Author Topic: Astros stealing signs - But Dusty to the Rescue  (Read 12376 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline dracnal

  • Posts: 1609
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #475: January 20, 2020, 12:49:50 PM »
XFL!

XFL and Arena Football are examples. A bit flawed since these are gimmick leagues, but still at least technically competition. WNBA and Women's Soccer are pro leagues that at least use rules similar enough to the men's pro leagues that they're recognizable when you watch them. You might not be interested in watching women's sports, and they may not make as much money as a result, but they aren't barred from existing by the Government. That's my real gripe - why on earth should the Federal Government decide that women aren't allowed a pro baseball league? What business is it of theirs? Why should MLB be protected in a way that no other sport is?

Offline Elvir Ovcina

  • Posts: 3831
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #476: January 20, 2020, 12:57:46 PM »
So do other major sports have cheaper or better products?

I think people don't understand that the baseball-specific antitrust exemption is only one of several limitations of (rather than total exemptions from) antitrust law that apply to sports leagues.  Even if you stripped away the Federal Baseball and Flood immunity, you'd still be on the footing of the NFL and NBA, where the collective bargaining and media-rights exemptions still allow a lot of cartel-like conduct.

Offline dracnal

  • Posts: 1609
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #477: January 20, 2020, 01:05:01 PM »
I think people don't understand that the baseball-specific antitrust exemption is only one of several limitations of (rather than total exemptions from) antitrust law that apply to sports leagues.  Even if you stripped away the Federal Baseball and Flood immunity, you'd still be on the footing of the NFL and NBA, where the collective bargaining and media-rights exemptions still allow a lot of cartel-like conduct.

Hrm, put me in the category of your first sentence, then. I thought they had protection above and beyond the other leagues in a significant fashion.

Offline Natsinpwc

  • Posts: 17993
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #478: January 20, 2020, 01:29:21 PM »
XFL and Arena Football are examples. A bit flawed since these are gimmick leagues, but still at least technically competition. WNBA and Women's Soccer are pro leagues that at least use rules similar enough to the men's pro leagues that they're recognizable when you watch them. You might not be interested in watching women's sports, and they may not make as much money as a result, but they aren't barred from existing by the Government. That's my real gripe - why on earth should the Federal Government decide that women aren't allowed a pro baseball league? What business is it of theirs? Why should MLB be protected in a way that no other sport is?
It’s kind of funny you mention the WNBA since it is actually run by the NBA. We haven’t had a viable basketball rival since the old ABA. Hockey since the WHA. And football since the USFL. Bottom line is that you have no competition so it’s not going to be cheaper. And not better either. If anything if players go to rival leagues it dilutes the talent.

Online bluestreak

  • Posts: 10561
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #479: January 20, 2020, 02:22:55 PM »
MLB can collude to depress the salaries of minor league players and those players aren’t subject to normal workplace protections. And they aren’t in a union that collectively bargains.

Offline Elvir Ovcina

  • Posts: 3831
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #480: January 20, 2020, 03:47:46 PM »
Hrm, put me in the category of your first sentence, then. I thought they had protection above and beyond the other leagues in a significant fashion.

They do.  The point is that, even if that's stripped away, they still have a significant degree of protection from antitrust laws.

MLB can collude to depress the salaries of minor league players and those players aren’t subject to normal workplace protections. And they aren’t in a union that collectively bargains.

Yes, and that's a huge part of the additional immunity conferred by the baseball-specific cases.   The distinction is why the NBA has not fought to prevent the D-League (whatever its corporate sponsor wants it called, it's the D-League) players from unionizing. 

Offline Slateman

  • Posts: 55717
  • THE SUMMONER OF THE REVERSE JINX

Offline Five Banners

  • Posts: 1119
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #482: January 24, 2020, 09:37:55 PM »
https://mobile.twitter.com/DanClarkSports/status/1220817616031248385

Might not just be the Stros

The real-time element is not insignificant, and the Astros still seem to have the market cornered there at present


Offline Slateman

  • Posts: 55717
  • THE SUMMONER OF THE REVERSE JINX
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #484: January 25, 2020, 05:46:16 PM »
Um, duh...:roll:

 2010, the best home records were Atlanta (56-25), Philly (54-30), and St. Louis (52-49). Philly was 8 games over .500 on the road, while Atlanta and St. Louis were 35-46 and 34-47, respectively.

Now, who, you ask, might have been involved in the scheme? Well the Cardinals vice president in 2010 was none other than - drumroll please - Jeff Luhnow.

And why might have the offending team stopped? Jeff Luhnow left St. Louis in 2011 to join the Astros.

 

Online nfotiu

  • Posts: 3970
  • Juan Soto aka Human Wildcat
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #485: January 26, 2020, 07:19:21 PM »
*52-29

Online imref

  • Posts: 32808
  • Redemption
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #486: January 27, 2020, 10:17:44 AM »
a group of bettors have filed a class-action lawsuit against the Astros and Red Sox

https://www.reddit.com/r/baseball/comments/eundqe/class_action_filed_against_mlb_astros_red_sox_on/

Offline Five Banners

  • Posts: 1119
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #487: January 27, 2020, 12:43:56 PM »
Someone noted that the advantage in real-time sign signaling would have extended to stealing bases, posting a clip with a thump apparently signaling an offspeed pitch on which Altuve stole second.

Offline Five Banners

  • Posts: 1119
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #488: January 28, 2020, 11:16:58 AM »
Dusty reportedly close to deal there

Offline Slateman

  • Posts: 55717
  • THE SUMMONER OF THE REVERSE JINX
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #489: January 28, 2020, 11:21:12 AM »
Dusty reportedly close to deal there
Holy crap, Palm Spring gonna be awkward af

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 29794
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #490: January 28, 2020, 11:24:28 AM »
Holy crap, Palm Spring gonna be awkward af
awkward nothing.  Dusty will be cool.  Dusty is always cool.  He'll walk over, smoke a joint with Strasburg, then have him tested.

Offline Slateman

  • Posts: 55717
  • THE SUMMONER OF THE REVERSE JINX
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #491: January 28, 2020, 11:26:34 AM »
awkward nothing.  Dusty will be cool.  Dusty is always cool.  He'll walk over, smoke a joint with Strasburg, then have him tested.
Dusty told me he prefers cigars

Offline Vega

  • Posts: 5413
  • Take what you can. Give nothing back.
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #492: January 28, 2020, 12:03:48 PM »
Crane is gonna need a stabilizing presence as the new manager. I recommend Dusty. :D

Offline GburgNatsFan

  • Posts: 21542
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #493: January 28, 2020, 12:07:09 PM »
WPB?

Can't wait.

Holy crap, Palm Spring gonna be awkward af

Offline Senatorswin

  • Posts: 387
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #494: January 28, 2020, 12:15:53 PM »
It will be great if Dusty gets the Astros job but I wish he would manage a team I could root for. One good thing Astros are in the American league though so I don't have to root against him playing the Nats. Go Dusty!!

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 29794
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #495: January 28, 2020, 03:26:33 PM »
It will be great if Dusty gets the Astros job but I wish he would manage a team I could root for. One good thing Astros are in the American league though so I don't have to root against him playing the Nats. Go Dusty!!
is there an AL team you could root for?  I mean, not the Red Sox, NYY, Os, Rangers, Twins, Astros . . .  Blue Jays used to lord it over the Expos and now have Canada to themselves, so no to them.  ChiSox?  Can't really root for Giolito - too painful.  Indians?  But there was that jerk Tribetime who used to post here.  Royals?  you could root for them but it is sort of a waste of time.  Angels?  They stole Rendon.  What's left?

Offline Elvir Ovcina

  • Posts: 3831
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #496: January 28, 2020, 09:12:49 PM »
is there an AL team you could root for?  I mean, not the Red Sox, NYY, Os, Rangers, Twins, Astros . . .  Blue Jays used to lord it over the Expos and now have Canada to themselves, so no to them.  ChiSox?  Can't really root for Giolito - too painful.  Indians?  But there was that jerk Tribetime who used to post here.  Royals?  you could root for them but it is sort of a waste of time.  Angels?  They stole Rendon.  What's left?

The team with the best uniforms and worst outdoor stadium in baseball, and you don't even have to see Blake Treinen anymore.

Online bluestreak

  • Posts: 10561
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #497: January 28, 2020, 09:17:22 PM »
is there an AL team you could root for?  I mean, not the Red Sox, NYY, Os, Rangers, Twins, Astros . . .  Blue Jays used to lord it over the Expos and now have Canada to themselves, so no to them.  ChiSox?  Can't really root for Giolito - too painful.  Indians?  But there was that jerk Tribetime who used to post here.  Royals?  you could root for them but it is sort of a waste of time.  Angels?  They stole Rendon.  What's left?

My AL team is the Tigers

Online bluestreak

  • Posts: 10561
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #498: January 28, 2020, 09:17:44 PM »
That July 4th game is a must see.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 29794
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: Astros stealing signs
« Reply #499: January 28, 2020, 10:18:45 PM »
The team with the best uniforms and worst outdoor stadium in baseball, and you don't even have to see Blake Treinen anymore.
I was more responding to Senatorswin. Of course I have an AL team. If I were a neutral, I think I would root for the Twins.