CBA Negotiations- 2022

[Elvir Ovcina]

One of the first things that would be demanded of an expansion or relocation city would be a very nice very new purpose built stadium

Yes.  Taxpayer-funded stadiums are perhaps the most galling aspect of the American sporting landscape to me. 

[JCA-CrystalCity]

It sorta boggles my mind that they didn't build the new baseball stadium there in a way that allowed it to expand to MLB dimensions.  When constructed, the land was certainly there, the location's great, etc.

Of course, I live in another TN city that was stupid about baseball stadiums, so I'm in no place to talk.

bristol?  If yes, are you sure you live in TN?

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Yes.  Taxpayer-funded stadiums are perhaps the most galling aspect of the American sporting landscape to me. 

I hated the criminal / SOB, but the old House Speaker in Massachusetts, Tom Finneran, was one of the first powerful politicians to call BS on public finance.  The Pats almost moved to Hartford when he refused to pay for a stadium on the Boston waterfront that Kraft wanted.  Said at the time, "I'm not spending taxpayer money for fat-ass millionaires."  Ultimately, Kraft realized he'd make more money off of his land in Foxborough, so he backed out of the Hartford deal in exchange for some upgrades on the stretch of Route 1 by the stadium entrance.  When the legislature did pass some support for a Fenway rebuild, it agreed to pay for a parking facility, but the terms of the financing that the state stuck the Red Sox with were so state-favorable that no bank would finance the park for the Yawkey Trust.  When they bought the team, the Henry group then figured out they could upgrade the historic footprint without changing the look of the field significantly, and they ended up abandoning the new park.  Folks almost don't realize that the wall seats and most of the second deck seating is less than 2 decades old.

[Elvir Ovcina]

bristol?  If yes, are you sure you live in TN?

No, and yes.

[nfotiu]

Yes.  Taxpayer-funded stadiums are perhaps the most galling aspect of the American sporting landscape to me. 

It kind of boggles the mind that the public has put up with this for so long.

What does it cost to finance a billion dollar stadium?  50 mill/year?    They can pay their players 200 million/year but can't pay 50 million/year for a stadium?     Maybe the players should only be getting 150 then!   

Stadiums used to last 50 years or more, and there is no reason they shouldn't still.    The pitch is always they need all these fancy things to bring in new revenue streams.  The new revenue streams just means getting the public to pay even more.    Taxpayers have to fund these new stadiums so they can pay even more to watch the games.  Fun!    I really wonder what pro sports is going to look like in 20-30 years in this country.   It's all going to collapse under it's own greed, I think.

[HalfSmokes]

It kind of boggles the mind that the public has put up with this for so long.

What does it cost to finance a billion dollar stadium?  50 mill/year?    They can pay their players 200 million/year but can't pay 50 million/year for a stadium?     Maybe the players should only be getting 150 then!   

Stadiums used to last 50 years or more, and there is no reason they shouldn't still.    The pitch is always they need all these fancy things to bring in new revenue streams.  The new revenue streams just means getting the public to pay even more.    Taxpayers have to fund these new stadiums so they can pay even more to watch the games.  Fun!    I really wonder what pro sports is going to look like in 20-30 years in this country.   It's all going to collapse under it's own greed, I think.

Certain cities can stand up to owners - no-one is dumb enough to leave LA again, but others have the choice of caving or losing their team. The commanders will be interesting with the number of jurisdictions to play off each other. The wrench is that Snyder is hated and most localities don't want the stadium

[nfotiu]

Certain cities can stand up to owners - no-one is dumb enough to leave LA again, but others have the choice of caving or losing their team. The commanders will be interesting with the number of jurisdictions to play off each other. The wrench is that Snyder is hated and most localities don't want the stadium

Yeah, I realize that playing municipalities against each other is how we got here.   I'd love to see a national ban on publicly funded major pro sports stadiums.   It really would be in the best interest of everyone who is not a pro sports owner or pro athlete.   That must account for 99.999% of the public.

Each iteration of these new stadiums price out their real fans, and that should be more of a concern to these owners.   If the general public is priced out and stops caring about a team, then there's nothing special about these luxury suites any more, and demand for them goes away too.

[UMDNats]

I'd love to see a national ban on publicly funded major pro sports stadiums.   It really would be in the best interest of everyone who is not a pro sports owner or pro athlete.

Sadly the politicians get lobbied (paid) to do the stadium deals so they love promoting them. Look at Atlanta - the team basically went and bought the entire Cobb County political realm to get their stadium deal full public funding. All it takes to bribe a local public official is the promise of cool box suites at the new stadium, maybe some money coming into their small business and the promise of rubbing shoulders with some "important" people.

They all stand to make bank on stadium deals as they are connected to the firms that do the building, concessions, landscaping, whatever. It's all a scam in the name of greed and the people at the top make fat stacks while the rest of us get stuck paying $50+fees for a nosebleed seat for Nats-Mets in August and shove a $15 hot dog down our gullets.

[Elvir Ovcina]

Maybe Manfred and Vlad Putin should switch jobs.  Might solve two issues at once.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Yeah, I realize that playing municipalities against each other is how we got here.   I'd love to see a national ban on publicly funded major pro sports stadiums.   It really would be in the best interest of everyone who is not a pro sports owner or pro athlete.   That must account for 99.999% of the public.

Each iteration of these new stadiums price out their real fans, and that should be more of a concern to these owners.   If the general public is priced out and stops caring about a team, then there's nothing special about these luxury suites any more, and demand for them goes away too.

I forget the tax code on development bonds or government-guaranteed loans, but if the interest were treated as ordinary income instead of tax-free or 15%, then I think it would make it a lot more expensive to float bonds to finance these deals.

[Natsinpwc]

Maybe Manfred and Vlad Putin should switch jobs.  Might solve two issues at once.

Oh I don’t know. Could be even worse.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Maybe Manfred and Vlad Putin should switch jobs.  Might solve two issues at once.

Manfred: "We don't believe Ukraine is negotiating its capitulation in good faith, therefore we are locking them out of Mariupol, their power plants, and the Donbass."

"Players can report to camps.  Either Spring training camps or special camps I've set up for 'negotiations.'"

[aspenbubba]

Manfred: "We don't believe Ukraine is negotiating its capitulation in good faith, therefore we are locking them out of Mariupol, their power plants, and the Donbass."

"Players can report to camps.  Either Spring training camps or special camps I've set up for 'negotiations.'"

POTY

[nfotiu]

I'd send Boras over there too.   Maybe have him rep the Ukrainian Nuclear plant workers and get them to hold out for a better deal.

[Elvir Ovcina]

Manfred: "We don't believe Ukraine is negotiating its capitulation in good faith, therefore we are locking them out of Mariupol, their power plants, and the Donbass."

"Players can report to camps.  Either Spring training camps or special camps I've set up for 'negotiations.'"

Manfred might also view it as just "better organizing" Minor League Russia by eliminating 25% of it.

[imref]

Players are open to a 14 team playoff if highest ranked teams start best of three series up 1-0

[Five Banners]

Players are open to a 14 team playoff if highest ranked teams start best of three series up 1-0

And the bases loaded for them every inning

[HalfSmokes]

Blenrsball here we come

[Natsinpwc]

I'd send Boras over there too.   Maybe have him rep the Ukrainian Nuclear plant workers and get them to hold out for a better deal.

The Lerners could work out a deal with Putin for deferred sanctions.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Manfred might also view it as just "better organizing" Minor League Russia by eliminating 25% of it.

[Five Banners]

Manfred might also view it as just "better organizing" Minor League Russia by eliminating 25% of it.

In Soviet Russia, signs steal you

[rileyn]

Getting closer.

[Natsinpwc]

So MLB wants a fourth luxury tax surcharge level.  Oh cmon. Just get a deal and stop putting in new things each time you make an offer.

[blue911]

So MLB wants a fourth luxury tax surcharge level.  Oh cmon. Just get a deal and stop putting in new things each time you make an offer.

A sure sign of incompetence.

[Elvir Ovcina]

A sure sign of incompetence.

Or deliberate stalling.  They seem to think (probably correctly) that they get more leverage the longer this goes. 

Unfortunately, the longer it goes the more it annoys the fans.  And while the owners seem to think some/many/all of the fans will blame the players for this mess, it's unclear why they think that or why it benefits them anyway.  When they're done with this, they might just be fighting over the revenue left from the few folks who were too drunk to change the channel.