Author Topic: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason  (Read 42029 times)

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Offline Truconfidence

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #900: December 08, 2019, 04:34:07 PM »
So the Yankees opening offer for Cole was 7/245... I would take that number as the number Strasburg should look to get or near 35 AAV

Online Slateman

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #901: December 08, 2019, 04:43:11 PM »
So the Yankees opening offer for Cole was 7/245... I would take that number as the number Strasburg should look to get or near 35 AAV
:lmao: No

Offline RyanZimsKazoo

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #902: December 08, 2019, 09:25:58 PM »
If Cole was getting 240 then Stras will get 210-220.

Offline Five Banners

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #903: December 08, 2019, 10:06:14 PM »
If Cole was getting 240 then Stras will get 210-220.

If he sells his corvette, he'll really be in the money

Online Slateman

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #904: December 09, 2019, 07:39:38 AM »
If Cole was getting 240 then Stras will get 210-220.
lol, no

Cole is two years younger and a MUCH better pitcher than Strasburg.

Offline RyanZimsKazoo

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #905: December 09, 2019, 08:38:03 AM »
lol, no

Cole is two years younger and a MUCH better pitcher than Strasburg.
So much better that he won game one when everyone expected him to and was so pivotal in game seven that helped them win the World Series.... oh wait

Online Slateman

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #906: December 09, 2019, 08:59:44 AM »
So much better that he won game one when everyone expected him to and was so pivotal in game seven that helped them win the World Series.... oh wait
Yes, that's what we base contracts on now. One game in the postseason. In which he wasn't allowed to pitch. :roll:

I guess Mike Trout shouldn't be worth anything then, huh?

Offline GburgNatsFan

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #907: December 09, 2019, 09:16:33 AM »
We know you don't like Stras, but he has a better career WAR and ERA. Calling Cole "MUCH better" is ludicrous.

lol, no

Cole is two years younger and a MUCH better pitcher than Strasburg.

Offline metssuck

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #908: December 09, 2019, 09:27:04 AM »
lol, no

Cole is two years younger and a MUCH better pitcher than Strasburg.
that wasn’t the case in WS

Offline Elvir Ovcina

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #909: December 09, 2019, 09:30:38 AM »
We know you don't like Stras, but he has a better career WAR and ERA. Calling Cole "MUCH better" is ludicrous.

Leaving the overstatement aside, there's a kernel of a point there.  Cole's numbers the last couple years are indeed significantly better than Strasburg's.  No shame in that.  But the real thing here is age and injury history.  I think if you put the TJ and 2 years of age onto Cole's side, Strasburg gets more money. 

But as it is, I think the gap is going to be way bigger than $20-30 million.  Cole probably gets at least one extra year at ~5 million more AAV, so the gap is likely more like $75 million.  That's mostly because someone is going to give Cole a stupidly large contract.

Online Natsinpwc

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #910: December 09, 2019, 10:45:13 AM »
We know you don't like Stras, but he has a better career WAR and ERA. Calling Cole "MUCH better" is ludicrous.
It’s not that he doesn’t like Stras. He is just a contrarian.

Offline GburgNatsFan

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #911: December 09, 2019, 11:02:01 AM »
FIFY
It’s not just that he doesn’t like Stras. He is also just a contrarian.

Online Slateman

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #912: December 09, 2019, 11:03:44 AM »
We know you don't like Stras, but he has a better career WAR and ERA. Calling Cole "MUCH better" is ludicrous.

That would matter if had Cole not been lights out the last two seasons.

Cole is two years younger, has three seasons in a row of 30+ starts, has back to back seasons of sub 3 ERA and has been worth 6+ WAR in each of the last two seasons. Sorry, but the Houston fixed Gerrit Cole is the best pitcher in baseball.

Cole is better than Schezer at this point in his career. There's a two WAR difference between Cole's best season and Strasburg's best season. That is MUCH better. There's a reason everyone is going to throw record setting money at Cole and not at Strasburg.

Online Slateman

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #913: December 09, 2019, 11:11:27 AM »
that wasn’t the case in WS
:roll: Are you seriously trying to make the point that he's better because of a game in the postseason? Fun fact, Cole had a lower ERA this postseason that Stras.

I know Stras was a beast in the postseason, but you don't pay this kind of money for just a postseason. If that were the case, MadBum would be the top free agent in the history of baseball. You're paying based on past performance and the future potential. And right now, Cole is two years younger and a much better pitcher than Stras.


Offline RyanZimsKazoo

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #915: December 09, 2019, 11:42:56 AM »
:roll: Are you seriously trying to make the point that he's better because of a game in the postseason? Fun fact, Cole had a lower ERA this postseason that Stras.

I know Stras was a beast in the postseason, but you don't pay this kind of money for just a postseason. If that were the case, MadBum would be the top free agent in the history of baseball. You're paying based on past performance and the future potential. And right now, Cole is two years younger and a much better pitcher than Stras.

It doesnt matter.

Cole isnt going to be a Nat. And hating on Stras doesnt change that either. Be happy that the guy who was once a wilting flower turned into a post season machine.

Online Slateman

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #916: December 09, 2019, 11:45:35 AM »
It doesnt matter.

Cole isnt going to be a Nat. And hating on Stras doesnt change that either. Be happy that the guy who was once a wilting flower turned into a post season machine.
No one was hating Stras. But if there are offers to give him 200+ million, then the Nats need to let him walk. No one is going to give Stras 35MM AAV unless Cole's top offer completely blows that out of the water.

Offline RyanZimsKazoo

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #917: December 09, 2019, 12:18:46 PM »
No one was hating Stras. But if there are offers to give him 200+ million, then the Nats need to let him walk. No one is going to give Stras 35MM AAV unless Cole's top offer completely blows that out of the water.

Dude, there is nobody on the market left? You going to let your #2 pitcher leave? Who do you replace with him? We got nobody that can handle the spot. There is nobody on the market that is worth it.

Nats pitching outside of Max and Corbin is very shaky with no Stras. Sanchez is very hit or miss and we dont have a true fifth.

There is nothing on the market after Stras or Cole worth investing #2 money into.

Offline NJ Ave

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #918: December 09, 2019, 12:24:10 PM »
Nightingale says Rendon is the philly’s top priority.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/2019/12/06/phillies-plan-pursue-free-agent-anthony-rendon/4355310002/

Might be just me, but if the money is equal elsewhere do we really think anyone wants to go *back* to playing with Bryce?

Offline GburgNatsFan

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #919: December 09, 2019, 12:25:34 PM »
Agreed. If that's what it costs, then you throw money at Rendon.

No one was hating Stras. But if there are offers to give him 200+ million, then the Nats need to let him walk. No one is going to give Stras 35MM AAV unless Cole's top offer completely blows that out of the water.

Offline Kevrock

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #920: December 09, 2019, 12:50:46 PM »
Might be just me, but if the money is equal elsewhere do we really think anyone wants to go *back* to playing with Bryce?

I don’t know if they are friends or not, but it is hard to imagine Rendon in Philly with all of Harper’s personalized home run handshakes and antics. It doesn’t seem his style. But, money talks.

Online Slateman

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #921: December 09, 2019, 12:56:01 PM »
Dude, there is nobody on the market left? You going to let your #2 pitcher leave? Who do you replace with him? We got nobody that can handle the spot. There is nobody on the market that is worth it.

Nats pitching outside of Max and Corbin is very shaky with no Stras. Sanchez is very hit or miss and we dont have a true fifth.

There is nothing on the market after Stras or Cole worth investing #2 money into.
If it means keeping my MVP caliber third baseman, yes.

Corbin is being paid like a number 2.

Offline Mattionals

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #922: December 09, 2019, 01:21:54 PM »
Listen, Stras is an excellent pitcher. Cole is better. Just like Scherzer is a better pitcher than Strasburg, postseason notwithstanding. people put so much HYPE into postseason stats, like MAT here from passive fans wanting him to stay, or people thinking MadBum is worth 9 figures (well MadBum apparently believes that).

There will always be pitchers who pitch well in the postseason with middling regular season results. Jack Morris comes to mind, since everyone remembers him for his duel against Smoltz in 1991, but his career numbers are pretty trash. This doesn't mean I dislike Strasburg. Strasburg is an excellent pitcher. I'd still take Scherzer over him, and I'd take Cole over Stras as well. Cole is a monster and will likely be worth more than 245M. I'm not sure Strasburg gets more than 200M at this point. His old contract was 175 and he was owed 100. I think he could easily turn that into another 175.

Online Slateman

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #923: December 09, 2019, 01:30:43 PM »
Listen, Stras is an excellent pitcher. Cole is better. Just like Scherzer is a better pitcher than Strasburg, postseason notwithstanding. people put so much HYPE into postseason stats, like MAT here from passive fans wanting him to stay, or people thinking MadBum is worth 9 figures (well MadBum apparently believes that).

There will always be pitchers who pitch well in the postseason with middling regular season results. Jack Morris comes to mind, since everyone remembers him for his duel against Smoltz in 1991, but his career numbers are pretty trash. This doesn't mean I dislike Strasburg. Strasburg is an excellent pitcher. I'd still take Scherzer over him, and I'd take Cole over Stras as well. Cole is a monster and will likely be worth more than 245M. I'm not sure Strasburg gets more than 200M at this point. His old contract was 175 and he was owed 100. I think he could easily turn that into another 175.
Michael A Taylor is the Mike Trout of the postseason. 5.000 OPS in World Series play.

Offline Five Banners

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #924: December 09, 2019, 03:05:18 PM »
Nightingale: Someone named DCFan is wearing a Strasburg jersey and handing out free hugs at Nats Park