The Nats are...For Sale?!?

[nobleisthyname]

True. But baseball generates about twice the amount of revenue as a hockey team and about twice the total team salary so it's relative. A large market helps but  the Nats of 2012-2019 and currently the Brewers, Rays and Oakland (although not this year) has shown a good organization can be a consistent winner in MLB without being LA or NY.

Braves and Guardians can be added to that list as well. It's definitely possible to be a winning organization without the revenue of the Dodgers or Yankees. Astros seem to be there too.

[Natsinpwc]

I’m confused by some of this discussion.  The Nats were among the highest spending teams in the league during their run.  So the revenue may not have been as high as some teams but the spending was.  Of course not like the Dodgers but no one spends like them. You generally need to be among the top spending teams to compete. I mean the Pirates competed and made the playoffs a few years in a row until they decided to let all their better players go.

Let’s hope the old man Angelos does soon and his son decides he wants to make a deal on
MASN or even better sell the team.

[nfotiu]

I’m confused by some of this discussion.  The Nats were among the highest spending teams in the league during their run.  So the revenue may not have been as high as some teams but the spending was.  Of course not like the Dodgers but no one spends like them. You generally need to be among the top spending teams to compete. I mean the Pirates competed and made the playoffs a few years in a row until they decided to let all their better players go.

Let’s hope the old man Angelos does soon and his son decides he wants to make a deal on
MASN or even better sell the team.

Agreed.   There is a bit of a disconnect/confusion/missed nuance in the discussion of how the Nats spent their money.   It's a pretty easy hot take to look at the Nats losing Boras controlled Rendon, Harper, Scherzer, and Soto and saying we are a cheap ass development team.   

I'd argue that an owner willing to spend right up to the CBT limit, but apprehensive about committing to pay a single player 20-25% of that budget for 15 years is probably the pragmatic captain you'd want running the ship.

[Senatorswin]

I’m confused by some of this discussion.  The Nats were among the highest spending teams in the league during their run.  So the revenue may not have been as high as some teams but the spending was.  Of course not like the Dodgers but no one spends like them. You generally need to be among the top spending teams to compete. I mean the Pirates competed and made the playoffs a few years in a row until they decided to let all their better players go.

Let’s hope the old man Angelos does soon and his son decides he wants to make a deal on
MASN or even better sell the team.

The point is you CAN compete without being a top spending team. Again, look at the Rays, A's, Brewers as being consistently in the mix. In baseball, unlike the NBA, any team can have a short run toward the title like the Twins, Royals a few years ago, Guardians this year. The O's are a good example. Not much revenue generated but they've set themselves up to be a player for the next few years. The right owner and general manager to set up the system is paramount to success though.

[Natsinpwc]

The point is you CAN compete without being a top spending team. Again, look at the Rays, A's, Brewers as being consistently in the mix. In baseball, unlike the NBA, any team can have a short run toward the title like the Twins, Royals a few years ago, Guardians this year. The O's are a good example. Not much revenue generated but they've set themselves up to be a player for the next few years. The right owner and general manager to set up the system is paramount to success though.

Not really true.  The Rays are the only consistent exception.  The Brewers may not make the playoffs this year. The As are garbage.  Look at the top payroll list for teams and you basically have the playoff teams.  The Orioles are not poised for anything other than a regression next year, 

[Natsinpwc]

Agreed.   There is a bit of a disconnect/confusion/missed nuance in the discussion of how the Nats spent their money.   It's a pretty easy hot take to look at the Nats losing Boras controlled Rendon, Harper, Scherzer, and Soto and saying we are a cheap ass development team.   

I'd argue that an owner willing to spend right up to the CBT limit, but apprehensive about committing to pay a single player 20-25% of that budget for 15 years is probably the pragmatic captain you'd want running the ship.

Agree

[nobleisthyname]

Not really true.  The Rays are the only consistent exception.  The Brewers may not make the playoffs this year. The As are garbage.  Look at the top payroll list for teams and you basically have the playoff teams.  The Orioles are not poised for anything other than a regression next year,

Being a consistently well run organization doesn't mean you make the playoffs literally every season. I would argue it doesn't even mean not being bad every season. It's the avoiding multiple 90+ loss seasons in a row. Basically the retooling instead of full rebuilding that Rizzo tried to sell us on.

This isn't the first time the A's have been crap in the past decade, but they've shown time and again that their "rebuilds" are extremely short and so chances are they will be competitive again much sooner than we will, despite us starting our rebuild earlier.

[Slateman]

The Caps absolutely are. They used to be one of the worst, but since 2007-08 or so they redid their process and now they pump out NHL players at one of the best rates in the league, at one point they had produced like 5 NHL starting goaltenders playing concurrently (Varly, Neuvirth, Holtby, Grubauer, Samsonov/Vanecek). All this despite trading picks every year for NHL players. Having Ovechkin helps but they've sustained success because they are never in a situation like the Nats are now.

If that were the case, the Caps wouldnt be in the position they are in now, nor struggled to get production outside of their franchise players for over a decade at this point.

That goalie list outside of Holtby's tenure with DC is unremarkable. Heck, the last two simply highlight that failure even more. Those guys were let go to sign a high priced free agent goalie.

Theyve repeatedly moved guys and gotten less in return. The only young player they've really developed is Wilson at this point. Kuzy is a bust at this point. Vrana took off once he left DC.

I think its extremely telling that the only time that the Ovichekin era Caps got past the second round was the year when league talent depth was at its lowest

[Natsinpwc]

Being a consistently well run organization doesn't mean you make the playoffs literally every season. I would argue it doesn't even mean not being bad every season. It's the avoiding multiple 90+ loss seasons in a row. Basically the retooling instead of full rebuilding that Rizzo tried to sell us on.

This isn't the first time the A's have been crap in the past decade, but they've shown time and again that their "rebuilds" are extremely short and so chances are they will be competitive again much sooner than we will, despite us starting our rebuild earlier.

Sure. But their future looks kind of bleak now. As do the Royals and Pirates and a few others even though they have some very good young players. Eventually if your young players get good you have to pay them more and sign free agents to make you competitive. The Rays seem the only consistent exception to that to me. We will see what happens the next couple years with teams like Cleveland and Baltimore.

Generally look at the lowest payroll teams and you have the bottom teams in the league as far as record goes. The Nats payroll will continue to go down and they will be a 85-95 loss team for a few years unless new owners spend some money trying to patch holes.

[PowerBoater69]

Leonsis should just wait and buy the Os, then he'd control all of the local sports broadcast rights.

A new report out suggests that Leonsis may be also interested in buying the Os. He just wants the TV rights, he doesn't care about which ballclub he buys. If this happens he becomes Angelos II, controlling the Nats TV rights and fighting us for a bigger share of the profits.

https://frontofficesports.com/leonsis-adds-baltimore-orioles-to-shopping-list/

[HalfSmokes]

Being a consistently well run organization doesn't mean you make the playoffs literally every season. I would argue it doesn't even mean not being bad every season. It's the avoiding multiple 90+ loss seasons in a row. Basically the retooling instead of full rebuilding that Rizzo tried to sell us on.

This isn't the first time the A's have been crap in the past decade, but they've shown time and again that their "rebuilds" are extremely short and so chances are they will be competitive again much sooner than we will, despite us starting our rebuild earlier.

The As are consistently mediocre. Do we really want to be the Brewers or the Os? They aspire to occasional mediocrity. Of the three teams none have been in the World Series since 1990. The furthest the Brewers have gotten recently is a 2018 NLCS loss, the Os haven't gotten that far since 2014 and the As since 2006.

[HalfSmokes]

A new report out suggests that Leonsis may be also interested in buying the Os. He just wants the TV rights, he doesn't care about which ballclub he buys. If this happens he becomes Angelos II, controlling the Nats TV rights and fighting us for a bigger share of the profits.

https://frontofficesports.com/leonsis-adds-baltimore-orioles-to-shopping-list/

If it's about building up monumental, that's the better move. The only question is whether the Nats have rights through MASN that can gum up the move to monumental. I find it hilarious that Forbes ranks the Nationals as the 12th most valuable franchise and the Os as the 22nd given that the Os literally own the most valuable piece of the DC franchise.

[machpost]

A new report out suggests that Leonsis may be also interested in buying the Os. He just wants the TV rights, he doesn't care about which ballclub he buys. If this happens he becomes Angelos II, controlling the Nats TV rights and fighting us for a bigger share of the profits.

https://frontofficesports.com/leonsis-adds-baltimore-orioles-to-shopping-list/

The League still doesn't allow one person/group to own more than one MLB team, correct?

[UMDNats]

If that were the case, the Caps wouldnt be in the position they are in now, nor struggled to get production outside of their franchise players for over a decade at this point.

That goalie list outside of Holtby's tenure with DC is unremarkable. Heck, the last two simply highlight that failure even more. Those guys were let go to sign a high priced free agent goalie.

Theyve repeatedly moved guys and gotten less in return. The only young player they've really developed is Wilson at this point. Kuzy is a bust at this point. Vrana took off once he left DC.

I think its extremely telling that the only time that the Ovichekin era Caps got past the second round was the year when league talent depth was at its lowest

congrats, everything you just said was wrong

[PowerBoater69]

The League still doesn't allow one person/group to own more than one MLB team, correct?

Definitely that is not allowed. My suspicion is that Leonsis would buy the Os instead of the Nats in order to get the TV rights. The Angelos family would not necessarily sell the broadcast rights to Leonsis if he bought the Nats, based on past history they probably would not sell out to him. However if Angelos buys the Os instead he gets MASN as part of the package. The one ray of hope is that MLB could force the Os to sell the Nats broadcast rights back to the Nats ownership group prior to a sale of the Os.

[Natsinpwc]

congrats, everything you just said was wrong

They've had a good run but it's just about over.  Backstrom is finished and almost all their top players are 32 or older.  Kuzy being the exception.  He had a good season after a downer the year before.  And getting Oshie was a brilliant move.  They hit Gold with Ovi and Silver with Backstrim, Carlson and a few others in the draft.  I mean even Holtby somehow peaked in 2018.  He was not that great before and certainly not after. 

I predict they won't make the playoffs this year.  Several East teams are getting better.  It was a darn good run though although without the Cup it woud have been deemed a disaster.  Let's see how they handle the rebuild or retool or whatever they call it.  McClellan seems a good GM. Not sure why Ted cannot find someone good like that to run the Wizards. 

[Kevrock]

It makes me cringe that the Orioles could get a huge amount of cash for our media rights right when they become competitive, after trying to choke us during our competition window.

[Ali the Baseball Cat]

Brouwer retired after some pretty meh years after being traded, so yeah

And getting Oshie was a brilliant move. 

[imref]

@TalkNats

BREAKING: Source tells us the Leonsis group is the most likely to buy the #Nats if the Rubik's Cube known as the MASN debacle can get solved. h/t to @PowerBoater69

[Five Banners]

@TalkNats

BREAKING: Source tells us the Leonsis group is the most likely to buy the #Nats if the Rubik's Cube known as the MASN debacle can get solved. h/t to @PowerBoater69

And if it can’t, they buy the Orioles, and the mess here likely continues? Seems like many possible lose-lose scenarios may be in the offing.

[Slateman]

Welp, pretty much the worst case scenario for Nationals fans.

Leonsis is only 65 years old too. So at least 20 years of mediocrity ahead of us.

[PowerBoater69]

@TalkNats
BREAKING: Source tells us the Leonsis group is the most likely to buy the #Nats if the Rubik's Cube known as the MASN debacle can get solved. h/t to @PowerBoater69

Two parts. I heard that Leonsis has a right of last refusal deal, second hand info but would be a big indication that he is the front runner. Talk Nats contacted a number of people and found that Leonsis is working hard to find an end to the MASN deal, at least it's current structure, prior to purchasing the team. The fear is that this means it is less likely that the new owner will be in place by December, to the detriment of both the Nats and Os in 2023.

The Nats could do a lot worse than Leonsis, but I don't see him going straight to "win now" mode, he's more of a "rebuild the right way" kind of owner.

[HalfSmokes]

Welp, pretty much the worst case scenario for Nationals fans.

Leonsis is only 65 years old too. So at least 20 years of mediocrity ahead of us.

There is zero chance MASN is solvable unless he’s willing to pay them fair value for the nats TV rights. If he is, are the lerners willing to sell at a number that reflects that massive a payment to the Os?

[HalfSmokes]

Two parts. I heard that Leonsis has a right of last refusal deal, second hand info but would be a big indication that he is the front runner. Talk Nats contacted a number of people and found that Leonsis is working hard to find an end to the MASN deal, at least it's current structure, prior to purchasing the team. The fear is that this means it is less likely that the new owner will be in place by December, to the detriment of both the Nats and Os in 2023.

The Nats could do a lot worse than Leonsis, but I don't see him going straight to "win now" mode, he's more of a "rebuild the right way" kind of owner.

With the Wizards, he seems to be a mediocrity is ok kind of owner.

[Natsinpwc]

There is zero chance MASN is solvable unless he’s willing to pay them fair value for the nats TV rights. If he is, are the lerners willing to sell at a number that reflects that massive a payment to the Os?

If the BLOS want to sell their team don’t they need to come to the table with the Nats and make a reasonable deal?