Doping Scandal: Zim, Peyton Manning, Ryan Howard, Others: Report

[HalfSmokes]

Clay Matthews weighs 300lbs right now and it's all muscle. When you look at his combine weight and even his weight two season ago there's something amiss.

when you look at any O-line, TE, or defensive front seven and compare them to a generation ago, there's something amiss

[MarquisDeSade]

when you look at any O-line, TE, or defensive front seven and compare them to a generation ago, there's something amiss

Some of that I can buy as changes in "legal" supplements and better nutrition and weight training.  What I can't and won't buy is someone like Clay Matthews bulking up 30+ pounds of pure muscle in less than two years.  We're not talking about a semi-fat guy that played DT putting on 30lbs to play a two gap nose tackle, we're talking about guys like Matthews (and Julius Peppers) suddenly putting on massive amounts of muscle and still keeping their speed. 

Has anyone explored any theories on why Sly picked Ryan Zimmerman to list?  Ryan Howard is an easy one, along with the others, but Ryan Zimmerman just seems like a weird name just to throw out in a "name-and-shame" sting.

[welch]

Has anyone explored any theories on why Sly picked Ryan Zimmerman to list?  Ryan Howard is an easy one, along with the others, but Ryan Zimmerman just seems like a weird name just to throw out in a "name-and-shame" sting.

My first guess: Sly knew a "Ryan" but couldn't remember which. Just threw in both Ryans who are star baseball players. Sly might be dumb as rocks.

David Simon quoting Baltimore homicide detectives in his "ride along" book: Homicide: A Year on the Killing Streets: "Stupid people commit crimes. Crime makes you stupid".

[imref]

Guyer released a statement noting that Sly was an unpaid intern for three months.  He of course denied the allegations. 

[Truconfidence]

Just watched it too. they had a good backstory to get in very quickly. I am just amazed how easy these guys meet up and stuff without any pardon the pun for this case hurdles to leap. They leave themselves pretty open to exposure.

[Slateman]

when you look at any O-line, TE, or defensive front seven and compare them to a generation ago, there's something amiss

Science and our understanding of the human body is leaps and bounds ahead of where it was a generation ago.

[HalfSmokes]

Guyer released a statement noting that Sly was an unpaid intern for three months.  He of course denied the allegations. 

if Sly can show any payment he's going to look a lot more credible.

Science and our understanding of the human body is leaps and bounds ahead of where it was a generation ago.

that and more sophisticated PEDs

[skippy1999]

if Sly can show any payment he's going to look a lot more credible.

That's the thing though, he doesn't WANT to look credible, he's probably scared to death and freaking out right now about the stuff he was doing in that documentary because it's probably all sorts of illegal what he was doing, I mean he had syringes of dope in his flippin' refrigerator! it is in his and Guyer's best interest to totally discredit this documentary any way they can. 

[Ray D]

When has anyone ever given any credence to the drivel that comes out of that network?

[Elvir Ovcina]

My first guess: Sly knew a "Ryan" but couldn't remember which. Just threw in both Ryans who are star baseball players. Sly might be dumb as rocks.

David Simon quoting Baltimore homicide detectives in his "ride along" book: Homicide: A Year on the Killing Streets: "Stupid people commit crimes. Crime makes you stupid".

There's a third Ryan who is a star and a rather well-known doper.

[imref]

here's the full statement by Dr. Guyer:

“I have no reason to believe these allegations are based in fact or have any truth.  In fact, I can say with absolute certainty they are not. I find it extremely disturbing that the source of Al Jazeera’s story, a former unpaid intern named Charles Sly, would violate the privacy of Mrs. Manning’s medical records and be so callous and destructive as to purposely fabricate and spread stories that are simply not true.

“I would emphasize that Mr. Sly was never an employee of the Guyer Institute and his brief three-month internship occurred in 2013 during which time Peyton was not even being treated or present in the office. I am proud to have treated Peyton and helped him through his rehabilitation. Mr. Manning is one of the most honorable and upstanding individuals I have had the pleasure of knowing.”

[HalfSmokes]

That's the thing though, he doesn't WANT to look credible, he's probably scared to death and freaking out right now about the stuff he was doing in that documentary because it's probably all sorts of illegal what he was doing, I mean he had syringes of dope in his flippin' refrigerator! it is in his and Guyer's best interest to totally discredit this documentary any way they can. 

if Zimm or Howard follow through and sue like they said they would, I'm guessing that one of the first things al jazeera does is subpoena Sly's bank records

[Mattionals]

If any of these players did in fact use PEDs, I think this time around the other side probably "failed to document" anything and this will likely come up bogus. That doesn't make them clean, but unless there is a shroud of evidence other than Liam Collins' story, this will go away.

[MarquisDeSade]

if Zimm or Howard follow through and sue like they said they would, I'm guessing that one of the first things al jazeera does is subpoena Sly's bank records

Good luck doing that with cash.  If these allegations are true I hope the accused were smart enough to pay through a fallguy through a fallguy through a fallguy. 

[HalfSmokes]

Good luck doing that with cash.  If these allegations are true I hope the accused were smart enough to pay through a fallguy through a fallguy through a fallguy. 

there's no way he did it for free- money in has to be explained. If not to al jazeera's lawyers, then to whatever US attorney wants to take up the fight for a little publicity (or to the IRS)

[skippy1999]

Good luck doing that with cash.  If these allegations are true I hope the accused were smart enough to pay through a fallguy through a fallguy through a fallguy. 

I think they've already covered those bases by saying Sly was an "unpaid intern" for Guyer. 

[skippy1999]

there's no way he did it for free- money in has to be explained. If not to al jazeera's lawyers, then to whatever US attorney wants to take up the fight for a little publicity (or to the IRS)

Wait, no way who did what for free? 

[HalfSmokes]

Wait, no way who did what for free? 

sly - the unpaid intern

[skippy1999]

sly - the unpaid intern

I think they've got him dead to rights for dealing dope out of his apartment but I'm not sure what they could subpoena to show he was working for Guyer dealing drugs if that was all done under the table.  Sly didn't willingly participate in this documentary so it's not like al Jazeera would've been paying for anything other than the drugs they were buying from him for their documentary. 

[MarquisDeSade]

there's no way he did it for free- money in has to be explained. If not to al jazeera's lawyers, then to whatever US attorney wants to take up the fight for a little publicity (or to the IRS)

You totally missed my point.  If he was paid in cash (unlike Paul Lo Duca buying PEDs with a personal check) good luck finding that during a forensic audit unless he foolishly deposited it.  Besides, if these guys were smart (doubtful) they do payments through a four deep LLC to an LLC owned by another LLC that's also four deep.  I used to do side work for a guy that was, to say the least, shady and that's exactly what he did.  If there was every any "incidents" like this it would take forever for them to figure out the money trail.

[HalfSmokes]

You totally missed my point.  If he was paid in cash (unlike Paul Lo Duca buying PEDs with a personal check) good luck finding that during a forensic audit unless he foolishly deposited it.  Besides, if these guys were smart (doubtful) they do payments through a four deep LLC to an LLC owned by another LLC that's also four deep.  I used to do side work for a guy that was, to say the least, shady and that's exactly what he did.  If there was every any "incidents" like this it would take forever for them to figure out the money trail.

like you said doubtful. They're probably smart enough to use cash, but do you want to bet they're smart enough that withdrawals and deposits don't line up? or that sly is smart enough to declare the income (i.e. to avoid having to testify when the IRS threatens him with undeclared income). Yes, these guys could criminal masterminds, but I'd seriously doubt it

[MarquisDeSade]

like you said doubtful. They're probably smart enough to use cash, but do you want to bet they're smart enough that withdrawals and deposits don't line up? or that sly is smart enough to declare the income (i.e. to avoid having to testify when the IRS threatens him with undeclared income). Yes, these guys could criminal masterminds, but I'd seriously doubt it

Obviously you haven't been keeping up with the issues with athlete "foundations".  Funneling money through "foundations" is how these morons (Adrian Peterson come on down) pay off potential baby mommas and fall guys without the issues you brought up.  The only part that makes all of this moot is if this moron Sly (who I fully suspect to find dead from suicide or a "car accident") deposited the money in something other than whores, coke, and a vault. 

[skippy1999]

The only part that makes all of this moot is if this moron Sly (who I fully suspect to find dead from suicide or a "car accident") deposited the money in something other than whores, coke, and a vault. 

did you see his "recantation" video?  he looks absolutely petrified. 

[Mattionals]

I guess we are really getting even closer to the line in the sand on what is and what is not a PED. Hell, Tommy John got a HUGE PED when Frank Jobe did his UCL surgery way back when. That is a significant performance enhancer from hanging them up to pitching again and making some money. Medicial science has come a very long way, and I think that while having guys hit 100 homers a year is in bad form (too much offense gets boring), keeping the highly paid players on the field is much better than watching them take a paycheck and sit on the bench.

[MarquisDeSade]

did you see his "recantation" video?  he looks absolutely petrified. 

He's still breathing so he's either about to get discredited or they haven't found a fallguy 10 fallguys deep to take him out yet.