Author Topic: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024  (Read 557 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline imref

  • Posts: 43670
  • Re-contending in 202...5?
Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Topic Start: November 20, 2023, 01:56:53 PM »
It's out:

First timers:
Adrian Beltré, Joe Mauer, Chase Utley, David Wright, Bartolo Colon, Adrián González, Matt Holliday, José Reyes, José Bautista, Victor Martinez, James Shields and Brandon Phillips.

Returners:


Player
Last year vote percentage
Year on ballot

Todd Helton
72.2
6th

Billy Wagner
68.1
9th

Andruw Jones
58.1
7th

Gary Sheffield
55
10th

Carlos Beltrán
46.5
2nd

Alex Rodríguez
35.7
3rd

Manny Ramírez
33.2
8th

Omar Vizquel
19.5
7th

Andy Pettitte
17
6th

Bobby Abreu
15.4
5th

Jimmy Rollins
12.9
3rd

Mark Buehrle
10.8
4th

Francisco Rodríguez
10.8
2nd

Torii Hunter
6.9
4th

Offline welch

  • Posts: 16748
  • The Sweetest Right Handed Swing in 1950s Baseball
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #1: November 20, 2023, 04:01:16 PM »
None of them. Not before Cecil Travis.

Offline imref

  • Posts: 43670
  • Re-contending in 202...5?
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #2: November 20, 2023, 04:51:07 PM »
Beltre is a lock

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 40866
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #3: November 20, 2023, 05:32:37 PM »
wagner, helton, beltre.  Jones continues progress. Mauer will be strong 1st timer but short, and Holliday will be in the low 20s.

Offline HalfSmokes

  • Posts: 21653
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #4: November 21, 2023, 01:27:30 PM »
Mauer is such a what could have been. There was a brief period of time when he was so much better than every other catcher that he was almost a guaranteed fantasy win. I think Beltre should get in and that's it from the whole list.

Offline blue911

  • Posts: 18491
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #5: November 21, 2023, 01:36:05 PM »
Mauer is such a what could have been. There was a brief period of time when he was so much better than every other catcher that he was almost a guaranteed fantasy win. I think Beltre should get in and that's it from the whole list.

I think Yadi gets in before Mauer.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 40866
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #6: November 21, 2023, 05:17:45 PM »
I think Yadi gets in before Mauer.
Mauer had a better case before he moved to first. I wonder if voters will forget his peak.

Offline blue911

  • Posts: 18491
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #7: November 21, 2023, 05:42:20 PM »
Mauer had a better case before he moved to first. I wonder if voters will forget his peak.

Koufax is the yardstick I would use in Mauer’s case.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 40866
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #8: December 04, 2023, 02:57:32 PM »
Jim Leyland elected by the contemporary period non-player committee. Pinella just missed with 11 votes, with 12 needed. Dave Johnson got fewer than 5 of the 16 votes.

https://www.mlb.com/news/hall-of-fame-contemporary-era-ballot-2023


Offline imref

  • Posts: 43670
  • Re-contending in 202...5?
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #9: December 04, 2023, 03:07:18 PM »
Jim Leyland elected by the contemporary period non-player committee. Pinella just missed with 11 votes, with 12 needed. Dave Johnson got fewer than 5 of the 16 votes.

https://www.mlb.com/news/hall-of-fame-contemporary-era-ballot-2023

the late 80's Mets issues keep dooming Davey.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 40866
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #10: January 23, 2024, 08:59:50 PM »
Beltre, Helton, and Mauer elected. Wagner misses by 5 votes (73.8%). Sheffield, Andruw Jones, and Beltran between 64% and 57%. A-Rod and Manny around 1/3. Utley debuts at 28.8%. This was Sheffield's last time on the ballot.

Offline HalfSmokes

  • Posts: 21653
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #11: January 23, 2024, 09:17:46 PM »
I like that we’re pretending there no power hitters in the 90s

Offline imref

  • Posts: 43670
  • Re-contending in 202...5?
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #12: January 23, 2024, 10:50:07 PM »
Wagner should have gotten in.

Offline OfftheBat

  • Posts: 163
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #13: January 24, 2024, 08:46:35 AM »
I don't think Helton should've got in, if you look at his road numbers, you'll see what I mean. His home stats are inflated by Coors Field.

Congrats to Beltre and Mauer though  ;)

Offline OfftheBat

  • Posts: 163
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #14: January 24, 2024, 08:47:55 AM »
Wagner should have gotten in.

I think his playoff stats are what's hurting his chances. I think he has a 10+ ERA in his career in the playoffs.

Offline nobleisthyname

  • Posts: 2938
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #15: January 24, 2024, 02:03:38 PM »
I don't think Helton should've got in, if you look at his road numbers, you'll see what I mean. His home stats are inflated by Coors Field.

Congrats to Beltre and Mauer though  ;)

Helton's away stats are better than Beltre's career stats. Excellent defender too. He's a first baseman so he's expected to be a better hitter but I think his home/away splits are overblown considering how good he was on the road still.

Offline imref

  • Posts: 43670
  • Re-contending in 202...5?
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #16: January 25, 2024, 12:17:49 AM »
Next year’s class is stacked. Ichiro should be another unanimous pick.

Offline OfftheBat

  • Posts: 163
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #17: January 25, 2024, 11:50:30 AM »
Helton's away stats are better than Beltre's career stats. Excellent defender too. He's a first baseman so he's expected to be a better hitter but I think his home/away splits are overblown considering how good he was on the road still.

I disagree, Beltre has a BA of .286 in 12,130 plate appearances, meanwhile Helton's away stats = BA of .287 in 4,612 PA's. Plus, Beltre had an average of 3.99 WAR per season while Helton's was only 3.24 (including home games). Beltre played 5 more years than Helton in total and didn't have Coors "help" him.

Offline nobleisthyname

  • Posts: 2938
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #18: January 25, 2024, 12:53:14 PM »
I disagree, Beltre has a BA of .286 in 12,130 plate appearances, meanwhile Helton's away stats = BA of .287 in 4,612 PA's. Plus, Beltre had an average of 3.99 WAR per season while Helton's was only 3.24 (including home games). Beltre played 5 more years than Helton in total and didn't have Coors "help" him.

I don't mean to argue that Helton was better than Beltre, he definitely wasn't, but that's more praise for Beltre than criticism of Helton.

But Helton still put up an .833 OPS on the road across his full career. He's a member of the .300/.400/.500 club, played elite defense, and has more career walks than strikeouts (a personal favorite metric for me). I believe he was deserving of a HOF nod.

Offline imref

  • Posts: 43670
  • Re-contending in 202...5?
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #19: January 25, 2024, 01:54:00 PM »
Helton absolutely deserved election.  If you look at https://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/jaws_1B.shtml he's 15th in the JAWS ranking among 1B. The only players ahead of him not in the Hall are either not yet eligible (Pujols, Votto, Miggy) or have PED issues (Palmeiro). In the rest of the top 20 (16-20) there are two HOF'rs, one not yet eligible, and Mark McGwire.

Even with the Coors effect, he's statistically the 2nd best defensive 1B of all time (behind only Keith Hernandez (and the second spitter??)).

Offline blue911

  • Posts: 18491
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #20: January 25, 2024, 02:09:46 PM »
There were a plethora of really good/great first basemen from 1990 - 2010 and Helton ranked among the best.

Offline imref

  • Posts: 43670
  • Re-contending in 202...5?
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #21: January 25, 2024, 02:17:34 PM »
There were a plethora of really good/great first basemen from 1990 - 2010 and Helton ranked among the best.
Looking at his stats, from 2000-2004 only Bonds was a better hitter.

Offline OfftheBat

  • Posts: 163
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #22: January 26, 2024, 11:56:59 AM »
I don't mean to argue that Helton was better than Beltre, he definitely wasn't, but that's more praise for Beltre than criticism of Helton.

But Helton still put up an .833 OPS on the road across his full career. He's a member of the .300/.400/.500 club, played elite defense, and has more career walks than strikeouts (a personal favorite metric for me). I believe he was deserving of a HOF nod.

I see, however, still, IMO his road numbers make him a stretch for the HOF.

Offline Lintyfresh85

  • Posts: 35131
  • World Champions!!!
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #23: January 26, 2024, 03:34:06 PM »
Sheffield got boned. Not only did you have to put up good stats... you had to kiss the media's butt to make it, apparently

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 40866
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: Hall of Fame Ballot: 2024
« Reply #24: January 26, 2024, 05:46:48 PM »
Sheffield got boned. Not only did you have to put up good stats... you had to kiss the media's butt to make it, apparently
maybe they can just put his bat-waggle in the Hall on a video loop. Maybe the most intimidating stance ever.