Auditions for the infield

[aspenbubba]

Only one out of the 3 I’m not going to complain about is Dom.  He is really good defensively, and the team leader at OBP

Well that is where we don't agree. Last time I looked Smiths RISP average was .179. I've been on his case virtually all season. He is only good defensively and as JCA once wrote Meneses defense plays better than Josh Bell. Play Meneses with Ruiz DH'ing and let Adams catch.

[Natsinpwc]

I mean how the freak is Vargas starting?

To make you drink more.

Have a good vacation.

[welch]

Kieboom starts tonight. We will see if he has learned to field or to hit.

[GataNats]

Everyday Vargas.  This is ridiculous now

[catocony]

Vargas is starting because Davey is trying to win baseball games. 

[GataNats]

Vargas is starting because Davey is trying to win baseball games.

Winning baseball games has nothing to do with Vargas.  He’s an awful hitter with no power who never gets on base.   Average fielder at best.  No speed

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Everyday Vargas.  This is ridiculous now

If Alu or Kieboom can't play better than Vargas, then they probably aren't solids in the long term plan. They have to earn it by hitting and fielding when given a chance to play, first when they have the platoon advantage, then when given a chance to hit against same-handed pitchers. Garrett did it, now he's full-time.

[Slateman]

If Alu or Kieboom can't play better than Vargas, then they probably aren't solids in the long term plan. They have to earn it by hitting and fielding when given a chance to play, first when they have the platoon advantage, then when given a chance to hit against same-handed pitchers. Garrett did it, now he's full-time.

How do we know if they can if Vargas keeps playing?

The only reason Garrett finally got to play was because Dickerson was so bad, no one traded for him.

Vargas is hitting .236/.272/.368. He's literally worse than Dickerson. He's done nothing to earn this much starting time.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

How do we know if they can if Vargas keeps playing?

they are getting playing time, just against same handed pitchers. It's Chavis that lost playing time.

[GataNats]

How do we know if they can if Vargas keeps playing?

The only reason Garrett finally got to play was because Dickerson was so bad, no one traded for him.

Vargas is hitting .236/.272/.368. He's literally worse than Dickerson. He's done nothing to earn this much starting time.

.272 OBP.  Not sure I remember a “regular” Nat with a stat worse

[imref]

.272 OBP.  Not sure I remember a “regular” Nat with a stat worse

Danny Espinosa 2013: .193 OBP

Cristian Guzman's first year here (2005) was pretty awful too: .219 / .260 / .314

[ChiliPalmer14]

I say play the prospects.  Due diligence to finding out who might be part of the future.  I think Vargas and a few others are clearly not.  W/L doesn't matter, so do something that does. 

[imref]

Kolko noted that Kieboom will be a regular going forward

[JCA-CrystalCity]

.272 OBP.  Not sure I remember a “regular” Nat with a stat worse

take a look at his BABIP. He's making contact. It's just not dropping. Still, it's hard to see an OBP over .300 even with a BABIP of .279 like last year. He's not playing because of his bat. TBH. he was doing better off the bench this year. I can see giving him a bit of rope the past week or two, but he's hanging himself.

If it weren't for the wins and the D, it'd be a done decision.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Kolko noted that Kieboom will be a regular going forward

well, if Kieboom really is every day at 3rd, then Vargas is basically taking Chavis's reps at 2nd. I'm good with that until Alu pushes for more time.

[imref]

Vargas had a great game tonight

[welch]

Vargas can field. Could Kieboom have made the play on that last out of the game yesterday? I don't know about now, but he never in the past. So we will see,

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Vargas can field. Could Kieboom have made the play on that last out of the game yesterday? I don't know about now, but he never in the past. So we will see,

Vargas really has played very good D at 3rd. I'm not sure he's anything special at 2nd, and he's not a good shortstop.

Kieboom made a few plays last night and had a nice overall game. I'm giving Kieboom a clean slate to show himself. He was arguably rushed without a lot of reps at 3rd his second call up (don't forget the disaster in 2019 when Turner was hurt at the start of the year), and I won't hold the injury years against him. It's good for a prospect to struggle a bit and adjust. He's older and healthier now, so I am giving him a chance.

All that said, I do like the defensive substitution late and with a lead. Davey's done it a lot this year.  I like to see Alu at 2nd and Vargas at 3rd to finish games.

[imref]

Vargas really has played very good D at 3rd. I'm not sure he's anything special at 2nd, and he's not a good shortstop.

Kieboom made a few plays last night and had a nice overall game. I'm giving Kieboom a clean slate to show himself. He was arguably rushed without a lot of reps at 3rd his second call up (don't forget the disaster in 2019 when Turner was hurt at the start of the year), and I won't hold the injury years against him. It's good for a prospect to struggle a bit and adjust. He's older and healthier now, so I am giving him a chance.

All that said, I do like the defensive substitution late and with a lead. Davey's done it a lot this year.  I like to see Alu at 2nd and Vargas at 3rd to finish games.

Davey did seem to think for a bit about pinch running for Adams late, which would have moved Ruiz to the C position and forced a pitcher to hit for himself the rest of the way. That's a risky move with a one-run lead and i'm glad he didn't make it.

[GataNats]

Kieboom out of the lineup.   This is just stupid now

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Kieboom out of the lineup.   This is just stupid now

Eh, it's just a platoon right now between Alu and Kieboom with your man shifting between 3d and 2d depending on who is in. I do think they'll break the platoon sometime and give Kieboom some chances against righties at some point, just not his second game.

[Slateman]

Eh, it's just a platoon right now between Alu and Kieboom with your man shifting between 3d and 2d depending on who is in. I do think they'll break the platoon sometime and give Kieboom some chances against righties at some point, just not his second game.

No more platoons. If all Kieboom can do is hit lefties, theres no reason to waste a 40 man roster spot on him. Play him like he's an everyday player. Find out what position(s) he can play.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

No more platoons. If all Kieboom can do is hit lefties, theres no reason to waste a 40 man roster spot on him. Play him like he's an everyday player. Find out what position(s) he can play.

come back to me in 2 weeks. If it's after Labor Day and they are still doing this, then I'm with you (and  Gata). Until then, I'm OK with giving Kieboom his first success in the majors before force feeding him to righties.

[Slateman]

come back to me in 2 weeks. If it's after Labor Day and they are still doing this, then I'm with you (and  Gata). Until then, I'm OK with giving Kieboom his first success in the majors before force feeding him to righties.

We don't need 2 weeks to know what Vargas is. We have two years. Dump this clown and move on. The rest of this season is about setting up for a WC run in 2024 and division domination in the decade after that. Vargas is  vet backup. Sit his dumb ass on the bench and find out what you have.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

We don't need 2 weeks to know what Vargas is. We have two years. Dump this clown and move on. The rest of this season is about setting up for a WC run in 2024 and division domination in the decade after that. Vargas is  vet backup. Sit his dumb ass on the bench and find out what you have.

it's not about figuring out if Vargas is a regular. As you say, we know he's a veteran backup. it is about putting Kieboom and Alu in a position for success and it's about whether the pitchers benefit from better D. On both of those, Vargas is OK playing for a few more weeks.