O-Dog (Orlando Hudson)

[HalfSmokes]

Oh hey I didn't know you were running the team?  Combined with his performance at the end of last year and the fact Riggleman likes Desmond, you never know. 

When has this team benched a vertran with a big contract in favor of a rookie based on spring training and a september call up?

[DPMOmaha]

When have we had a rookie good enough to unseat a vetran with a big contract?

[hammondsnats]

When has this team benched a vertran with a big contract in favor of a rookie based on spring training and a september call up?

Maybe with a new chief in town they will.  Could be you could factor in LAC and them not wanting to pay a player not to play, or it could've been the old GM forcing the manager to play one of his guys (Bowden w/ Pena) or it could just be the manager has a hard on for the player and ignores the crappy stats (Acta w/ Kearns). 

[HalfSmokes]

Maybe with a new chief in town they will.  Could be you could factor in LAC and them not wanting to pay a player not to play, or it could've been the old GM forcing the manager to play one of his guys (Bowden w/ Pena) or it could just be the manager has a hard on for the player and ignores the crappy stats (Acta w/ Kearns). 

Hopefully, but usually the guy with the contract plays, especially if 1. the team wants to trade him and 2. the team doesn't expect to be in contention

[sportsfan882]

This is so freaking ridiculous. Sign him now damnit 

[PatsNats28]

didnt have a big contract, but RZ over the godly vinny castilla

[Lintyfresh85]

This is so freaking ridiculous. Sign him now damnit 

Or else you'll post a rant?

[sportsfan882]

Or else you'll post a rant?

or else we will be nagging a few months from now watching Pete Orr play second base every day.

[JMW IV]

or else we will be nagging a few months from now watching Pete Orr play second base every day.

you said you'd rather have pete orr though.

[sportsfan882]

you said you'd rather have pete orr though.

Over Guzman? Probably. But having to rely on either one is embarrassing. I thought we were trying to be a Major League team for a change?

[JMW IV]

Over Guzman? Probably. But having to rely on either one is embarrassing. I thought we were trying to be a Major League team for a change?

i would not take pete orr over anyone. he is the exact definition of "replacement player"

[PANatsFan]

i would not take pete orr over anyone. he is the exact definition of "replacement player"

Yeah but Guz was below replacement value last year

[The Chief]

Yeah but Guz was below replacement value last year

But was he below replacement value/150?

[PANatsFan]

But was he below replacement value/150?

Actually smartass, I think if he'd gone down hurt at the ASB, he might have been sitting pretty

[The Chief]

smartass

[PANatsFan]

Actually, Fangraphs negative values just show Guzman was below AVERAGE both offensively and defensively.

We need the turtle to tell us his VORP.

[Obed_Marsh]

8.6 (#22) for Guzman in 2009. For comparison Ian Desmond (#23), had a 7.1 VORP for 2009.

[PANatsFan]

8.6 for Guzman in 2009. For comparison Ian Desmond, had a 7.1 VORP for 2009.

Thanks

The WNFF banner should say. "Fangraphs gives Value over Average, not VORP"

[The Chief]

I'm not trying to defend Guzman but a lot of you guys seem to think Hudson isn't really much of a defensive upgrade over Guzman at any position, while attributing a lot of value to his bat.  But is that really fair?

Guz had 74 runs and 52 RBIs in 135 games.
Hudson had 74 runs and 62 RBIs in 149 games.

Guz had 41 runs in the first half, 33 in the second
Hudson had 53 runs in the first half, 21 in the second

Guz had 24 RBIs in the first half, 28 in the second
Hudson had 48 RBIs in the first half, 14 in the second

And so on and so forth...

I'm not saying Guz is better or even equal, or that I necessarily want to see another full season of him, but I question how much of an offensive difference signing Hudson really makes, especially when we're already on the hook for Guzman's salary and most seem to want Desmond to play.

Guzman had 20 errors in 117 games in 2009.  Hudson had 8 in 145 games

Am I imagining things or haven't I been watching most of you talk about Hudson's superior offense and questionably better glove?  Five minutes of looking at the stats would seem to indicate the exact opposite to me, at least on the face of it.

[sportsfan882]

So what are you saying, Chief? That you are cised for a Guzman-Orr/AlGo middle infield this year? 

Hudson's OBP was .51 points higher than Guzman's in 2009. Hudson also outslugged him by .27 points.

[UMDNats]

I'm not trying to defend Guzman but a lot of you guys seem to think Hudson isn't really much of a defensive upgrade over Guzman at any position, while attributing a lot of value to his bat.  But is that really fair?

Guz had 74 runs and 52 RBIs in 135 games.
Hudson had 74 runs and 62 RBIs in 149 games.

Guz had 41 runs in the first half, 33 in the second
Hudson had 53 runs in the first half, 21 in the second

Guz had 24 RBIs in the first half, 28 in the second
Hudson had 48 RBIs in the first half, 14 in the second

And so on and so forth...

I'm not saying Guz is better or even equal, or that I necessarily want to see another full season of him, but I question how much of an offensive difference signing Hudson really makes, especially when we're already on the hook for Guzman's salary and most seem to want Desmond to play.

Guzman had 20 errors in 117 games in 2009.  Hudson had 8 in 145 games

Am I imagining things or haven't I been watching most of you talk about Hudson's superior offense and questionably better glove?  Five minutes of looking at the stats would seem to indicate the exact opposite to me, at least on the face of it.

I think everyone just wants a change from Guzman's "rarely strike out, get the occasional triple, hit. 290-.300, no walks" offense

[Obed_Marsh]

Orlando Hudson's 27.6 VORP tied him with Dan Uggla for #9/#10 slots among 2B in 2009. He'd improve the team but considering Guzman is a 10 & 5 guy I'm fearing that means he pushes out Ian Desmond and sticks at SS.

[The Chief]

So what are you saying, Chief? That you are cised for a Guzman-Orr/AlGo middle infield this year? 

I really hope you know that's not what I was saying at all.

Hudson's OBP was .51 points higher than Guzman's in 2009. Hudson also slugged him by .27 points.

Fat lot of good it did him.  127 runs produced in 149 games for Hudson, 120 runs produced in 135 games for Guzman.  If you have some additional insight, I welcome it, but the fact is that neither players' meaningful offensive contributions to their team last season differed much from the others'.

I think everyone just wants a change from Guzman's "rarely strike out, get the occasional triple, hit. 290-.300, no walks" offense

I'm just as guilty of this as anyone, I freely admit it.  I want Hudson to be signed, and I'd prefer Guzman benched or moved, but at least offensively, I have my doubts about how much difference it will make to the team one way or the other.

Orlando Hudson's 27.6 VORP tied him with Dan Uggla for #9/#10 slots among 2B in 2009. He'd improve the team but considering Guzman is a 10 & 5 guy I'm fearing that means he pushes out Ian Desmond and sticks at SS.

I bet NatsAddict would have something to say about that.

[Obed_Marsh]

I bet NatsAddict would have something to say about that.

Considering how bad the 2B options were last year. I'd even risk NatsAddict's ridicule by welcoming Uggla or even 'Replacement Player' at a bargin basement price.

I find it pathetic we couldn't even achieve 'Replacement Player' levels at 2B.

[Minty Fresh]

We shouldn't believe Adam Dunn because he's a jerk and therefore probably a liar too.  I mean seriously, how can you trust a guy who might not even be going to fanfest?

Win.