Hank Steinbrenner Pulls The Socialism Card

[Nat of the Living Dead]

Hank is such a whiney tool and comes off as a completely ignorant jackass.

Steinbrenner: Yankees too 'busy building mansions' in 2010
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/baseball/mlb/02/21/yankees.steinbrenner.ap/index.html?eref=sihp

TAMPA, Fla. (AP) -- Yankees co-chairman Hank Steinbrenner thinks his team's celebration of its 2009 World Series championship may have lasted too long.

"I think, maybe, they celebrated too much last year," Steinbrenner said Monday. "Some of the players, too busy building mansions and doing other things and not concentrating on winning. I have no problem saying that."

When it was pointed out that Yankees captain Derek Jeter was building a large multimillion dollar home in Tampa last year, Steinbrenner said he wasn't singling out any individual.

"I was just saying, maybe they were riding the wave of '09 a little too much, and it happens sometimes," Steinbrenner said. "This year in spring so far, from what I've seen and what I've been told, they've come in with a real, new drive and determination -- the kind they had in '09."

New York lost in the AL championship series last season to Texas after fading in the second half of the season and winding up with the AL wild card.

Steinbrenner also said baseball's revenue sharing and luxury tax programs need changes, and that Commissioner Bud Selig is open to the idea.

Steinbrenner said he doesn't know what the final figure is, but expects the Yankees' 2010 payments for the two to total about $130 million.

"We've got to do a little something about that, and I know Bud wants to correct it in some way," Steinbrenner said. "Obviously, we're very much allies with the Red Sox and the Mets, the Dodgers, the Cubs, whoever in that area."

"At some point, if you don't want to worry about teams in minor markets, don't put teams in minor markets, or don't leave teams in minor markets if they're truly minor," Steinbrenner said. "Socialism, communism, whatever you want to call it, is never the answer."

[PANatsFan]

[HalfSmokes]

for a man's whose financial well being has more to do with his mother spreading her legs for the right man than anything else, those are strong words

[shoeshineboy]

This is actually a pretty interesting column from last year about revenue sharing and actual spending in relation to revenue.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/joe_posnanski/04/19/baseball.revenue/index.html

Obviously, there is a lot of book cooking in baseball, so it is hard to know the whole truth. But this is a pretty compelling argument for the case that it isn't like the smaller market teams are merely profiting off the charity of the Yankees. The key take away being that the spending as a percentage of revenue is fairly consistent. Steinbrenner does recognize the difference between NYC and pretty much everywhere else, doesn't he? (Perhaps not.)

I'd be willing to cut them a little slack if they didn't have the added benefit of ESPN and Fox sports giving them constant national promotion at the expense of the smaller markets. By Steinbrenner's logic, the Yankees should be underwriting a portion of the cable TV expenses of the rest of the country.
 

[Tyler Durden]

If smaller market teams were run better, they'd have higher revenues.  Do you blame Pittsburgh fans for not showing up after 20 years of pathetic losing?  I don't.  The Pirates don't even try anymore.  Who did they sign this year - Kevin Correia and Lyle Overbay that I recall.  I wouldn't pay to watch that, either.

There has to be a way to force organizations to actually try to win - maybe a threat to take away their share of league-wide revenue if they don't reach certain benchmarks.  A 'no team left behind' type strategy.  Not sure if worked all that well with public schools, though.  Ha.

Steinbrenner is right that he is just subsidizing and even incentivizing the small market teams' underperformance right now.  If it weren't profitable, those owners would change their behaviors or sell their teams.

[HalfSmokes]

If smaller market teams were run better, they'd have higher revenues.

you do realize that after achieving the little guy goal of rising and competing, the Rays are now having to cut payroll (after most likely losing money last year) and just watched the core of their team walk? unless being better encourages a few million people to move to Pittsburgh and gets the team a better cable deal, they will never be in the same stratosphere in terms of revenue

[Lintyfresh85]

you do realize that after achieving the little guy goal of rising and competing, the Rays are now having to cut payroll (after most likely losing money last year) and just watched the core of their team walk? unless being better encourages a few million people to move to Pittsburgh and gets the team a better cable deal, they will never be in the same stratosphere in terms of revenue

The Rays couldn't draw the blue hair crowd to their games. If they were filling The Trop... they could have kept a lot more guys.

[Tyler Durden]

Yes, I did realize that.  The Rays are in a tough spot - if their model if winning and rebuilding works, they may be able to draw fans at a decent rate like some mid market teams out there.  They're still a 'young' team in that they don't have a long history in the area.  They may end up having to move, as well.  Too soon to tell.

But I wasn't talking about them.  I'm talking about the teams that have been losing for years and years are perfectly happy to continue along that path as long as they are being subsidized by the Yanks and Red Sox and whoever else.

To me, the Rays are a shining example of how it should work - a smaller market team getting some help to stay competitive.  The Pirates and the like are the disgusting warts of the system - 20 years of subsidized losing.

If you took away the Pirates funding and gave it to teams like the Rays, maybe they'd try harder.  Or maybe the Pirates' owners sell the team to someone who will try to win.  So the theory goes, anyway.  Like I said, it hasn't always quite worked out that way.

[HalfSmokes]

To me, the Rays are a shining example of how it should work - a smaller market team getting some help to stay competitive.  The Pirates and the like are the disgusting warts of the system - 20 years of subsidized losing.

the stay part may be the problem

[tomterp]

To me, the Rays are a shining example of how it should work - a smaller market team getting some help to stay competitive.  The Pirates and the like are the disgusting warts of the system - 20 years of subsidized losing.

If the subsidized teams started consistently beating the big market clubs, they (the Steinbrenner types) would be even more pissed off.

[CALSGR8]

If the small market teams can't survive, let them die and decrease the baseball population!   (Apologies to Charles Dickens Scrooge)

[JCA-CrystalCity]

SSB - great read.  Thanks.

When talking about market size, it still is a bit of a mystery to me how Cleveland can go for 7 or so years as the top draw in baseball yet still be considered a small market.  How much of the damage was self inflicted?  Toronto, too, especially after the Expos left.

Why is it that Tampa has a team and Charlotte does not?  After New York, Charlotte is the biggest financial center in the country.   It is a vibrant, growing area.  Good size population, too.  How is it that they don't have a team?

Philly is the team that we should now see is beginning to pay up to the size of its market.  Until the Meandering Madoff Men stragithen themsleves out, they could have quite the muscle for a long time.

Suppose you were to start over - no teams, no locations.  Would you  put a team in both Baltimore and DC / NoVa.  If yes, would the NoVa team be out by Tysons?  If no, would Baltimore not get a team?

I'm not sure if I buy Posnanski's analysis, precisely because his NYY number is so affected by the stadium move. It does not explain their behavior prior to the stadium swap. He also plays a bit quick with swtichign between operations budgets and payrolls.  Still, his basic point that the gap between  the NYY and #2/#3 dwarfs the gap between them and everyone else (40% of #1s revenues) is neat for us fans of the (not) Just as Evil Empire (and maybe frustrates fans of the Meandering Madoff Men too).

[Nat of the Living Dead]

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/02/22/bud-selig-tells-the-yankees-to-stop-their-complaining-about-revenue-sharing

Meanwhile, Bud Selig already has reached out to Hal Steinbrenner and president Randy Levine to remind them – to remind Hank – that there are to be no management comments about revenue sharing. There’s an MLB-wide gag order as we approach negotiations for a new collective bargaining agreement.

[tomterp]

SSB - great read.  Thanks.

When talking about market size, it still is a bit of a mystery to me how Cleveland can go for 7 or so years as the top draw in baseball yet still be considered a small market.  How much of the damage was self inflicted? 

Revenues derive from a fair amount more than attendance.

Average price per seat, for one thing.  And more importantly, TV/radio network revenues, which are highly dependent on the size of the market.  In small markets like Cleveland, if the park is full, who's left to watch on TV?   

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Revenues derive from a fair amount more than attendance.

Average price per seat, for one thing.  And more importantly, TV/radio network revenues, which are highly dependent on the size of the market.  In small markets like Cleveland, if the park is full, who's left to watch on TV?   

truth be told, I have no understanding of the economics of the Indians.  In the late 80s, they kind of rotated players through and replaced one generation of studs with another. In 2002, I think Shapiro broke up the team quickly after he inherited from John Hart.  That worked, but the team had the fall off in attendance and had a very short prime out of their restocked team.  They broke up the 2007 team, and seem to be a bit away from getting back in the mix despite a decent collection of prospects.  Their strategy now seems to be to contend with waves of players in a boom-bust manner.  perhaps it is as simple as the depressed economy, but I'd think they would have a pretty big population base in Northern Ohio (even if it is declining), and adding Columbus as AAA I think would help their stading vs. the Reds.  The Reds seem more a Kentucky / Indiana draw.

[Lintyfresh85]

If you win, people will fill the stadium and you'll be making bank.

Heck, back in the 90's the Indians broke the all-time sell out record that stood until the Red Sox got popular, again.

As for what happened with the team? Your guess is as good as mine... but if I had to name a culprit... Hart leaving was the biggest thing. He built the mid to late 90's Indians... Shapiro kind of just rode the wave and built one successful team in 2007.

[KnorrForYourMoney]

SSB - great read.  Thanks.

When talking about market size, it still is a bit of a mystery to me how Cleveland can go for 7 or so years as the top draw in baseball yet still be considered a small market.  How much of the damage was self inflicted?  Toronto, too, especially after the Expos left.

Why is it that Tampa has a team and Charlotte does not?  After New York, Charlotte is the biggest financial center in the country.   It is a vibrant, growing area.  Good size population, too.  How is it that they don't have a team?

The Rays were created in the late 90's.  Compare the combined populations of the Tampa Bay/Orlando metropolitan areas to the combined populations of Raleigh/Charlotte around that time, and you'll have your answer.

[PowerBoater69]

Revenue sharing is far and away our #1 biggest problem, since Lerner can reap huge profits with a losing team, he has no incentive to take any risks.  DC is a large market, as shown by our support for the Redskins, there is no reason why we shouldn't have one of the top 5-10 payrolls.

[NatsDad14]

Tampa Bay shouldn't have gotten a team in the first place. Contract all the Florida teams.

[Vega]

Tampa Bay shouldn't have gotten a team in the first place. Contract all the Florida teams.

I wouldn't go that far. Let's wait and see how the Marlins do in their new stadium first.

[Nathan]

Cheap Marlins doing well shows certain other owners that being cheap can work.



Oh!  Almost forgot.....

[Tyler Durden]

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/02/pirates-not-handcuffed-by-finances-says-owner.html

Pirates owner Bob Nutting:
-------------
"We are not handcuffed to where we have to make moves we don't want to make or we are unable to make moves we do want to make, purely because of financial reasons," Nutting said.

"As the players mature, we certainly believe we need to hold on to and sign some of these core players for a long term....Those are important steps that will come as we move forward."

"We certainly will not be in a position where we select based on dollars or signability," Nutting said. "We're going to select for the greatest impact."
------------

There are so many holes in the statements it's bordering on farce. 
'Purely financial reasons' = partly/mostly financial reasons
'sign some core players' = sign only some core players and trade others
'greatest impact' = draft college seniors only
If I was a Pirates fan, that would be my interpretation of this guy's comments.

[HalfSmokes]

I would give Huntington a shot since he seems to be improving things since he's been there, they have made some well above slot signings and they are putting together a nice core.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Revenue sharing is far and away our #1 biggest problem, since Lerner can reap huge profits with a losing team, he has no incentive to take any risks.  DC is a large market, as shown by our support for the Redskins, there is no reason why we shouldn't have one of the top 5-10 payrolls.

There ought to be a metric that measures the financial capacity of a market and then bases revenue sharing on the market potential rather than the actual revenues.  This would give teams an incentive to compete.  Clearly the Lerners would never see a dime, while a team like TB would qualify even if they max their market. 

No team in NY, Chi, LA, Phi, Bos, Tor, and probably Dallas, SF and Atl should ever see a dime of revenue from another team.