Author Topic: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason  (Read 41888 times)

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Offline bluestreak

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #825: December 06, 2019, 09:27:32 AM »
ESPN article suggesting a straight up swap of Harder for Kieboom.

Would you do it?

If they sign Rendon, sure.

Offline UMDNats

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #826: December 06, 2019, 10:02:37 AM »
ESPN article suggesting a straight up swap of Harder for Kieboom.

Would you do it?

trading our only legitimate prospect for a reliever that could turn into a pumpkin immediately? hard pass. uber pass. don't even consider it. i am down on kieboom but that'd be hilariously dumb considering we currently have no 2B or 3B

Offline aBaltoNat

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #827: December 06, 2019, 10:26:14 AM »
trading our only legitimate prospect for a reliever that could turn into a pumpkin immediately? hard pass. uber pass. don't even consider it. i am down on kieboom but that'd be hilariously dumb considering we currently have no 2B or 3B

I think I'm in the same boat even if Rendon comes back. Also, 6 years of control vs 4 and relievers just aren't consistent enough.

Offline CoryTheFormerExposFan

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #828: December 06, 2019, 10:28:24 AM »
I just don't believe that comment. It feels of a really poor move to try and temper Boras's expectations from the Nats. This franchise just got below the tax threshold and has had payroll in prior seasons close to this year's limit.

That doesn't mean I believe they will sign both, but it's a really lame cop out to do now.

I agree.  We may not re-sign them both, but I don't think it's because "we can only afford 1." 

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #829: December 06, 2019, 10:30:40 AM »
trading our only legitimate prospect for a reliever that could turn into a pumpkin immediately? hard pass. uber pass. don't even consider it. i am down on kieboom but that'd be hilariously dumb considering we currently have no 2B or 3B
I second.  The mere suggestion of that deal should have the writer's BBWAA membership cancelled. 

Offline nfotiu

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #830: December 06, 2019, 10:30:52 AM »
I think I'm in the same boat even if Rendon comes back. Also, 6 years of control vs 4 and relievers just aren't consistent enough.
Yeah, I'm in that boat as well.   Relievers are such crap shoots right now.   Also Hader's last 2 appearances were devastating blown saves.   

Offline CoryTheFormerExposFan

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #831: December 06, 2019, 10:32:41 AM »
trading our only legitimate prospect for a reliever that could turn into a pumpkin immediately? hard pass. uber pass. don't even consider it. i am down on kieboom but that'd be hilariously dumb considering we currently have no 2B or 3B

Hilariousy dumb?  I'm not saying I'd do it...I'd want to feel really good about Hader's health and I don't know how many more years of control he has...but Kieboom isn't a prodigee prospect.  It is far from guaranteed he becomes a good big leaguer.  Hader has proven himself to be dominant in an area we are always sorely lacking.  I mean if we retained Rendon (and Stras) and flipped Kieboom for Hader...that positions us quite well to repeat.  2B isn't that difficult of a position to fill. 

Offline aBaltoNat

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #832: December 06, 2019, 10:39:10 AM »
Hilariousy dumb?  I'm not saying I'd do it...I'd want to feel really good about Hader's health and I don't know how many more years of control he has...but Kieboom isn't a prodigee prospect.  It is far from guaranteed he becomes a good big leaguer.  Hader has proven himself to be dominant in an area we are always sorely lacking.  I mean if we retained Rendon (and Stras) and flipped Kieboom for Hader...that positions us quite well to repeat.  2B isn't that difficult of a position to fill.

This is probably the only way it makes sense. Both Stras and Rendon would need resigned and we go for the repeat now.

Offline CoryTheFormerExposFan

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #833: December 06, 2019, 10:40:25 AM »
This is probably the only way it makes sense. Both Stras and Rendon would need resigned and we go for the repeat now.

If we signed Stras and Donaldson, then it would still make sense if they felt Hader's health was fine...and if he has a decent amount of years of control left. 

Offline 3bside

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #834: December 06, 2019, 10:44:00 AM »
I'm starting to think that the Corbin deal knocks us out of re-signing Stras.  It's pretty much the same as when they signed Max before JZimm's last year.

Offline RyanZimsKazoo

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #835: December 06, 2019, 10:47:12 AM »
I think this is the Lerners telling us that Rendon aint' coming back :(
Rendon wasnt coming back. But If they dont resign Stras you will see such a huge drop off of fan interest. Lerners are Cheap will come back into the fold.

Offline Kevrock

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #836: December 06, 2019, 10:50:46 AM »
Well, if it is the "we can't sign both," then I am very [annoyed] that we are letting the likes of Wheeler and Hamels and Moustakas cut deals for high teens / low twenties.  We need backfills at both positions.  Frankly, we are going to need to re-sign Howie for either 3d or 2d if Rendon walks, and probably use some of the money not spent on Stras for a better 2d bullpen addition (Harris and Hudson) on top of his replacement starter.  It'll take a quality bats at 1st, 2d and 3d to make up for the lost production from 2019.

https://twitter.com/dougherty_jesse/status/1202961631304716293

Offline CoryTheFormerExposFan

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #837: December 06, 2019, 11:01:53 AM »
I kind of feel like Zim will be the last guy to sign.  I think there is an understanding that they will build the rest of the roster the best they can, and Zim will basically get whatever money is left under the luxury threshhold. 

Offline Mattionals

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #838: December 06, 2019, 11:06:55 AM »
The nice thing is that both Rendon and Donaldson are available, and even though it's a steep drop off, Donaldson isn't garbage at 3B. Also, the market is rife with 2B. Just sign Didi for that and move Kieboom for Hader.

Offline Slateman

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #839: December 06, 2019, 11:09:49 AM »
The nice thing is that both Rendon and Donaldson are available, and even though it's a steep drop off, Donaldson isn't garbage at 3B. Also, the market is rife with 2B. Just sign Didi for that and move Kieboom for Hader.
Donaldson is the posterchild for age induced regression/decline. He's going to be 34 next season.

Offline RyanZimsKazoo

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #840: December 06, 2019, 11:20:35 AM »
IF we cant sign Rendon would you all be interested in trading for Kris Bryant? I think he might be available.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #841: December 06, 2019, 11:23:42 AM »
IF we cant sign Rendon would you all be interested in trading for Kris Bryant? I think he might be available.
Bryant is another short term fix, right?   his walk year is soon, maybe after next season.

Offline RyanZimsKazoo

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #842: December 06, 2019, 11:27:03 AM »
Bryant is another short term fix, right?   his walk year is soon, maybe after next season.
Maybe he might be willing to sign longer since hes younger? I think he could be had for 8/240

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #843: December 06, 2019, 11:34:46 AM »
Kendrick re-signing discussion moved to its own, Howie-centric thread

https://www.wnff.net/index.php?topic=38387.0

somewhere, VaRK is thinking about breakfast

Offline Slateman

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #844: December 06, 2019, 12:04:22 PM »
https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/washington-nationals/payroll/

Per Sportsrac, we have 70 million before we hit the luxury tax

Offline imref

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #845: December 06, 2019, 12:23:20 PM »
https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/washington-nationals/payroll/

Per Sportsrac, we have 70 million before we hit the luxury tax

with Kendrick, we're at $142 million per this https://www.rosterresource.com/mlb-washington-nationals-info/

Luxury tax kicks in at $208, so $66 million left and in addition to 3B and SP, we still need to do something at 1B (Figure Zimmerman on a 1/$5 million, and maybe another backup IF if we aren't going with Difo.  And, another couple of relief pitchers.  So that doesn't appear to leave enough for both Rendon and Strasburg if the Nats aren't willing to go over the cap.

Offline RyanZimsKazoo

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #846: December 06, 2019, 12:32:42 PM »
with Kendrick, we're at $142 million per this https://www.rosterresource.com/mlb-washington-nationals-info/

Luxury tax kicks in at $208, so $66 million left and in addition to 3B and SP, we still need to do something at 1B (Figure Zimmerman on a 1/$5 million, and maybe another backup IF if we aren't going with Difo.  And, another couple of relief pitchers.  So that doesn't appear to leave enough for both Rendon and Strasburg if the Nats aren't willing to go over the cap.
I want both back but I do not see it happening. Rendon wants shorter length high average. So with that being th ecase its almost 100% certain he wont be back.

It sucks but thats the nature of the business. Woulda loved him to retire a Nat but we had plenty of years to sign him. and truth be told if he had resigned bryce we never woulda signed Rendon.

Once max's money comes off the books that will just go straight to Soto anyways.

Offline nfotiu

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #847: December 06, 2019, 12:39:14 PM »
with Kendrick, we're at $142 million per this https://www.rosterresource.com/mlb-washington-nationals-info/

Luxury tax kicks in at $208, so $66 million left and in addition to 3B and SP, we still need to do something at 1B (Figure Zimmerman on a 1/$5 million, and maybe another backup IF if we aren't going with Difo.  And, another couple of relief pitchers.  So that doesn't appear to leave enough for both Rendon and Strasburg if the Nats aren't willing to go over the cap.


It's pretty easy to see why they think only one of those 2 contracts fits.   Meanwhile,

Quote
Give the Yankees credit for their strong push for Gerrit Cole and Stephen Strasburg this week, despite the likelihood that neither will end up in New York. A large swath of Yankees fans have turned against Hal Steinbrenner, somehow deciding he's a cheapskate, but the club's face-to-face meetings with both mega free agents say otherwise
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2865612-the-yankees-need-a-big-splash-in-free-agency-to-add-final-championship-piece?utm_source=cnn.com&utm_campaign=editorial&utm_medium=referral

If we think our owners/GM are cheap and/or suck, who exactly are we comparing them against?

Offline Slateman

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #848: December 06, 2019, 12:40:22 PM »
I want both back but I do not see it happening. Rendon wants shorter length high average. So with that being th ecase its almost 100% certain he wont be back.

It sucks but thats the nature of the business. Woulda loved him to retire a Nat but we had plenty of years to sign him. and truth be told if he had resigned bryce we never woulda signed Rendon.

Once max's money comes off the books that will just go straight to Soto anyways.

We didn't re-sign Bryce

Offline UMDNats

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Re: Hot Stove: 2019-2020 Offseason
« Reply #849: December 06, 2019, 12:47:13 PM »
Hilariousy dumb?  I'm not saying I'd do it...I'd want to feel really good about Hader's health and I don't know how many more years of control he has...but Kieboom isn't a prodigee prospect.  It is far from guaranteed he becomes a good big leaguer.  Hader has proven himself to be dominant in an area we are always sorely lacking.  I mean if we retained Rendon (and Stras) and flipped Kieboom for Hader...that positions us quite well to repeat.  2B isn't that difficult of a position to fill. 

Most of the time if I flip a top position player prospect it is for a SP or another position player. Trading prime assets for a reliever is a no-go for me almost always. Pretty much the only time I do is it like when the Cubs did it for Chapman in 2016 because he was the guy that put them over the top. Hader doesn't move the needle enough for this team in 2020 IMO. I would maybe consider it if we got Rendon and Strasburg back and hadn't won this year.