Author Topic: Carter Kieboom 2021  (Read 1103 times)

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Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #25: October 02, 2021, 10:51:41 AM »
Honestly, barring injury, there is no reason to pull him until mid-to-late June.

And if he "picks it up" they should absolutely NOT trade him
Trade high. If he starts the season well it will degenerate after that. Trust me.

Offline rileyn

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #26: October 02, 2021, 11:08:05 AM »
Honestly, barring injury, there is no reason to pull him until mid-to-late June.

And if he "picks it up" they should absolutely NOT trade him
What do you see in him to think he can play?  He is a sunk cost.  Fail fast, move on.  If he succeeds somewhere else in life, great for him. 

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #27: October 02, 2021, 11:26:28 AM »
What do you see in him to think he can play?  He is a sunk cost.  Fail fast, move on.  If he succeeds somewhere else in life, great for him.
I can see sticking with Robles for a bit longer due to his speed and defense but not Carter.  He seems bad on that end also.  Hope he starts well or maybe someone will take a flyer on him during the offseason. 

Offline aspenbubba

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #28: October 02, 2021, 11:58:26 AM »
It's back to KieBUST for me. He sucks at every aspect of the game. I have not seen anything to change my mind. Also, I think he is slow afoot. Rizzo need to find a 3B for OD.

Offline Slateman

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #29: October 02, 2021, 12:09:57 PM »
Trade high. If he starts the season well it will degenerate after that. Trust me.
Naw

What do you see in him to think he can play?  He is a sunk cost.  Fail fast, move on.  If he succeeds somewhere else in life, great for him. 
We have nothing to lose. He's not blocking anyone. The Lerners arent going to pay for an impact bat. This team is rebuilding. There is no reason not to start the season with him.

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #30: October 02, 2021, 12:12:24 PM »
Naw

Trust Rizzo anyway.  He is the one making the decisions and he is not reading this for advice. 

Offline varoadking

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #31: October 02, 2021, 04:06:11 PM »
He's a turd...he needs to be sent packing...now...

Offline welch

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #32: October 02, 2021, 04:56:00 PM »
Kieboom is hopeless. If nothing else, put somebody like Mercer / Harrison at 3B. Or any hard-hitting MLB 3B. It would be fun to find another guy like Schwarber, but there is no one in the minors for 3B. Maybe Noll. The Nats need to spend on two starting pitchers and a reliever, but if there is money left over, sign a league-respectable 3B.

Kieboom needs to play in AAA, and no higher.

Offline aspenbubba

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #33: October 03, 2021, 07:08:27 PM »
In Rizzos year end discussion with reporters in the dugout he specifically mentioned Kiebust. He said the league adjusted to him and now he will have to adjust to the league. All good players do that. From his tone it appears that Kiebust is on a very short leash and I hope he doesn’t come north after ST. Rizzo will have to sign a  3B regardless.

Offline welch

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #34: October 05, 2021, 04:32:26 PM »
In Rizzos year end discussion with reporters in the dugout he specifically mentioned Kiebust. He said the league adjusted to him and now he will have to adjust to the league. All good players do that. From his tone it appears that Kiebust is on a very short leash and I hope he doesn’t come north after ST. Rizzo will have to sign a  3B regardless.

Kieboom is not Robles. Don't link them.

Kieboom has never been much good at hitting or fielding. Let him compete with Noll, of course, but find someone who can play third. Someone just like Josh Harrison, even if Harrison is now worth double the one million they paid him last year. Just find someone to hold third until someone better comes by. It would be nice if the Nats could sign Kris Bryant, but Bryant seems well beyond what the Nats can afford, and unlikely to take a dive from the NLW winners to a team with only Soto and Bell, plus some rookies, plus no pitching.

Robles, though, perked up at Rochester. That doesn't prove he is ready to play in the majors, but he would have played himself out of baseball if he had flopped in AAA. There is hope for Robles. If nothing else, an OF of Thomas, Yadiel, and Robles mixing time in CF and LF would be at least respectable.

All that is without spending big on free agent position players.

Offline Mattionals

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #35: October 05, 2021, 05:15:25 PM »
Kieboom is not Robles. Don't link them.

Kieboom has never been much good at hitting or fielding. Let him compete with Noll, of course, but find someone who can play third. Someone just like Josh Harrison, even if Harrison is now worth double the one million they paid him last year. Just find someone to hold third until someone better comes by. It would be nice if the Nats could sign Kris Bryant, but Bryant seems well beyond what the Nats can afford, and unlikely to take a dive from the NLW winners to a team with only Soto and Bell, plus some rookies, plus no pitching.

Robles, though, perked up at Rochester. That doesn't prove he is ready to play in the majors, but he would have played himself out of baseball if he had flopped in AAA. There is hope for Robles. If nothing else, an OF of Thomas, Yadiel, and Robles mixing time in CF and LF would be at least respectable.

All that is without spending big on free agent position players.


Come on man, to say Kieboom was never good at hitting is just wrong. He hit very well in the minors, with two "average" stops at Low A and AA, but above everywhere else. He just didn't hit in the majors. Can't comment on his fielding at the minors though.

Offline welch

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #36: October 05, 2021, 05:41:14 PM »
Sure. Kieboom had a great season at Fresno in 2019.

I remember that Dan Dobbek hit like a bandit in the minors, 23 homers in each of two season wrapped around, I think, his two year Army stint. Hit .337 the first year, OPS of .979, and .265 the second, with an OPS of .796. Topps made him a rookie star in 1959, right alongside Bob Allison. The Nats OF was set with Dobbek, Allison, and Lemon. Every kid in Washington hunted for Dobbek cards and for Allison cards.

Allison was AL Rookie of the Year in 1959, playing center, hitting 30 homers. The Nats Park concourse used to have the famous photo of Killebrew, Allison, Sievers, and Lemon, "The Modern Murderers Row". Bob Allison was a star, playing until 1970, when he was 35. Accumulated 34 WAR over 1959 - 1968. Here is Dan Dobbek: https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/d/dobbeda01.shtml

 

Offline Mattionals

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #37: October 05, 2021, 06:46:49 PM »
Sure. Kieboom had a great season at Fresno in 2019.

I remember that Dan Dobbek hit like a bandit in the minors, 23 homers in each of two season wrapped around, I think, his two year Army stint. Hit .337 the first year, OPS of .979, and .265 the second, with an OPS of .796. Topps made him a rookie star in 1959, right alongside Bob Allison. The Nats OF was set with Dobbek, Allison, and Lemon. Every kid in Washington hunted for Dobbek cards and for Allison cards.

Allison was AL Rookie of the Year in 1959, playing center, hitting 30 homers. The Nats Park concourse used to have the famous photo of Killebrew, Allison, Sievers, and Lemon, "The Modern Murderers Row". Bob Allison was a star, playing until 1970, when he was 35. Accumulated 34 WAR over 1959 - 1968. Here is Dan Dobbek: https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/d/dobbeda01.shtml


Ooof, Dobbek flamed out.


Also, I'm not saying that Kieboom is going to work out. He definitely has his work cut out for him and aside from a really short hot stint, he hasn't proven he can play in the majors. I don't think anyone will argue that we have all liked what we've seen from Ruiz, Garcia, and Thomas. Next tier of "we like" guys are Adams and Barrera. Maybe Robles can regain that form he had. Kieboom is the biggest wild card position player we've seen to date over the past two seasons.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #38: October 05, 2021, 08:00:14 PM »
There's no question there will be at least one more infield signing capable of playing 3rd. Ideally, it is a guy like Harrison. Somebody who could start but you don't mind Kieboom pushing him out of the way with a good spring. You want the job not to be CK's unless he blows it, like this spring. You want him to earn it.

Offline aspenbubba

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #39: October 05, 2021, 09:20:14 PM »
Kieboom is not Robles. Don't link them at hitting or fielding.
I don’t believe I ever linked Kiebust and Robles. I admit I have been one of his biggest detractors. He needs to go.

Offline zimm_da_kid

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #40: October 05, 2021, 09:55:44 PM »
Kieboom is a corner infielder who can’t hit or field.  At least Robles is good defensively and can play CF.  Robles will definitely be in the majors for a long time as a Michael a Taylor type at least.  If kieboom doesn’t hit he’s done done

Offline Elvir Ovcina

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #41: October 06, 2021, 09:59:19 AM »
As I've said before, Kieboom is exactly the type of player who should get chances on a bad team.  If another team cut a dude with his profile, a lot of people would be all over this team taking on a cheap reclamation project of a 24-year-old former first-round pick.  There's no downside to giving him some run on a team that will be bad regardless of how good or bad he is.

Offline Slateman

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #42: October 06, 2021, 10:12:49 AM »
As I've said before, Kieboom is exactly the type of player who should get chances on a bad team.  If another team cut a dude with his profile, a lot of people would be all over this team taking on a cheap reclamation project of a 24-year-old former first-round pick.  There's no downside to giving him some run on a team that will be bad regardless of how good or bad he is.
This is why I really dont understand this push to get rid if Kieboom. There is nothing to lose from playing him next season. He isnt blocking anyone. There is no one the Nats are going to sign that is going to make such an impact that the Nats are competitive in 2022.

The same people who want to cut him now will be the ones asking why we didnt hang on to him when he has success with another team.

Offline aspenbubba

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #43: October 06, 2021, 11:14:59 AM »
This is why I really dont understand this push to get rid if Kieboom. There is nothing to lose from playing him next season. He isnt blocking anyone. There is no one the Nats are going to sign that is going to make such an impact that the Nats are competitive in 2022.

The same people who want to cut him now will be the ones asking why we didnt hang on to him when he has success with another team.
If he succeeds with another team I will issue a mea culpa with the caveat of "where did we fail him"?
We will not be competitive next year for sure but I believe the Lerners will want to field a team that can at least get close to playing .500 ball to maintain their fan base and provide entertainment value.

Offline imref

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #44: October 06, 2021, 11:23:32 AM »
IMHO, Kieboom hasn't yet shown he can play at the major league level. So you look for an aging veteran type as an upgrade, and send Kieboom back to Rochester. If he figures it out there, he gets another shot.

Someone like Eduardo Escobar or Matt Duffy on a 2 or 3 year deal would be a nice upgrade if we're willing to splurge a little.

Offline aspenbubba

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #45: October 06, 2021, 12:40:07 PM »
IMHO, Kieboom hasn't yet shown he can play at the major league level. So you look for an aging veteran type as an upgrade, and send Kieboom back to Rochester. If he figures it out there, he gets another shot.

 
I have no issue sending him back to AAA or even Harrisburg for that matter. I just don't want to see him annointed as the OD 3B.

Offline welch

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #46: October 06, 2021, 12:51:50 PM »
IMHO, Kieboom hasn't yet shown he can play at the major league level. So you look for an aging veteran type as an upgrade, and send Kieboom back to Rochester. If he figures it out there, he gets another shot.

Someone like Eduardo Escobar or Matt Duffy on a 2 or 3 year deal would be a nice upgrade if we're willing to splurge a little.

Duffy is no big deal, but he's cheap -- last contract was $1 million -- and he probably won't fall over his feet. Escobar even better. although he made $8 million and was deadlined to a playoff team. Both would be fine for a couple years. A place-holder, like Alcides.

Offline Slateman

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #47: October 06, 2021, 12:52:54 PM »
If he succeeds with another team I will issue a mea culpa with the caveat of "where did we fail him"?
We will not be competitive next year for sure but I believe the Lerners will want to field a team that can at least get close to playing .500 ball to maintain their fan base and provide entertainment value.

They arent gonna pay a ton of money to get to .500.

I have no issue sending him back to AAA or even Harrisburg for that matter. I just don't want to see him annointed as the OD 3B.
There is no reason to send him down. He's already shown he can hit in the minors.

Offline aspenbubba

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #48: October 06, 2021, 01:27:38 PM »
They arent gonna pay a ton of money to get to .500.
There is no reason to send him down. He's already shown he can hit in the minors.
He hasn't hit for the past two years '20 and '21 in the minors. He freakin sucks.

Offline welch

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Re: Carter Kieboom 2021
« Reply #49: October 06, 2021, 01:28:56 PM »
They arent gonna pay a ton of money to get to .500.
There is no reason to send him down. He's already shown he can hit in the minors.

Baloney.

Kieboom hit .236 with a mighty 5 homers at Rochester, for an OPS of .761. He had a good year in Fresno in 2019, but that's it. He flopped in the majors in 2020 and this season. He is an erratic fielder, which a team can't have at third. Baseball Ref estimates Kieboom as a -1 WAR player. Sure, let him compete with Noll in Spring Training, but Kieboom belongs at Rochester, which needs decent minor league ballplayers to keep fans going to games.