Sludge/catcher in general

[Potomac Cannons]

After a 1st month - 6 weeks in which it looked like our ancient catcher pickup was back to some sort of meaningful offensive production reality has set in.

Since he doesn't have enough PAs to qualify for statistical ranking I simply went with all catchers and Sludge is 25th in WAR and 40th in VORP.  Several of us were clamoring for 4-5 other FA options at catcher and yet this is what we got.  Sludge can't hit at all, Wil can't play and Flores is more likely to have his arm amputated than play again.  It would be nice to be able to move some of our excess for a catcher who can actually play enough to be useful.

[Nathan]

I hear there's a Molina available

[cmdterps44]

I don't mind Pudge. He's good on defense. He just can't hit a low ball for crap.

[Smithian]

After a 1st month - 6 weeks in which it looked like our ancient catcher pickup was back to some sort of meaningful offensive production reality has set in.

Since he doesn't have enough PAs to qualify for statistical ranking I simply went with all catchers and Sludge is 25th in WAR and 40th in VORP.  Several of us were clamoring for 4-5 other FA options at catcher and yet this is what we got.  Sludge can't hit at all, Wil can't play and Flores is more likely to have his arm amputated than play again.  It would be nice to be able to move some of our excess for a catcher who can actually play enough to be useful.

You're joking if you honestly think all that is important at catcher is offense.

If we want to go max offense, let's just put Willingham at catcher and then put Ian Desmond/Guzman in LF, Mike Morse in RF, and let Nyjer and Bernadina fight it out offensively in CF. Actually, since all that matters to you is offense and not defense/leadership/lockerroom presence, let's go out and get Elijah Dukes back for CF.

[Nathan]

Dukes wasn't exactly an offensive powerhouse.

[Coladar]

I understand your points and agree with them. That said, a catcher should be at the bottom of the list of holes on this team. Bad as his hitting may be right now, he did show sparks early in the season, so it is within the realm of possibility his numbers go back up. But more so, as others said, catching isn't all about hitting. Pudge calls the pitching, and does a phenomenal job at it. I'd say he can claim at least half he credit for the phenomenal pitching we've had. Yes, we've had awful pitching this season, but that typically comes from pitchers who have no business on a major league roster. I don't believe Strasburg would be as amazing as he has been without Pudge. It wouldn't make a huge different considering his talent, but I believe it does make some. Case in point, look at Capps. Early in the season he was lights out. Pudge goes on the DL and that week with Nieves was when Capps blew two or three games after, I believe, not having blown any before that. Not a coincidence.

If it were our only problem, maybe look at other options. But we need a RF, 2B, lead-off hitter, CF, 1B if Dunn gets traded, an extra bullpen arm, a whole new bench minus Morse all long before we should worry about a catcher who simply has had a below-average six weeks. Like I said, I understand and agree with all your arguments. But I can't accept that catcher is a position we should be concerned or worried about at the present time. Now a backup catcher and I'm with you 100%. Nieves needs to go ASAP. He's twice as bad a hitter as Pudge at his worst, and as I explained, can't call games for crap. He has no above average, or even just average, tools as a catcher. But there's a big difference between trying to find a backup catcher and a starting catcher, so even though we do need to find a catcher now, it isn't the same as trying to find a replacement for Pudge.

[Potomac Cannons]

A catcher who is almost a guaranteed GIDP and whose OPS is routinely under .600 cannot be a starter no matter how good his defense and game calling are.  Sludge is not a MLB starting catcher at this point and the team has got to do something other than wait for Flores/Norris to get here.  This is where moving pieces for someone like Montero, or at least a guy who can start 3-4 times a week, is absolutely necessary.  Even a below average catcher would be a significant upgrade at this point.

[Coladar]

A catcher who is almost a guaranteed GIDP and whose OPS is routinely under .600 cannot be a starter no matter how good his defense and game calling are.  Sludge is not a MLB starting catcher at this point and the team has got to do something other than wait for Flores/Norris to get here.  This is where moving pieces for someone like Montero, or at least a guy who can start 3-4 times a week, is absolutely necessary.  Even a below average catcher would be a significant upgrade at this point.

I totally get the problem with the double plays, and I am hoping it is something they are working on. If it continues into late-August with the ridiculous amount of DPs, then I might agree that in the off-season, they have to find another starting catcher. Obviously those double plays are hurting us badly. But the season is lost, Pudge showed signs of promise until he went on the DL, we have plenty of other holes that should take priority and don't have any chance of turning around... This is something I feel should be given the rest of the season since his game-calling does offset some of the negatives, and there is a chance, however small, or turning it around.

[Evolution33]

Just make Pudge bunt every time there is a runner on first.

[PowerBoater69]

The only way the Pudge signing would have made sense is if we were sure that Flores was coming back and Pudge was the backup playing in about a third of the games.  Since it was already being rumored that Flores was not going to be ready in April, going into the season with Pudge and Nieves is a total failure on Rizzo's part.  As much as the team was criticized for overpaying Pudge he was a heck of a lot cheaper than a legitimate starter that could stick around for a few years.

[comish4lif]

After a 1st month - 6 weeks in which it looked like our ancient catcher pickup was back to some sort of meaningful offensive production reality has set in.

Since he doesn't have enough PAs to qualify for statistical ranking I simply went with all catchers and Sludge is 25th in WAR and 40th in VORP.  Several of us were clamoring for 4-5 other FA options at catcher and yet this is what we got.  Sludge can't hit at all, Wil can't play and Flores is more likely to have his arm amputated than play again.  It would be nice to be able to move some of our excess for a catcher who can actually play enough to be useful.

what excess?

[HalfSmokes]

You're joking if you honestly think all that is important at catcher is offense.

If we want to go max offense, let's just put Willingham at catcher and then put Ian Desmond/Guzman in LF, Mike Morse in RF, and let Nyjer and Bernadina fight it out offensively in CF. Actually, since all that matters to you is offense and not defense/leadership/lockerroom presence, let's go out and get Elijah Dukes back for CF.

that's true, but we also have offensive gaps at center field , second base, and shortstop.

[Evolution33]

The only way the Pudge signing would have made sense is if we were sure that Flores was coming back and Pudge was the backup playing in about a third of the games.  Since it was already being rumored that Flores was not going to be ready in April, going into the season with Pudge and Nieves is a total failure on Rizzo's part.  As much as the team was criticized for overpaying Pudge he was a heck of a lot cheaper than a legitimate starter that could stick around for a few years.

Like Jason Kendell? The best catcher signed this off-season was Rod Baragas and I think he is making less than Pudge.

[tomterp]

Nieves has been so bad that Pudge is being over used.  Sure would be nice to have a backup you didn't mind playing 3 times a week.

[HalfSmokes]

Nieves has been so bad that Pudge is being over used.  Sure would be nice to have a backup you didn't mind playing 3 times a week.

Has anyone from the team ever been asked why Nieves isn't just cut?

[Kevrock]

Well, I disagree with the thread. Dumping Pudge? C'mon...

We need a more serviceable backup catcher. It would also be nice if this team could acquire/identify a catcher of the future and have them be the backup catcher, working with and learning from Pudge.

[Lintyfresh85]

Norris is the catcher of the future.

He's just not far enough along in his development to play in the bigs.

[OldNatsFan]

Pudge probably came back too soon from his back injury so he could catch Strasburg. He hasn't hit since he came back.

[Fan037]

I see Nieves as the problem, not Pudge.  And I agree with the contingency here who feel we have worse problems than the starting catcher.  That play Pudge made to get the runner coming to the plate last night was HUGE.

[Kevrock]

Norris is the catcher of the future.

He's just not far enough along in his development to play in the bigs.

Right, so I've read. How many years off would Norris be?

[PowerBoater69]

Pudge probably came back too soon from his back injury so he could catch Strasburg. He hasn't hit since he came back.

Pudge came back early because of Stras, but also because Nieves stinks and Pudge wants his 3,000 hits.  The number is his primary motivation to play for a last place team at this point in his career.  He's our Bruce Smith, Kasten is looking to ramp up the hype machine next fall as the countdown begins.

[PowerBoater69]

I see Nieves as the problem, not Pudge.  And I agree with the contingency here who feel we have worse problems than the starting catcher.  That play Pudge made to get the runner coming to the plate last night was HUGE.

Bernadena gets the credit for the throw, Pudge made a good play but an MLB catcher is expected to make that play.

[hammondsnats]

as my dad said last night, pudge was brought in to play 80-100 games with flores playing the remainder.  wil nieves is that bad, where they are overusing pudge, imo. 

[blue911]

as my dad said last night, pudge was brought in to play 80-100 games with flores playing the remainder.  wil nieves is that bad, where they are overusing pudge, imo. 

Rodriguez is on pace to catch 876 innings. His innings totals for the past 5 years (starting in '09 and going back) are 962,930,1052,1054, & 1032. I don't think Nieves can be blamed for Rodriguez catching too much.

[CatsEye]

I don't think Nieves can be blamed for Rodriguez catching too much.

              And that would be a "Why do you say that"? And is there a blame-ee?