Rizzo and Davey Canned

[IanRubbish]

Can't you just create a query for our AI overlords?

"society for the suppression of man-eating fish" (oops, wrong thread)

Google search for "how many games did the Washington Nationals throw fewer pitches than their opponent in 2025" returned

"6 games
In the 2025 season, the Washington Nationals threw fewer pitches than their opponent in a total of 6 games. This statistic reflects their performance throughout the season, indicating a consistent trend in their pitching efficiency."
Baseball-Reference.com

Nats P/IP was 17.17.  29th in MLB, and just 0.05 lower than the A's.  Ol' man Hickey didn't care much for the "analytics stuff". 

[blue911]

Nats P/IP was 17.17.  29th in MLB, and just 0.05 lower than the A's.  Ol' man Hickey didn't care much for the "analytics stuff".

Didn’t care much for development stuff either. I truly thought Hickey was going to bring the Nats into the 21st century. Coles I’ve always hated almost as much as Jim Presley.

[Slateman]

Nats P/IP was 17.17.  29th in MLB, and just 0.05 lower than the A's.  Ol' man Hickey didn't care much for the "analytics stuff". 

Its not analytics. Its simply a measure of the capability of the pitching staff to throw strikes. And it doesnt necessarily correlate to anything.

The Cardinals had the 4th fewest P/IP but were 21st in ERA. The Dodgers were 21st in P/IP but were 16th in ERA. Cleveland and Milwakee, both hyper analytically driven, were simply middle of the pack in this P/IP.

[tomterp]

Its not analytics. Its simply a measure of the capability of the pitching staff to throw strikes. And it doesnt necessarily correlate to anything.

The Cardinals had the 4th fewest P/IP but were 21st in ERA. The Dodgers were 21st in P/IP but were 16th in ERA. Cleveland and Milwakee, both hyper analytically driven, were simply middle of the pack in this P/IP.

Ability of the staff to throw strikes doesn't correlate to anything? 

[blue911]

Ability of the staff to throw strikes doesn't correlate to anything?

No. The number of pitches per inning doesn’t prove whether a team is analytically driven.

[tomterp]

No. The number of pitches per inning doesn’t prove whether a team is analytically driven.

Ok, that's one subset from the world of "anything".

How about pitchers having to get pulled early because they're tired?  Does not number of pitches correlate with tired pitchers? 

[Natsinpwc]

Our pitchers were bad which means more batters and that also equates to more pitches.  And the best starter we had tended to have high pitch counts. The other guys are nibblers out of necessity. 

[Slateman]

Ability of the staff to throw strikes doesn't correlate to anything? 

"I dont care how fast you throw ball 4" is now analytics?

Again, if P/IP were truly important from an analytics standpoint, the Brewers and Guardians would always be in the top 5

[Natsinpwc]

Ok, that's one subset from the world of "anything".

How about pitchers having to get pulled early because they're tired?  Does not number of pitches correlate with tired pitchers?

Our starters don’t throw hard enough to be tired. 

[imref]

Our starters don’t throw hard enough to be tired. 

used to be that # of innings pitched by starters was a strong correlating stat with wins, not sure if that's still the case.

[tomterp]

Our starters don’t throw hard enough to be tired. 

 

[PowerBoater69]

The Baseball America podcast reviews the Nats farm system. Good chat, but nothing particularly news worthy for people already following the team. They do repeatedly reference how bad the Nats drafts have been since 2012, it made me wonder if extending Rizzo post WS was more damaging to the team than extending Strasburg.

https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/nationals-2026-top-mlb-prospects-deep-dive/

[imref]

The Baseball America podcast reviews the Nats farm system. Good chat, but nothing particularly news worthy for people already following the team. They do repeatedly reference how bad the Nats drafts have been since 2012, it made me wonder if extending Rizzo post WS was more damaging to the team than extending Strasburg.

https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/nationals-2026-top-mlb-prospects-deep-dive/

Given most of our Top-30 arrived since Rizzo was canned, I think that says a lot about his drafting/scouting abilities.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

The Baseball America podcast reviews the Nats farm system. Good chat, but nothing particularly news worthy for people already following the team. They do repeatedly reference how bad the Nats drafts have been since 2012, it made me wonder if extending Rizzo post WS was more damaging to the team than extending Strasburg.

https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/nationals-2026-top-mlb-prospects-deep-dive/

Probably the time for a new direction was when the 20teens team had run its course, after 2021, but you can understand Rizzo pitching the ownership on "I've built this team once, I can do it again." It probably would  have been better for his reputation, too.  Reminds me a bit of Dombrowski and the Red Sox. He was fired for Chaim Bloom one year after winning the World Series in large part because he had left the farm bare and had over-committed dollars to a flawed lineup. Mind you, this was when they still had Mookie, Bogaerts, Devers, Sale, etc... Dombo sat a year then has done OK for himself and his reputation in Philly, while Bloom rebuilt the minors under strict budgets by dealing or letting walk all the talent from the 2018 team.

[nobleisthyname]

it made me wonder if extending Rizzo post WS was more damaging to the team than extending Strasburg.

Undoubtedly, any team can carry one albatross contract. Large markets like DC can afford multiple even. Even with Stras' $35M on the books this team is nowhere near the luxury tax.