Who Wants To Win

[IanRubbish]

Pretty clear that this team won't even be competitive in 2025 either...

It won't.  They're tryng to do what the Orioles did by building from within but don't have anywhere near the talent to do so.  Disgraceful that Mini Me tries to run this team like it plays in a tiny market.  He's such a pathetic little d-bag.

[HalfSmokes]

Sales are down.

Ticket sales are down, they’re milking those who do show up. Assuming they have any sophistication behind their pricing, they are getting every dime they can out of those willing to go

[Smithian]

Captive audience. If the sales were down they would lower the prices. 

I don't think this is totally accurate.

For the first time in years (2012 season?), they're actively working to recruit people with discounted tickets and other added benefits, like the concerts.

My guess is they're makin their budget right now on corporate ticket holders and sponsors, which is why they don't want to lower prices. But they're certainly giving cheaper ways in, unlike previous years.

[Slateman]

Ticket sales are down, they’re milking those who do show up. Assuming they have any sophistication behind their pricing, they are getting every dime they can out of those willing to go

Concessions have always been pricey at the park though. Like, the Nats have always been one of the most expensive.

Too many douchebag Beltway Bandits who show up with jersery over their collared shirt and can afford to drop $15 for a "premium" beer.

[Elvir Ovcina]

Concessions have always been pricey at the park though. Like, the Nats have always been one of the most expensive.

Too many douchebag Beltway Bandits who show up with jersery over their collared shirt and can afford to drop $15 for a "premium" beer.

Don't forget the khakis and loafers with that.

[imref]

Concessions have always been pricey at the park though. Like, the Nats have always been one of the most expensive.

Too many douchebag Beltway Bandits who show up with jersery over their collared shirt and can afford to drop $15 for a "premium" beer.

FWIW, the $15 beer at Nats park is about two beers in volume. They also have much cheaper beer before the games behind the scoreboard.

[Senatorswin]

Ticket sales are up this year. In 2023 attendance per game was 23,034. So far in 2024 it's 25,376.

[Slateman]

Ticket sales are up this year. In 2023 attendance per game was 23,034. So far in 2024 it's 25,376.

Thats down from the 2012-2019 range.

[IanRubbish]

Ticket sales are up this year. In 2023 attendance per game was 23,034. So far in 2024 it's 25,376.

Probably have a lot more concerts after games next year as well. 

[Senatorswin]

Thats down from the 2012-2019 range.

Well yeah but that's more than understandable. They had the second best record in baseball those years. There must be hope among the fans though because the attendance trend is up this year.

[IanRubbish]

Well yeah but that's more than understandable. They had the second best record in baseball those years. There must be hope among the fans though because the attendance trend is up this year.

Still 32 home dates left.  Unless they have Carly Rae Jepsen, Green Day, or R2D2 at the park during or after each game, don't see the 25,000 average holding up.

[Mattionals]

Still 32 home dates left.  Unless they have Carly Rae Jepsen, Green Day, or R2D2 at the park during or after each game, don't see the 25,000 average holding up.

Serious question. Is Carly Rae Jepson still popular? I can understand Green Day being popular with us Millennials who are trying to recapture our youth. Star Wars seemingly always finds a way to be popular.

[IanRubbish]

Serious question. Is Carly Rae Jepson still popular? I can understand Green Day being popular with us Millennials who are trying to recapture our youth. Star Wars seemingly always finds a way to be popular.

Very good question, I always thought she was a one hit wonder, but attendance the night of her post-game show was something like 38k, much better than it was for James Wood's debut. 

[imref]

The Harry Potter Jersey game on the 3rd should be a big draw. Friday is Radford night so that always brings in a decent crowd.

We're looking at going on the 11th for the football jersey. 

[OfftheBat]

Stras 24, Max 15, Corbin 10.   Max gets 15 a year through 2027, Stras gets 24 through 2026, then 27+ interest from 2027 to 2029.

Brad Hand and Rafael Soriano fall off this year.

The deferrals come directly out of team cash flow, so they absolutely impact the ability to spend next year.  They're also not "money in the pocket" when their intent is to prevent negative cash flows, as was likely the case ten years ago.  Wasn't like the team had the money in the bank, it just prevented them from having to borrow.   Additionally, both Strasburg contracts had interest payments included, meaning they had to add back interest for paying 1/3rd of his salary after the contract ended, so even if they did invest it all the investment gains would go back to deferral payments.

Deferrals aren't a historic item either.  Brad Hand has over 60% of his contract deferred before the '21 season.   One reason why they were able to get Riley Adams for him was the Nats picking up all of Hand's deferrals.  Without that, no chance the Blue Jays make the trade.

Every large contract they've ever done has had deferrals, Werth's came during the contract, but the reason they rushed to tank and salary dump in mid '21 was they knew a large bill was coming, and they'd have to take years off of competing in order to cover the payments.   

Boras really knew how to work the old man when it came to these things, I get really concerned about what he could do to Mini Me if the team actually tries to spend.  Another $100 million for deferrals just to bring in Pete Alonso or Tyler O'Neill would just be another guarantee of more tank years, and they've already tanked half the seasons they've owned the team.

I work in corporate finance, and can assure you no sensible business would do this.  Shareholders would scream at the huge liability cutting into company value.  Moreover, it requires spending cash without offsetting revenue.  No one's going to Nats Park now to see Max, so there's no business benefit to the cash spent on him now, or over the next three years.  But the Lerners have questionable ethics and are running a family business as cheaply as they can, and don't have to answer to shareholders.

So in your opinion, what is the solution to this sh.... show?

Not getting any FA's will diminish fan interest... but getting one solid FA will guarantee more tank years as you put it, which will also diminish fan interest.

Sometimes I think MLB should have salary caps like they do in the NHL. Tired of seeing the Dodgers & Yankees be the only competitive teams year after year.

[imref]

a salary floor would be even better.

[IanRubbish]

So in your opinion, what is the solution to this sh.... show?

Not getting any FA's will diminish fan interest... but getting one solid FA will guarantee more tank years as you put it, which will also diminish fan interest.

Sometimes I think MLB should have salary caps like they do in the NHL. Tired of seeing the Dodgers & Yankees be the only competitive teams year after year.

Would love a salary floor and cap as well, but they're not going to happen.  At this point, they have to sign an FA bat or two, and do it without deferrals so that we don't start burdening the 2030s.  Also, the GM, manager, hitting coach, and pitching coach all need to go.  Even the small market Royals fired their WS-winning GM after a series of losing seasons.  You don't go through 5 losing seasons in a row and hold no one accountable, but that's what they're doing.  I doubt the firings will happen, and if they let Doolittle go because he's getting too expensive, then they're going in reverse in terms of coaching.

They've also got to ditch the small ball strategy, it's not working.  It was almost comical watching last night's game.  Call and Wood get up there being very selective and working the count while everyone else was having 1-2 pitch ABs making the pitcher's life easy.  Add in that they have a huge lead in terms of most caught stealings while also being 30th in HRs, the whole setup is a shambles that has to be nuked. 

[OfftheBat]

Would love a salary floor and cap as well, but they're not going to happen.  At this point, they have to sign an FA bat or two, and do it without deferrals so that we don't start burdening the 2030s.  Also, the GM, manager, hitting coach, and pitching coach all need to go.  Even the small market Royals fired their WS-winning GM after a series of losing seasons.  You don't go through 5 losing seasons in a row and hold no one accountable, but that's what they're doing.  I doubt the firings will happen, and if they let Doolittle go because he's getting too expensive, then they're going in reverse in terms of coaching.

They've also got to ditch the small ball strategy, it's not working.  It was almost comical watching last night's game.  Call and Wood get up there being very selective and working the count while everyone else was having 1-2 pitch ABs making the pitcher's life easy.  Add in that they have a huge lead in terms of most caught stealings while also being 30th in HRs, the whole setup is a shambles that has to be nuked.

Hopefully they do sign some solid FA's this Winter... If not, looks like we'll be the new White Sox. Also, I'd be curious to see the Nats' annual financial statements of the past few years, post-Covid, not sure if they are available for the public.

[Ali the Baseball Cat]

There is one: 26x740k=$19,240,000

a salary floor would be even better.

[Senatorswin]

They've also got to ditch the small ball strategy, it's not working. 

They have to play the talent they have though. They don't have power, but they do have speed.

[IanRubbish]

They have to play the talent they have though. They don't have power, but they do have speed.

That's true, but they've also got the highest caught stealings in the league by far.  SB percentage has been falling and is down to 74%, was 81% last year.  And they do need new talent to deal with the 30th in the league barrel rate, HR rate, and just about any other stat that reflects power. 

The issue with Coles is how much is he making it worse for Wood, who didn't walk for two weeks, Call, or other players who aren't free swinging slap hitters like much of the lineup. 

[JCA-CrystalCity]

The issue with Coles is how much is he making it worse for Wood, who didn't walk for two weeks, Call, or other players who aren't free swinging slap hitters like much of the lineup. 

A while back Blue911 suggested that Daniel Murphy might be a good add as an assistant hitting coach to complement Coles. I would like to see that if Coles is still around. Or see if we can hire Howie Kendrick from the Phillies. That was a guy who could hit, not so much for power but very productive for his career.

[jaycat]

Probably have a lot more concerts after games next year as well.

How about concerts instead of the games?

[imref]

How about concerts instead of the games?

green day was there last weekend.

[nfotiu]

Stras 24, Max 15, Corbin 10.   Max gets 15 a year through 2027, Stras gets 24 through 2026, then 27+ interest from 2027 to 2029.

Brad Hand and Rafael Soriano fall off this year.

The deferrals come directly out of team cash flow, so they absolutely impact the ability to spend next year.  They're also not "money in the pocket" when their intent is to prevent negative cash flows, as was likely the case ten years ago.  Wasn't like the team had the money in the bank, it just prevented them from having to borrow.   Additionally, both Strasburg contracts had interest payments included, meaning they had to add back interest for paying 1/3rd of his salary after the contract ended, so even if they did invest it all the investment gains would go back to deferral payments.

Deferrals aren't a historic item either.  Brad Hand has over 60% of his contract deferred before the '21 season.   One reason why they were able to get Riley Adams for him was the Nats picking up all of Hand's deferrals.  Without that, no chance the Blue Jays make the trade.

Every large contract they've ever done has had deferrals, Werth's came during the contract, but the reason they rushed to tank and salary dump in mid '21 was they knew a large bill was coming, and they'd have to take years off of competing in order to cover the payments.   

Boras really knew how to work the old man when it came to these things, I get really concerned about what he could do to Mini Me if the team actually tries to spend.  Another $100 million for deferrals just to bring in Pete Alonso or Tyler O'Neill would just be another guarantee of more tank years, and they've already tanked half the seasons they've owned the team.

I work in corporate finance, and can assure you no sensible business would do this.  Shareholders would scream at the huge liability cutting into company value.  Moreover, it requires spending cash without offsetting revenue.  No one's going to Nats Park now to see Max, so there's no business benefit to the cash spent on him now, or over the next three years.  But the Lerners have questionable ethics and are running a family business as cheaply as they can, and don't have to answer to shareholders.   

After the Ohtani contract was announced, they said that the CBA requires the team to put the present value of the amount owed into an escrow account during the service year it is earned.   The deferred money should have no impact at all on current cash flows.