Nats lock up Ruiz

[imref]

Sure, I don't really disagree with anything you're saying here (though I'm not convinced this contract is small enough that the Nats will be comfortable reducing his role, we shall see).

But the bigger issue is just how awful the Scherzer/Turner trade was. Hindsight is 20/20 and prospects bust as a general rule, but the Nats basically got absolutely nothing for half a year of Scherzer and 1.5 years of Turner. This team would be looking a lot more solid if even just one of either Ruiz or Gray had worked out (let alone the throw-ins of Casey and Carrillo).

Gray was a 3.1 WAR player and an all-star in 2023. The injury derailed him.

[nobleisthyname]

Gray was a 3.1 WAR player and an all-star in 2023. The injury derailed him.

He had good results in 2023, but all of his underlying metrics are ugly.

[IanRubbish]

But the bigger issue is just how awful the Scherzer/Turner trade was. Hindsight is 20/20 and prospects bust as a general rule, but the Nats basically got absolutely nothing for half a year of Scherzer and 1.5 years of Turner. This team would be looking a lot more solid if even just one of either Ruiz or Gray had worked out (let alone the throw-ins of Casey and Carrillo).

Agree but remember this was a salary dump.  While Rizzo absolutely struggles to assess talent properly, the haul in that trade was cut back by having the Dodgers take one of Max's $15 million deferral payments.

[rileyn]

If he doesn't hit one today, Ruiz will have gone 2 calendar months without hitting a HR.  He hits cleanup most of the time  LOL

[JCA-CrystalCity]

If he doesn't hit one today, Ruiz will have gone 2 calendar months without hitting a HR.  He hits cleanup most of the time  LOL

In a decent lineup, he's a 6-7-9 hitter. He does make contact and doesn't K, so that's valuable if there's runners on. He'd be better #3 than #4, moving along Wood and Abrams. Downside is he's a double play candidate, so he's much better of in the bottom half of the order.

At this point, with Bell on a bit of a streak, Bell s/b ##3/4/5. I'd give him a run at #4, behind Lowe or Garcia. Drop Ruiz to #7, behind Hassell. Davey's not there yet. Maybe he doesn't want  to put pressure on Bell or Hassell.

[Smithian]

Ruiz should be batting bottom 3. I understand he earned middle lineup early, but that’s been two months. Drop
Him!

[welch]

Should bat 7th. Hassell looks like a number 6. Tena and Lile seem right at 8th and 9th.

And Ruiz is adequate catching. Not an All Star, but he is tough, seems to call a good game. Snags throws and gets the tag on runners. He hits, although he's not Yogi Berra. Good enough.

[IanRubbish]

Should bat 7th. Hassell looks like a number 6. Tena and Lile seem right at 8th and 9th.

And Ruiz is adequate catching. Not an All Star, but he is tough, seems to call a good game. Snags throws and gets the tag on runners. He hits, although he's not Yogi Berra. Good enough.

He's one of the worst defensive catchers in the game.  Pop time, arm strength, one of the absolute worst at blocking, and framing.   He also is a pitcher's dream with his wave-at-every-pitch approach at the plate.  That said, I don't think his ISO is going to stay at .083.  The HR drought will end at some point.

[imref]

saw a post on Reddit highlighting just how bad he's been since mid-April, heading for another negative WAR season and his defensive metrics continue to be the worst the league. Unfortunately no other good options in the system right now.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

He's bad, but for at least a season, there's ways to avoid exposing his badness and taking advantage of some skills. For example, the guys makes contact. It's weak, but it's not ks. Hitting him behind Hassell might give him rbi opportunities

[Smithian]

I think the org really likes Ruiz behind the scenes and I fully accept some catching duties can't be quantified by stats, but it's rough.

Riley Adams barely plays but fact is he hasn't recorded a hit in weeks.

This team is a hot 10 day stretch from being in place for crawling into Wild Card. It's really time to look around for a veteran backstop who can OPS closer to .600 and then .500. That type of player isn't hard to find. Bring them in and have them split ABs with Ruiz.

[SkinsNatFan21RIP]

The Dodgers really took Rizz to the cleaners on that deal. How you walk away with only Ruiz and Gray for Turner and Scherzer is beyond me?

[nobleisthyname]

The Dodgers really took Rizz to the cleaners on that deal. How you walk away with only Ruiz and Gray for Turner and Scherzer is beyond me?

1.5 years of Turner at that.

[Smithian]

The Dodgers really took Rizz to the cleaners on that deal. How you walk away with only Ruiz and Gray for Turner and Scherzer is beyond me?

I think Josiah Gray in 2023 showed the Nats excitement about him. Then he got hurts. It happens. Keibert Ruiz should have been better than this. It's been bad. Injuries haven't helped.

I think we have to look at that trade as a quick infusion of talent and clearing a lot of payroll for a reload. The problem is the reload never happened, or a contending team with Gray at the back of the rotation and Ruiz as a backup catcher makes that trade make more sense.

[Slateman]

I know we blame a lot on Coles, but I genuinely wonder how much of this is on him.  Ruiz is underperformed his expected stats. He underperformed them the in 2023.

First thing that they need to do is get him an eye exam. Then make him a backup for a month, and get him in the cage with the advanced pitching machines. He has to stop swinging at EVERYTHING.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

I know we blame a lot on Coles, but I genuinely wonder how much of this is on him.  Ruiz is underperformed his expected stats. He underperformed them the in 2023.

First thing that they need to do is get him an eye exam. Then make him a backup for a month, and get him in the cage with the advanced pitching machines. He has to stop swinging at EVERYTHING.

this is offseason work. At this point, you have to try to optimize him.

You wonder how often he's been told, "you can be patient for the first strike or two because you can make contact with any close pitch so you won't k."

[imref]

The Dodgers really took Rizz to the cleaners on that deal. How you walk away with only Ruiz and Gray for Turner and Scherzer is beyond me?

Sometimes players don't work out. It happens. At the time Ruiz and Gray were the Dodgers' #1 and #2 prospects and both were well-regarded. We also got Donovan Casey, who was already on LA's 40 man, and their 17th ranked prospect in Carrillo.

It's rare, especially with Rizzo, that all these guys would flop (though Gray was at least an all-star once).

I went back and looked at some analysis of the trade from the time it happened. Ben Clemens said we received "kingly ransom" for Max and Trea (https://blogs.fangraphs.com/dodgers-swing-blockbuster-acquire-scherzer-and-turner/)

Longenhagen was positive on the return for the Nats as well (https://blogs.fangraphs.com/scouting-the-nationals-return-for-max-scherzer-and-trea-turner/)

A few folks noted that Max, at 37, and with a full no-trade clause, limited our options given he was a short-term rental.

[Slateman]

this is offseason work. At this point, you have to try to optimize him.

You wonder how often he's been told, "you can be patient for the first strike or two because you can make contact with any close pitch so you won't k."

Can't wait that long. Start it now. We're punting the season anyway.

[IanRubbish]

this is offseason work. At this point, you have to try to optimize him.

You wonder how often he's been told, "you can be patient for the first strike or two because you can make contact with any close pitch so you won't k."

He is who he is and they're going to play the contract.  Might have a couple winning seasons in the late 20s when it all comes together, but he'll still be there getting stolen on, having pitches bounce past him, and making opposing pitchers' lives very easy.

[rileyn]

I've been out on Ruiz.  Making limp contact just for the sake of not striking out, should not be applauded.  It's been time to cut bait on him, but I know ownership will not go that direction.  I cannot imagine why they don't give him more rest.  Maybe, just maybe, he would show much needed improvement at the plate and behind the plate. 

[aspenbubba]

I don’t believe I have posted in this thread previously. Ruiz needs to play less and the FO needs to acquire a starting catcher next season as their top priority either  by FA  or trade. He will be a very expensive back up as
no team will take the remainder of his contract. This contract may be one of the reasons that the FO will not pursue Abrams or Wood with extensions this year or next.

[Slateman]

I think someone would take him. I think someone with a competent hitting program would be able to fix him.

[Natsinpwc]

I think someone would take him. I think someone with a competent hitting program would be able to fix him.

I don’t know.  Most teams want a competent defensive catcher.  He would have to hit a lot to make up for the defense.

[Slateman]

I don’t know.  Most teams want a competent defensive catcher.  He would have to hit a lot to make up for the defense.

Will he? Framing is going to be a nonfactor within a season or two. Stolen bases seem largely irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Catchers don't really call games anymore. So how important is blocking?

There is some talent there. I dont think 2023 was a fluke or luck. I just don't think we have the coaching staff and development to unlock it.

[Natsinpwc]

Will he? Framing is going to be a nonfactor within a season or two. Stolen bases seem largely irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Catchers don't really call games anymore. So how important is blocking?

There is some talent there. I dont think 2023 was a fluke or luck. I just don't think we have the coaching staff and development to unlock it.

He is what he is at this point in time.