Author Topic: Break up the Juggernaut: 2022 Trade Deadline thoughts, & rumors  (Read 5567 times)

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Offline Section214

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Bring back Trea!  Your 2023 Nats:

1. Turner SS
2. Garcia 2B
3. Soto RF
4. Bell 1B
5. Cruz or Yadi DH
6. Ruiz C
7. Kieboom 3B
8. PTBNL LF
9. Robles CF

Rotation: Cavalli, Henry, Gray, Fedde, Espino

Bullpen: Corbin, Strasburg, Finnegan, Rainey, arm, arm, arm

Print playoff tickets :couch:

Lineup looks like a championship lineup to me, except absolutely not Cruz.

Rotation: Cavalli, Gray, Fedde, Free Agent Free Agent -- (Adon, Mitchell Parker, Cole Henry and Dustin Saenz all fighting to get up)

Bullpen: Corbin, Strasburg, Finnegan, Rainey, Cronin, Perez, Bryzkcy, arm, arm.

Pennant Chasing!

Offline Slateman

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I'd be happy. Looking at this year's team, I've been thinking that they need to spend on a good SS so Garcia moves to 2b, a LF, and a dependable starter. It's time for Cavalli.

That would be a .500 team, one that had a chance to win each game, one worth watching.
Would rather spend the money on Turner and Musgrove

Offline Kevrock

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  • That’s gonna be a no from me, doge.
Curious how folks would feel if the Nats announced an extension for Josh Bell for 4 years, $80 million this afternoon and said they are committed to starting 2023 with Juan Soto in the Nats line up.

Sort of an "f this, we are committed to a better product and, if the team is sold, it'll be to somebody committed to the same."

We'd go into next year with a catcher, a first baseman, and a rightfielder of pretty high quality already lined up.  Probably a second baseman (Garcia), DH (Yadi / Thomas), and a strong defensive CF (Robles) on board, and looking at 3 positions to fill (3B, LF, and SS). 

As for the pitching staff, still deal Edwards, Cishek, and Finnegan, but see what you have in Cavalli and hope that Cavalli, Gray, and Fedde are the start of a rotation, to which you can add a veteran who gives you 150+ innings of major league average performance and maybe a return of Espino or some other pieces at the back end (or perhaps spend a little on a better pitcher and move a few of these guys down the pecking order).  Use the rest of the year with Corbin in the pen, along with Arano, try Cronin and a few of the fringe roster relievers to see if there's something buried in the Weems / Thompson / Abott etc....  Maybe give Clip and Harris a shot too when healthy, figuring Clip and Doo will sign back if they have anything left.

I'd feel better if Henry were healthy and given an audition, too, but there's a small part of me that thinks that is less of an embarrassing floor than it's made out to be.

Fine with it. Part of the issue with where we're at is that we took the entire off-season off. Nats said they were resetting to compete in 2023-2024. Then they did nothing for a full offseason! There were short-term pieces that could have been added. I got frustrated and basically said we're screwed and we won't compete while Soto is on contract and he'll walk. Now here we are, the worst team in baseball and potentially trading him.

So, it might not be the BEST approach but it's an approach. For the past year, we've been saying one thing and doing nothing. DO SOMETHING RIZZO  :panic: :panic: :panic:

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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yes, I was sort of astounded by the flat-footedness of last offseason.  The team really had only 4 positions with young players who could be regulars above A-level or GCL going into the off-season - C, CF, an MI slot, and 3rd base - and had an obvious shortage of starting pitching innings.  I could see giving a platoon of Yadi and Thomas a shot at DH or LF too.  Still, that means there's probably a need to play for a SS, a LF, and maybe have a backup quality 2d / 3rd baseman.  I thought Hernandez was the latter, but with so many shortstops, a longish term plug in would have really helped.  A stronger 3rd baseman if you don't want to have to trust Kieboom (who you could push to 2nd base and have him compete with Garcia). There were plenty of innings eaters, too. Not to play for any of that was disastrous.  It even ruined the attractiveness of the team going forward.

Offline Slateman

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yes, I was sort of astounded by the flat-footedness of last offseason.  The team really had only 4 positions with young players who could be regulars above A-level or GCL going into the off-season - C, CF, an MI slot, and 3rd base - and had an obvious shortage of starting pitching innings.  I could see giving a platoon of Yadi and Thomas a shot at DH or LF too.  Still, that means there's probably a need to play for a SS, a LF, and maybe have a backup quality 2d / 3rd baseman.  I thought Hernandez was the latter, but with so many shortstops, a longish term plug in would have really helped.  A stronger 3rd baseman if you don't want to have to trust Kieboom (who you could push to 2nd base and have him compete with Garcia). There were plenty of innings eaters, too. Not to play for any of that was disastrous.  It even ruined the attractiveness of the team going forward.
Pretty obvious that payroll was reduced to assist with the sale.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Pretty obvious that payroll was reduced to assist with the sale.
in hindsight, obvious.  At the time, darn galling, and bad faith to talk about a reload or reboot when we were idle, not even rebuilding.

Offline Mattionals

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in hindsight, obvious.  At the time, darn galling, and bad faith to talk about a reload or reboot when we were idle, not even rebuilding.


I wonder if the current FO was aware of the sale or not. Given how current ownership is handling this sale, Soto, and so many other things surrounding the team, I wonder if the FO was just as floored when it was revealed that ownership was moving to sell. One of the most obvious issues plaguing the franchise has been internal communication, or at least that is what it seems from the outside looking in.

Offline Slateman

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in hindsight, obvious.  At the time, darn galling, and bad faith to talk about a reload or reboot when we were idle, not even rebuilding.
Eh, I can see limiting payroll as part of a reboot. Legit, who from last year's free agent class do you want on the payroll in 2023 or 2024? Seager, sure. Maybe Schwarber? Maybe Rodriguez?


Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Eh, I can see limiting payroll as part of a reboot. Legit, who from last year's free agent class do you want on the payroll in 2023 or 2024? Seager, sure. Maybe Schwarber? Maybe Rodriguez?
Almost any one of the shortstops given House not being sure to stick there and having an ETA of 2026.  I mean, we could have been burned, but Semien or perhaps someone else takes a 3-5 year deal, or you do Correa with an opt out.  Bryant had such position flexibility to cover 3rd, LF, CF, even 1st if Bell doesn't stick around.  Could have gone cheap and gone for Duvall.  I'm deliberately picking several guys who are arguably disappointments because I don't want to be said to be cherry picking in hindsight. Canha would have been terrific for this team, too. Go longer term on one position, go with 1-2 year patches at others (you know by now my attitude about corner free agents). That's for the positions.  As for the pitchers, the depth of the class wasn't great, but there were of course several that would have been nice fits.

Offline Slateman

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Semien wanted a big deal and its pretty obvious he wasnt going to age well. Correa wanted to go to someone who could contend. Bryant was far more expensive than he was worth.

Pretty sure Duvall wanted to go back to Atlanta. And we have a younger, cheaper version in Thomas.

Canha is 33. He will be bad by this time next season, much less two or three years from now.

There simply wasnt anyone that would come here without a massive overpay. No thanks. Take the 100 loss seasons and save your bullets for free agents that can help when it matters in 2024

Offline Kevrock

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Eh, I can see limiting payroll as part of a reboot. Legit, who from last year's free agent class do you want on the payroll in 2023 or 2024? Seager, sure. Maybe Schwarber? Maybe Rodriguez?



KLONG

Offline Five Banners

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Bring back Trea!  Your 2023 Nats:

1. Turner SS
2. Garcia 2B
3. Soto RF
4. Bell 1B
5. Cruz or Yadi DH
6. Ruiz C
7. Kieboom 3B
8. PTBNL LF
9. Robles CF

Rotation: Cavalli, Henry, Gray, Fedde, Espino

Bullpen: Corbin, Strasburg, Finnegan, Rainey, arm, arm, arm


If that included a Soto extension, could actually be willing to renew

Offline UMDNats

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Fine with it. Part of the issue with where we're at is that we took the entire off-season off. Nats said they were resetting to compete in 2023-2024. Then they did nothing for a full offseason! There were short-term pieces that could have been added. I got frustrated and basically said we're screwed and we won't compete while Soto is on contract and he'll walk. Now here we are, the worst team in baseball and potentially trading him.

So, it might not be the BEST approach but it's an approach. For the past year, we've been saying one thing and doing nothing. DO SOMETHING RIZZO  :panic: :panic: :panic:


Offline hotshot

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Pretty obvious that payroll was reduced to assist with the sale.
Do you think Steve Cohen cared at all about what the Mets payroll was when he bought the team?

Losing interest in buying -- unless the team has a low payroll --  should speak volumes about such a prospective owner or ownership group.  And, not in a good way (at least for the fans)!

Offline Five Banners

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Do you think Steve Cohen cared at all about what the Mets payroll was when he bought the team?

Losing interest in buying -- unless the team has a low payroll --  should speak volumes about such a prospective owner or ownership group.  And, not in a good way (at least for the fans)!

Been concerned about the same thing

Offline welch

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Do you think Steve Cohen cared at all about what the Mets payroll was when he bought the team?

Losing interest in buying -- unless the team has a low payroll --  should speak volumes about such a prospective owner or ownership group.  And, not in a good way (at least for the fans)!

We suffered as the Griffith family found it could not compete with wealthy owners in the '50s. It got worse with the expansion team. Let Washingtonians never never have such owners again!

Offline English Natsie

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Wouldn't it be funny if we've all been led down the garden path, and our 2022 Nationals end up making no trades before the deadline.... :hysterical:

Offline welch

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Wouldn't it be funny if we've all been led down the garden path, and our 2022 Nationals end up making no trades before the deadline.... :hysterical:

It could happen. Maybe Bell signs an extension and the team decides to keep Soto in hopes of signing him in November, when new ownership takes over. Nobody would want any of the other position players. Maybe a couple of the relievers go, but that's about all.   

Offline English Natsie

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'Nationals News' sounding rather 'thanks and goodbye, Josh' this morning... ;)

Offline Smithian

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Yadiel Hernandez is so cheap he has to have some value as a backup corner OF. Or is he more valuable to the Nats bringing him back and filling a DH/LF spot next season while we look for long term options?

Offline Slateman

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Yadiel Hernandez is so cheap he has to have some value as a backup corner OF. Or is he more valuable to the Nats bringing him back and filling a DH/LF spot next season while we look for long term options?
He's more valuable in trade. Honestly, I would rather the Nats give guys like Joey Menses and Jake Noll MLB time than keep Yadi.

Offline Natsinpwc

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Is Dylan Carlson really any better than Lane Thomas? I guess Gorman has some power but the MLB pitchers seem to have found a hole in his swing.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/c/carlsdy01.shtml

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=gorman000nol


Offline Smithian

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Is Dylan Carlson really any better than Lane Thomas? I guess Gorman has some power but the MLB pitchers seem to have found a hole in his swing.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/c/carlsdy01.shtml

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=gorman000nol


Headed toward another 2+ WAR season. He can’t be the key part of a package, but he is a good piece of a larger package. You know you’ll get something out of him while hoping other players pop.

Offline Elvir Ovcina

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Is Dylan Carlson really any better than Lane Thomas? I guess Gorman has some power but the MLB pitchers seem to have found a hole in his swing.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/c/carlsdy01.shtml

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=gorman000nol

Is that a serious question?  Carlson was third in the ROY voting last year, is doing it again this year, and is 23, so he's still got significant scope for improvement.  Thomas is a worse player who's almost 27 - there's not really any projection left there.

Gorman has less than 200 career MLB at bats.  Way too soon to make judgments there, but I'm not seeing a .750 OPS as a "hole in swing."  He's walking and hitting for power, either of which would be happening if he was trying to cover a hole.  He strikes out a lot because he's a 2020s hitter - he swings too hard while selling out for power.  But he's a productive 2020s hitter.

Headed toward another 2+ WAR season. He can’t be the key part of a package, but he is a good piece of a larger package. You know you’ll get something out of him while hoping other players pop.

Which one can't?  One's 23 and the other's 22, and they're already both better-than-average everyday MLB position players and both have positional flexibility.

I mean, I hate the Cardinals more than the average dude, but those guys are both legit. 

Offline Slateman

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Is Dylan Carlson really any better than Lane Thomas?

Lol, wat

I was unaware that Lane Thomas had a season and a half of over 110 wRC+ while playing good defense in CF.

Y'all overate Lane Thomas so much. He's a 4th OFer/platoon bat until he gets good at CF.