Author Topic: NCAA Basketball 2021-22  (Read 1525 times)

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Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #100: March 18, 2022, 06:34:11 PM »
if they can get past VT. :)
Cmon you knew better than to think the Chokies would win.

Offline imref

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #101: March 19, 2022, 02:59:28 PM »
Baylor goes down to UNC in OT after coming back from a 25 point deficit. Hell of a game. 

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #102: March 19, 2022, 11:43:53 PM »
So who had St Peters in the Sweet Sixteen?

St Peters made it to final four in 1968. NIT that is.

Offline imref

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #103: March 20, 2022, 12:39:57 AM »
Tis an odd tournament.

Offline GburgNatsFan

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #104: March 21, 2022, 02:00:21 PM »
UMD hires Kevin Willard. :thumbs:

Offline UMDNats

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #105: March 21, 2022, 02:17:33 PM »
UMD hires Kevin Willard. :thumbs:

Solid hire. Sounds like he's staffing up really well too. He's unquestionably a better coach than Turgeon, just needs to get better talent than he got at Seton Hall. Man Turgeon was the freaking worst.

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #106: March 21, 2022, 02:35:12 PM »
Solid hire. Sounds like he's staffing up really well too. He's unquestionably a better coach than Turgeon, just needs to get better talent than he got at Seton Hall. Man Turgeon was the freaking worst.

Between Turg and Randy, MD athletics really just shot themselves in the face.

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #107: March 21, 2022, 02:35:49 PM »
Solid hire. Sounds like he's staffing up really well too. He's unquestionably a better coach than Turgeon, just needs to get better talent than he got at Seton Hall. Man Turgeon was the freaking worst.
He has been at Seton Hall for a while. Any reason a bigger program did not scoop him up earlier?  Turgeon is the lowest of low bars. The Kieboom of coaching.

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #108: March 21, 2022, 02:37:35 PM »
Tis an odd tournament.
Seems fairly normal to me. One 15 seed.  A 10 seed and an 11 seed. Think you can make a case for almost everyone other than St Peters having soemthing of a shot at the final four.

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #109: March 21, 2022, 02:45:33 PM »
He has been at Seton Hall for a while. Any reason a bigger program did not scoop him up earlier? Turgeon is the lowest of low bars. The Kieboom of coaching.

Is there any reason they would? Mid major coaches who accomplish something seem like hotter prospects than coaches in major conferences whose teams are kind of ok most years. On the plus side, his teams make the tournament. On the minus side, they suck once they get there.

Offline UMDNats

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #110: March 21, 2022, 02:53:10 PM »
He has been at Seton Hall for a while. Any reason a bigger program did not scoop him up earlier?  Turgeon is the lowest of low bars. The Kieboom of coaching.

He turned down VT last year FWIW.

Coach stealing from P6 schools is rare in CBB these days. Tough to do. A lot of schools would rather take a gamble on a mid major guy than someone like Willard, plus Willard already made $2.5mm at Seton Hall and how many schools are paying more than that? He'll make $4 mill at MD and it's a top 10-15 contract for a CBB coach and like 7-8 of those guys being paid that much are elite coaches, plus Willard is a NE guy and there's only so many jobs on the East Coast that would work well for him, MD being one of them.

Offline UMDNats

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #111: March 21, 2022, 02:58:49 PM »
Is there any reason they would? Mid major coaches who accomplish something seem like hotter prospects than coaches in major conferences whose teams are kind of ok most years. On the plus side, his teams make the tournament. On the minus side, they suck once they get there.

He at least won a Big East conference tourney, while someone like Turge had a top 5 finish most years but would lose immediately because he sucked so much. There's a great chart that a MD fan made of Willard's W/Ls vs. KenPom top 50 teams and Turge's and Williard has like 2x the number of games and a ton more wins. He's beaten more good teams at Seton Hall than Turge ever did at MD, with less talent to boot. I think time will tell if he can get over the hump but there's something to be said for a coach who's proven he can coach up guys but has never broken through; eventually you get the right mix and just...do it. Purdue and Painter is a good example right now.

What people fail to understand is that it wasn't Mark Turgeon's lack of a deep run that pissed off MD fans. That was part of it, but everyone understands that losses in March can be fluky. It was that he never beat good teams, especially on the road, and he never showed any passion for winning. He publicly complained when College Gameday came to CP. He stopped recruiting for 3 years. He never made runs in the Big Ten tournament, and every year his teams got worse in March. The problem was that there was never any hope he could coach up a team to a run. Everyone knew it by 2020 - even though that team was great, it still choked away a 3-game lead for a Big Ten title on the final stretch. We all knew we weren't winning the big ten title. We all knew Izzo, Painter, Gard would coach circles around him. It was the lack of any hope that killed him.

Getting away from a certified loser as head coach and getting someone who actually enjoys the game of basketball (Turge said he never watched other games) is a massive upgrade for just the energy of the program. Kansas Mark in his last 2 years did 0 recruiting, 0 in-game coaching (asst. Matt Brady did that) and was basically just cashing checks to go to his beach house. Having someone who actually gives a freak is so refreshing.

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #112: March 21, 2022, 03:10:15 PM »
He at least won a Big East conference tourney, while someone like Turge had a top 5 finish most years but would lose immediately because he sucked so much. There's a great chart that a MD fan made of Willard's W/Ls vs. KenPom top 50 teams and Turge's and Williard has like 2x the number of games and a ton more wins. He's beaten more good teams at Seton Hall than Turge ever did at MD, with less talent to boot. I think time will tell if he can get over the hump but there's something to be said for a coach who's proven he can coach up guys but has never broken through; eventually you get the right mix and just...do it. Purdue and Painter is a good example right now.

What people fail to understand is that it wasn't Mark Turgeon's lack of a deep run that pissed off MD fans. That was part of it, but everyone understands that losses in March can be fluky. It was that he never beat good teams, especially on the road, and he never showed any passion for winning. He publicly complained when College Gameday came to CP. He stopped recruiting for 3 years. He never made runs in the Big Ten tournament, and every year his teams got worse in March. The problem was that there was never any hope he could coach up a team to a run. Everyone knew it by 2020 - even though that team was great, it still choked away a 3-game lead for a Big Ten title on the final stretch. We all knew we weren't winning the big ten title. We all knew Izzo, Painter, Gard would coach circles around him. It was the lack of any hope that killed him.

Getting away from a certified loser as head coach and getting someone who actually enjoys the game of basketball (Turge said he never watched other games) is a massive upgrade for just the energy of the program. Kansas Mark in his last 2 years did 0 recruiting, 0 in-game coaching (asst. Matt Brady did that) and was basically just cashing checks to go to his beach house. Having someone who actually gives a freak is so refreshing.

Saying the new guy is better than the old guy should be a given when you fire the old guy. If I'm a Maryland fan, I have no reason to think that Willard can put together a team that can compete for big 10 titles (anyone remember when MD was supposed to be a basketball power there once they got away from the ACC?). He does ok in a weak conference recruiting the same region that he will at Maryland. My guess is that he does ok, but never really vies for a Big10 title and gets teams that make it to the tournament, but exit early. That's an improvement, but nowhere near where Maryland used to be.

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #113: March 21, 2022, 03:48:17 PM »
Is there any reason they would? Mid major coaches who accomplish something seem like hotter prospects than coaches in major conferences whose teams are kind of ok most years. On the plus side, his teams make the tournament. On the minus side, they suck once they get there.
I mean Texas A&M scooped up Buzz Williams from VT who had previously scooped him up from Marquette. Cronin went from Cincinnati to UCLA. Mack from Xavier to Louisville. Sean Miller from Xavier to Arizona. I think there are plenty of other examples also if I given time. Forget the name of the Pitt coach who went to UCLA. 

Edit. The very successful Texas Tech coach went to Texas this year.

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #114: March 21, 2022, 03:51:15 PM »
Saying the new guy is better than the old guy should be a given when you fire the old guy. If I'm a Maryland fan, I have no reason to think that Willard can put together a team that can compete for big 10 titles (anyone remember when MD was supposed to be a basketball power there once they got away from the ACC?). He does ok in a weak conference recruiting the same region that he will at Maryland. My guess is that he does ok, but never really vies for a Big10 title and gets teams that make it to the tournament, but exit early. That's an improvement, but nowhere near where Maryland used to be.
Reminds of the attitude of VT football fans and alumni who were convinced once Beamer retired the school would ascend to the top.  Or Temple with Dunphy retiring basketball.  Instead it plummeted.  Only so many wins to go around in any conference in any sport.

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #115: March 21, 2022, 04:17:06 PM »
I mean Texas A&M scooped up Buzz Williams from VT who had previously scooped him up from Marquette. Cronin went from Cincinnati to UCLA. Mack from Xavier to Louisville. Sean Miller from Xavier to Arizona. I think there are plenty of other examples also if I given time. Forget the name of the Pitt coach who went to UCLA. 

Edit. The very successful Texas Tech coach went to Texas this year.

Successful is the key term. Seaton hall is not a successful program.

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #116: March 21, 2022, 05:53:01 PM »
Successful is the key term. Seaton hall is not a successful program.
They’ve been decent since 2016. Several NCAA tournaments and a Big East title.

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #117: March 21, 2022, 06:00:55 PM »
I mean Texas A&M scooped up Buzz Williams from VT who had previously scooped him up from Marquette. Cronin went from Cincinnati to UCLA. Mack from Xavier to Louisville. Sean Miller from Xavier to Arizona. I think there are plenty of other examples also if I given time. Forget the name of the Pitt coach who went to UCLA. 

Edit. The very successful Texas Tech coach went to Texas this year.
Ben Howland was the guy I was thinking of. Went from Pitt to UCLA. They fired him. Now at Mississippi State where he has had some success.

The Willard hiring seems ok to me. Seems a safer bet than a non power 5 school coach.

Offline imref

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #118: March 25, 2022, 09:46:18 AM »
Not a good year to be a number one.

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #119: March 25, 2022, 10:43:18 AM »
All my final four teams gone; only picked one number one seed--Arizona.  Figured there would be upsets by 3/4/5 seeds.  Just picked the wrong ones.

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #120: March 25, 2022, 10:49:27 AM »
My daughter has duke winning in a smaller pool with a prize she really wants. I tried to talk her out of it and I look like the idiot now. She's the only one left with a potential winner.

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #121: March 25, 2022, 10:52:19 AM »
My daughter has duke winning in a smaller pool with a prize she really wants. I tried to talk her out of it and I look like the idiot now. She's the only one left with a potential winner.
She knew the fix was in for the Dookies.  Smart girl.

Offline imref

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #122: March 25, 2022, 10:52:46 AM »
All my final four teams gone; only picked one number one seed--Arizona.  Figured there would be upsets by 3/4/5 seeds.  Just picked the wrong ones.

My final four were Kansas, Arizona, Gonzaga, and Kentucky, with Gonzaga beating Arizona in the championship game. Yeah, that didn't workout too well. In my 12-team group, only one person has picked a team to win that hasn't been ousted yet.

Online sixthree175

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #123: March 25, 2022, 07:23:16 PM »
She knew the fix was in for the Dookies.  Smart girl.
I'm a Dukie.  What's your problem?

Offline imref

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Re: NCAA Basketball 2021-22
« Reply #124: March 25, 2022, 09:49:02 PM »
St Peters, three wins away from a national title.