We are currently the 4th worst team in all of baseball.

[DCFan]

I didn't ask about that perspective, troll.  I asked how it's working out in objective terms: after a bad start, is he a good player now or not?

Eaton has a ring and Giolito doesn't.

[Elvir Ovcina]

Eaton has a ring and Giolito doesn't.

 This discussion has zero connection with what team he plays for.   It's about whether guys can struggle at first and then succeed.  Is Giolito a good player now: yes or no?

[DCFan]

This discussion has zero connection with what team he plays for.   It's about whether guys can struggle at first and then succeed.  Is Giolito a good player now: yes or no?

You serious you need help with this Q? 

[Elvir Ovcina]

You serious you need help with this Q? 

No, I'm not an idiot.  I'm making a point that you seem to be dancing like a man whose feet are on fire to avoid.   Is he a good player now: yes or no?

[UMDNats]

I am personally OUT on Kieboom but I think he still has prospect value, I just think the shine comes off when you get to the majors and struggle initially. So my point was I'm not sure he alone would have gotten/gets us a really good SP.

He's young enough to turn it around and has produced at every level but even from the outside looking in you can tell we don't love him as an organization. He could be playing every day but instead he's off the major league roster.

[DCFan]

No, I'm not an idiot. 

I know you're not but you really need to lighten up. 

[Elvir Ovcina]

I am personally OUT on Kieboom but I think he still has prospect value, I just think the shine comes off when you get to the majors and struggle initially. So my point was I'm not sure he alone would have gotten/gets us a really good SP.

One prospect alone doesn't ever get you a really good, already-established SP (at least in the market recently), unless that SP is injured or on an awful contract.  So the answer to that is pretty much irrelevant, but agree with the larger point.

[Elvir Ovcina]

I know you're not but you really need to lighten up. 

TBH, I think you act like a toddler.  I already have one of those.  I don't need more of them.  The fact that you come on here and disrupt otherwise interesting discussions with your infantile navel-gazing and refusal to actually engage in any discussion that's not fundamentally about you is pretty lame.

[DCFan]

TBH, I think you act like a toddler.  I already have one of those.  I don't need more of them.  The fact that you come on here and disrupt otherwise interesting discussions with your infantile navel-gazing and refusal to actually engage in any discussion that's not fundamentally about you is pretty lame.

Now I know why you're so cranky. Enjoy your time with your little one. Before you know it you'll be a pensioner in retirement land like me.

[UMDNats]

One prospect alone doesn't ever get you a really good, already-established SP (at least in the market recently), unless that SP is injured or on an awful contract.  So the answer to that is pretty much irrelevant, but agree with the larger point.

Fair, but I think the supposed #20 prospect in baseball could have (theoretically) gotten us close to a decent SP. I agree he alone doesn't get us someone close to our big-3, it would be closer to Anibal.

Now though, I'm really curious what other teams think of him. Our handling of him doesn't inspire a lot of confidence internally at his ability and reminds me of Giolito in that it's only a matter of time before he's dealt.

[Elvir Ovcina]

Fair, but I think the supposed #20 prospect in baseball could have (theoretically) gotten us close to a decent SP. I agree he alone doesn't get us someone close to our big-3, it would be closer to Anibal.

Now though, I'm really curious what other teams think of him. Our handling of him doesn't inspire a lot of confidence internally at his ability and reminds me of Giolito in that it's only a matter of time before he's dealt.

The only professional scout I've ever talked about him with suggested that his team strongly considered drafting him with their first pick (they drafted a different infielder, who is now in MLB) and would have drafted him if he was still there with their next pick, with which they selected another guy currently on their MLB roster. 

That was 2 years ago, though, before any of these dudes actually hit the big time.

[ajcartwright]

  it's a safe bet that this phrase finds its way into a Haiku

[varoadking]

This discussion has zero connection with what team he plays for.   It's about whether guys can struggle at first and then succeed.  Is Giolito a good player now: yes or no?

I would submit that 30 games in 2020 is a too small sample size for both Little Gio and Eaton...

[rileyn]

Everybody needs to chill.  We are the World Champions.  Bask in it.  This season is stupid - no fans, 60 games (for some), 7 inning games, goofy extra innings rule, DH in NL, and so on. 

If there was ever a good year to suck, this is it. 

[Kevrock]

The Giolito/Eaton argument is so tired. Let it go. This is getting as bad as the GM X is a moron for drafting _____ ahead of Trout

[imref]

We should have tanked last year to have a better farm system this year.

[Duke of Earl]

Lucas Giolito looked freaked up with the Nats in his first year in the majors.  How's that working out?

He may well have floundered the rest of his career had he stayed here.  We really aren't that good at developing pitchers.

[rileyn]

He may well have floundered the rest of his career had he stayed here.  We really aren't that good at developing pitchers.

And we have been in "win now" mode for the last 9 seasons.  We wouldn't have been able to be patient and let him develop in the majors. 

[Elvir Ovcina]

The Giolito/Eaton argument is so tired. Let it go. This is getting as bad as the GM X is a moron for drafting _____ ahead of Trout

I literally wasn't making any argument about Eaton.  I was simply pointing out that some guys struggle initially and then succeed, whether in the same place or another - and thus that it's rather early to dump on Kieboom.  Giolito is one example.  So is Turner.  So is Trout.

I would submit that 30 games in 2020 is a too small sample size for both Little Gio and Eaton...

Well, Giolito did turn his early career turd salad into an All-Star appearance and Cy Young votes last season, so it's not just this year's sample.  And I wasn't talking about him in comparison to Eaton, just as a standalone.

[zimm_da_kid]

Looks like Brock holt is gonna be our tank commander

[Duke of Earl]

And we have been in "win now" mode for the last 9 seasons.  We wouldn't have been able to be patient and let him develop in the majors.

If he had stayed with the Nationals organization he likely would never have developed. Given that, we're better off with Eaton.

[Five Banners]

If he had stayed with the Nationals organization he likely would never have developed. Given that, we're better off with Eaton.

We might be hearing “we had a chance to get Eaton, who’s been healthy the entire time and has done nothing but produce since then under team control at an affordable number”

[blue911]

Giolito had UCL replacement surgery in 2012. Seven years later he was able to put it all together

What’s the lifespan of TJ?

[zimm_da_kid]

Giolito had UCL replacement surgery in 2012. Seven years later he was able to put it all together

What’s the lifespan of TJ?

If you ask elvir he should be crap by now 

[DCFan]

Giolito had UCL replacement surgery in 2012. Seven years later he was able to put it all together

What’s the lifespan of TJ?

Back in the JZ contract negotiation era the theory from the front office was that the lifespan for TJ was only 8 years.