Author Topic: So will there be a 2020 season?  (Read 37870 times)

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Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #300: May 28, 2020, 12:50:34 PM »
MLB owners definitely the greediest. these MFers already can spend as little as like $40 mill on a roster and face 0 consequences. every other league has a cap/floor and MLB owners cry poor more than anyone
What percentage of owners spend near that level?  Zero actually. 

https://www.ibtimes.com/mlb-payrolls-2019-red-sox-cubs-yankees-lead-league-phillies-not-among-top-opening-day-2780726%3famp=1

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #301: May 28, 2020, 12:53:24 PM »
They are both obviously in negotiations, but neither tried to destroy the other publicly, not a peep has been heard from the NFL or NFLPA. The mlb is the only league that goes out of its way to demonize players then wonders why their stars have low q rating.
Oh cmon. Did anyone really expect the league to just pro rate salaries when there will be no fans in stadiums which means also means no parking and concessions revenue.  Let’s see how the players respond. What have the owners done to demonize players?  The players are the ones making the statements demonizing the owners.

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #302: May 28, 2020, 12:54:21 PM »
The rays had an opening day payroll of $53 million- that’s about what the estimated per team portion of the national tv deal amounts to.

The owners floated 50/50 revenue sharing while not agreeing to open their books- either they assumed the players were beyond stupid or they were trying to demonize players, the league then leaked a proposal cutting 80% of salary for stars. Compare that to the NBA where the league is pretending the stars are crafting the return proposal and will make it look like a joint effort further boosting its stars

Offline UMDNats

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #303: May 28, 2020, 01:01:37 PM »
nfl owners are almost comically evil and self-absorbed in their importance but yet come across a thousand times better than mlb owners, who will do anything possible to cut spending and player salaries

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #304: May 28, 2020, 01:07:51 PM »
nfl owners are almost comically evil and self-absorbed in their importance but yet come across a thousand times better than mlb owners, who will do anything possible to cut spending and player salaries
Well. Let’s see. They have a hard cap and non guaranteed contracts.  MLB owners can only wish for those. 

Offline varoadking

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #305: May 28, 2020, 01:12:24 PM »
why does it seem like baseball is going to be the only sport to freak this up? I guess this is what happens when there is zero trust or good will in a negotiation

Any sport that is planning to play in 2020 is freaking this up...


Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #306: May 28, 2020, 01:12:29 PM »
The rays had an opening day payroll of $53 million- that’s about what the estimated per team portion of the national tv deal amounts to.

The owners floated 50/50 revenue sharing while not agreeing to open their books- either they assumed the players were beyond stupid or they were trying to demonize players, the league then leaked a proposal cutting 80% of salary for stars. Compare that to the NBA where the league is pretending the stars are crafting the return proposal and will make it look like a joint effort further boosting its stars
For every Rays there is a Red Sox. Teams overpaying for players even as they have learned to use young and cheap talent.  The average MLB salary is still $4 million. Owners are jerks but let’s please stop the whining for the MLB players. Do you think they care at all about the MILB guys?

Offline Slateman

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #307: May 28, 2020, 01:13:04 PM »
Well. Let’s see. They have a hard cap and non guaranteed contracts.  MLB owners can only wish for those. 
MLB owners could have had that at any time . . .

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #308: May 28, 2020, 01:14:56 PM »
Any sport that is planning to play in 2020 is freaking this up...
Yep. The leagues will all have similar issues as they go into seasons with no fans and reduced revenues. College sports will resume with players as the only ones on campus so they can make money. But not pay those players. 

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #309: May 28, 2020, 01:16:52 PM »
MLB owners could have had that at any time . . .
The NFL players are the only ones dumb enough to have contracts where they can be cut at any time.  So The union would have accepted those?

Offline varoadking

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #310: May 28, 2020, 01:17:39 PM »
Yep. The leagues will all have similar issues as they go into seasons with no fans and reduced revenues. College sports will resume with players as the only ones on campus so they can make money. But not pay those players.

...and people are going to get sick and careers will be jeopardized...if not worse...


Offline Slateman

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #311: May 28, 2020, 01:19:32 PM »
The NFL players are the only ones dumb enough to have contracts where they can be cut at any time.  So The union would have accepted those?
None of the other sports have fully guaranteed contracts.

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #312: May 28, 2020, 01:19:59 PM »
For every Rays there is a Red Sox. Teams overpaying for players even as they have learned to use young and cheap talent.  The average MLB salary is still $4 million. Owners are jerks but let’s please stop the whining for the MLB players. Do you think they care at all about the MILB guys?

why is it the MLB players' responsibility to care for MILB players? The owners are their employers, not the major leaguers

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #313: May 28, 2020, 01:20:23 PM »
...and people are going to get sick and careers will be jeopardized...if not worse...
The NCAA is by far the worst since the kids don’t even get paid. 

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #314: May 28, 2020, 01:22:23 PM »
why is it the MLB responsibility to care for MILB players? The owners are their employers, not the major leaguers
Doesn’t have to be that way.  They could include increased MILB pay in their negotiations. The bottom line is the guys who made it don’t care for the minor leaguers any more than ownership does.  That’s why the majority of fans will side with the owners this time just as they have done very time before.

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #315: May 28, 2020, 01:23:11 PM »
The NCAA is by far the worst since the kids don’t even get paid. 

they'll get a quality virtual education /s I really think that certain schools are postering, I don't think you can have sports unless you have students on campus and I don't think you'll have students in a lot of places this fall

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #316: May 28, 2020, 01:23:52 PM »
None of the other sports have fully guaranteed contracts.
So the Phillies can cut Harper when his performance declines?  Please. You know NFL contracts are much different and that they benefit the owners and not the players. Their careers are also shorter.

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #317: May 28, 2020, 01:26:10 PM »
Doesn’t have to be that way.  They could include increased MILB pay in their negotiations. The bottom line is the guys who made it don’t care for the minor leaguers any more than ownership does.  That’s why the majority of fans will side with the owners this time just as they have done very time before.

why should a union have to use its leverage to provide for non-member employees; the union that has a responsibility to union members. Do you really think fans give a crap about minor leaguers? Fans side with owners because of the old getting payed millions to play a game narrative.

Offline bluestreak

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #318: May 28, 2020, 01:26:27 PM »
Oh cmon. Did anyone really expect the league to just pro rate salaries when there will be no fans in stadiums which means also means no parking and concessions revenue.  Let’s see how the players respond. What have the owners done to demonize players?  The players are the ones making the statements demonizing the owners.

Do you think when they reached the agreement in March that the owners didn’t think that having to play without fans was a possibility? Of course they did. Which makes that deal totally bad faith.

These guys have contracts. When the owners pull in record contracts, they don’t give the players extra, when they take losses the players shouldn’t have to absorb those.

The only reason it seems like baseball is “screwing this up” is because the owners released a plan that had compensation details. No other league did anything like that. It should be behind closed doors.
The owners did it so try and sway public opinion to their side. It was underhanded.  I can’t blame the players for being pissed and not wanting to negotiate. Every owner move of this negotiation has been in bad faith. Why continue.

I don’t think the players will agree to play unless the owners open their books. Which they will never do. So ::shrug::

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #319: May 28, 2020, 01:27:10 PM »
Does anyone seriously think the NFL owners will just pay out the full salaries they have negotiated this year when they will have reduced revenue with no fans at games? 

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #320: May 28, 2020, 01:27:48 PM »
So the Phillies can cut Harper when his performance declines?  Please. You know NFL contracts are much different and that they benefit the owners and not the players. Their careers are also shorter.

mlb teams get exclusive control of players for over a decade, most of which can be at comically low salaries (so low that congress had to carve out an exception to minimum wage laws to keep it legal)

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #321: May 28, 2020, 01:28:29 PM »
Does anyone seriously think the NFL owners will just pay out the full salaries they have negotiated this year when they will have reduced revenue with no fans at games? 

given the breakdown in revenue between gate and tv, they'd be insane to invite this kind of train wreck

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #322: May 28, 2020, 01:32:34 PM »
Do you think when they reached the agreement in March that the owners didn’t think that having to play without fans was a possibility? Of course they did. Which makes that deal totally bad faith.

These guys have contracts. When the owners pull in record contracts, they don’t give the players extra, when they take losses the players shouldn’t have to absorb those.

The only reason it seems like baseball is “screwing this up” is because the owners released a plan that had compensation details. No other league did anything like that. It should be behind closed doors.
The owners did it so try and sway public opinion to their side. It was underhanded.  I can’t blame the players for being pissed and not wanting to negotiate. Every owner move of this negotiation has been in bad faith. Why continue.

I don’t think the players will agree to play unless the owners open their books. Which they will never do. So ::shrug::
Yea. It was a dumb move to publicize that. So you think if they had kept it quiet the players would not have leaked it?  They believe the agreement has an out clause. I have not read it and am not a lawyer so not sure about that.

Lots of people have had contracts ripped up over the past few months.  Might not be fair but it has happened. Economic conditions have drastically changed. 

I will blame both sides if no season. I just don’t buy that MLB owners are greedier than other sports or other businesses.

Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #323: May 28, 2020, 01:36:57 PM »
Yea. It was a dumb move to publicize that. So you think if they had kept it quiet the players would not have leaked it?  They believe the agreement has an out clause. I have not read it and am not a lawyer so not sure about that.

Lots of people have had contracts ripped up over the past few months.  Might not be fair but it has happened. Economic conditions have drastically changed. 

I will blame both sides if no season. I just don’t buy that MLB owners are greedier than other sports or other businesses.

they never actually made the revenue split proposal, they created it solely as a pr stunt knowing the results. (they know the union's view on salary cap, and they've already refused to release financials to substantiate any loss, which seems like it should be the basis for any renegotiation of a contract). The question is what they think they gained- do they think it helps the sport if people hate players?

Offline Natsinpwc

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Re: So will there be a 2020 season?
« Reply #324: May 28, 2020, 01:44:28 PM »
they never actually made the revenue split proposal, they created it solely as a pr stunt knowing the results. (they know the union's view on salary cap, and they've already refused to release financials to substantiate any loss, which seems like it should be the basis for any renegotiation of a contract). The question is what they think they gained- do they think it helps the sport if people hate players?
I’m not sure what you mean. They just provided a proposal to the players.  It has salary levels in it. Call it a reduced salary proposal then.

Do you think it helps the sport of fans hate the owners? 

Both sides are being ridiculous. Just provide a counter proposal and start negotiations.