline LightningMcQueen

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #64: January 30, 2024, 07:11:40 AM »
It’s Tyler Clippard. Hard to find that consistency for so long who was not a closer (excluding those 32 saves in 2012). Guy made it to the All-Star game 2x

Online JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #65: January 30, 2024, 10:22:31 AM »
It’s Tyler Clippard. Hard to find that consistency for so long who was not a closer (excluding those 32 saves in 2012). Guy made it to the All-Star game 2x
good one. I do wish he had gotten a longer run his last season (22?)

Offline GburgNatsFan

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #66: January 30, 2024, 02:32:15 PM »
I like this one.

It’s Tyler Clippard. Hard to find that consistency for so long who was not a closer (excluding those 32 saves in 2012). Guy made it to the All-Star game 2x

Offline Ali the Baseball Cat

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #67: January 30, 2024, 05:53:43 PM »
Esteban Loaiza...a 3.77 ERA in 34 starts and 20 kilos of blow

Offline OfftheBat

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #68: January 31, 2024, 10:35:04 AM »
Esteban Loaiza...a 3.77 ERA in 34 starts and 20 kilos of blow

Lol I had to google what you meant, that's pretty funny that an ex Mlb ALL STAR would stoop so low.

Offline PowerBoater69

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #69: January 31, 2024, 11:08:46 AM »
Lol I had to google what you meant, that's pretty funny that an ex Mlb ALL STAR would stoop so low.

Under Bowden the Nats had a real rogues gallery. Actual criminals like Dukes and Young, Livan had some interesting issues (Google those), a few others who had some mixed histories with their prior clubs.

Offline PowerBoater69

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #70: January 31, 2024, 11:13:38 AM »
Guzman wasn't the most underrated, but he deserves a mention. After three rough years with injuries he had an All-Star season in his walk year, got a new contract and had another decent season where he was an All-Star vote in candidate. Then got us Tanner Roark back in trade. Most underrated part of his game were his throws to first playing deep at short, seemed effortless. Now guys take a hop and a skip.

Online JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #71: January 31, 2024, 11:57:37 AM »
Guzman wasn't the most underrated, but he deserves a mention. After three rough years with injuries he had an All-Star season in his walk year, got a new contract and had another decent season where he was an All-Star vote in candidate. Then got us Tanner Roark back in trade. Most underrated part of his game were his throws to first playing deep at short, seemed effortless. Now guys take a hop and a skip.
biggest contribution from the guy was what he brought back in trade

Offline PowerBoater69

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Re: The Most Underated Nat of All Time?
« Reply #72: January 31, 2024, 12:25:12 PM »
biggest contribution from the guy was what he brought back in trade

4.6 bWAR in 2008, pretty nice season. Not great stats for his full time here, largely due to injuries, but when healthy he played well.