Author Topic: Should something be done about Zimmerman?  (Read 3868 times)

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Offline Kenz aFan

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #25: June 30, 2007, 09:37:03 PM »
Are you comparing Ryan Zimmerman to Wil Cordero?

Oh, for Petesakes, learn to read... I said that even Wil Cordero would be productive under the same circumstances as Zimmerman was in last season.

Offline ronnynat

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #26: June 30, 2007, 11:54:59 PM »
Oh, for Petesakes, learn to read... I said that even Wil Cordero would be productive under the same circumstances as Zimmerman was in last season.
I believe you said "as productive" originally...and that'd be wrong. You should learn to read what you write.

Offline Ericas Nats

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #27: July 01, 2007, 12:05:48 AM »
I believe you said "as productive" originally...and that'd be wrong. You should learn to read what you write.

OHH SNAP!.....

haha boys, be nice! :-)

Offline ronnynat

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #28: July 01, 2007, 12:10:53 AM »
Hey, I tried to be nice earlier:

http://www.wnff.net/index.php/topic,2864.50.html

Offline Ericas Nats

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #29: July 01, 2007, 12:13:38 AM »
Hey, I tried to be nice earlier:

http://www.wnff.net/index.php/topic,2864.50.html

oh i know, i was just messing with you both!


:-P

Offline Kenz aFan

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #30: July 01, 2007, 02:34:26 AM »
I believe you said "as productive" originally...and that'd be wrong. You should learn to read what you write.

Are you frigging nuts?  What's the difference between "as productive hitting under the same circumstances" and "would be productive under the same circumstances" ?????  The answer is, there is none, because they're saying the same thing.

I didn't have to use Wil Cordero for the comparison, I could have used a monkey with a stick. The point I was making was, without help or bats in front of him like last year, Zimmerman isn't the stud everyone saw last season.

Offline ronnynat

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #31: July 01, 2007, 03:50:43 AM »
I didn't have to use Wil Cordero for the comparison, I could have used a monkey with a stick. The point I was making was, without help or bats in front of him like last year, Zimmerman isn't the stud everyone saw last season.

Wouldn't that mean that his (Zimmerman's) numbers would be way down? As far as I can see it, he's just a few RBIs down and on pace for more home runs. I could bring up Wil Cordero's numbers if you'd like? Use your toolbar, man. Get some good info, then get back to me.

Offline Kenz aFan

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #32: July 01, 2007, 11:25:30 AM »
Never mind, you obviously don't get my meaning...

Offline 2k6nats

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #33: July 01, 2007, 11:30:14 AM »
Never mind, you obviously don't get my meaning...

Here's how I make of all this (if anyone cares):

You said that Cordero would be as productive as Zimmerman when placed under his current circumstance.  Of course that is untrue, however, you were (I think) trying to make a metaphor that NOBODY could produce under his circumstance, which I completely agree with.

Okay...let's move on...

Offline Ericas Nats

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #34: July 01, 2007, 11:48:00 AM »


Okay...let's move on...

 ON THE ROAD AGAIN!

lol

Offline Kenz aFan

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #35: July 01, 2007, 11:54:09 AM »
Here's how I make of all this (if anyone cares):

You said that Cordero would be as productive as Zimmerman when placed under his current circumstance.  Of course that is untrue, however, you were (I think) trying to make a metaphor that NOBODY could produce under his circumstance, which I completely agree with.

Okay...let's move on...

I'm sorry, but I'm guessing you like ronnynat aren't seeing what I wrote in my initial post. Let's look at what I said, and I quote, "He showed that with the help of big bats in front of him he can produce, because he saw more fastballs. Hell, Wil Cordero would be just as productive hitting under the same circumstances."

OK, now let me break that down for you.
1) He showed that with the help of big bats in front of him he can produce (meaning he had Soriano and/or Johnson in front of him most of the year)
2) because he saw more fastballs. (with the big bats in front of him, he saw more fastballs, and less off-speed stuff)
3) Hell, Wil Cordero would be just as productive hitting under the same circumstances. (For one, Cordero was used to push my point across, that anyone who's supposed to be a "hitter" would be "as productive", or as successful.

The whole point of my post was to say that, WHO is hitting in front of you (or behind you in some cases) in the batting order has a great deal to do with well you produce. I guess my writing methods are off the board, because neither of you was able to read the meaning behind what I did write. And you should also take note of the non use of the word "current".

Class dismissed...

Offline 2k6nats

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #36: July 01, 2007, 11:57:59 AM »
The whole point of my post was to say that, WHO is hitting in front of you (or behind you in some cases) in the batting order has a great deal to do with well you produce. I guess my writing methods are off the board, because neither of you was able to read the meaning behind what I did write. And you should also take note of the non use of the word "current".

Class dismissed...

I think the joke's on you if it takes a huge explanation just to figure out what you were talking about :?

Offline Kenz aFan

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #37: July 01, 2007, 12:01:05 PM »
I think the joke's on you if it takes a huge explanation just to figure out what you were talking about :?

You're absolutely right, the joke is on me, for assuming all the posters on this board knew how to read.

Offline spidernat

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #38: July 01, 2007, 12:52:56 PM »
The way I read it was that Ken was using Wil Cordero in a hyperbolic sense to frame his point that Zimmerman's production (last year) was aided along by the bats around him. I think the misunderstanding illustrates what JMadison posted in another thread about Zimmerman's 'golden boy' image. In other words, that he can do no wrong, even when he's failing at the plate, and that people take offense to his being mentioned in the same breath with the likes of Wil Cordero. But let's face it, Zimmerman is a nice player but he has yet to ascend to Albert Pujols status. Some guys can hit surrounded by a bunch of Wil Cordero's in the lineup while some guys can't. BTW, would anyone seriously object to mentioning Ryan Zimmerman in the same breath with the likes of Albert Pujols? I doubt it.  :lol:

Offline ronnynat

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #39: July 01, 2007, 04:49:03 PM »
The way I read it was that Ken was using Wil Cordero in a hyperbolic sense to frame his point that Zimmerman's production (last year) was aided along by the bats around him. I think the misunderstanding illustrates what JMadison posted in another thread about Zimmerman's 'golden boy' image. In other words, that he can do no wrong, even when he's failing at the plate, and that people take offense to his being mentioned in the same breath with the likes of Wil Cordero. But let's face it, Zimmerman is a nice player but he has yet to ascend to Albert Pujols status. Some guys can hit surrounded by a bunch of Wil Cordero's in the lineup while some guys can't. BTW, would anyone seriously object to mentioning Ryan Zimmerman in the same breath with the likes of Albert Pujols? I doubt it.  :lol:

Good points. It's hard for me not to respond when I think someone is comparing Zimmerman to Wil Cordero, in any sense. It'd all make sense to me if Zimmerman was doing that much worse than last year, but he's not. It's not my assumption that his average will stay down, regardless, because it's too early to tell and that many more plate appearances can only help him to get it up. I know there were more than a few misunderstandings, but what do we expect? It's odd defending a Nats player against another Nats fan. Really odd.

Offline spidernat

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #40: July 01, 2007, 04:56:38 PM »
Yeah but considering how dismal Wil Cordero was in his stint as a National (and clearly he was one of the worst players we've ever had) I almost don't blame you for attempting to defend him. Having said, I don't think Ken's intention was to compare the two in a serious sense, just the hypothetical circumstances.

BTW, I noticed you didn't attend the game thread and curiously we won.....  :lol:

Offline ronnynat

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #41: July 01, 2007, 04:58:06 PM »
BTW, I noticed you didn't attend the game thread and curiously we won.....  :lol:

I know, I know. But I got my word in at the end.

Offline shoeshineboy

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #42: July 01, 2007, 05:11:30 PM »
It'd all make sense to me if Zimmerman was doing that much worse than last year, but he's not.

But he is doing much worse than last year. His stat line is .245/.294/.420. That's much lower than last year and his career numbers overall. It's actually far worse than any point in his brief pro career. Granted, the guy has hit 12 HRs, but he's done that after 331 ABs while failing to maintain an above .300 on-base percentage. His OBP is pathetic for a 3-hole hitter. Does that mean he won't improve? No. This has nothing to do with Zimmerman's potential for greatness or whatever anyone wants to project going forward. It has to do with the fact that his productivity at the plate this season so far has been horrible. He's not alone, but I am not going to act like this guy is having anything close to last season when the numbers suggest someone who is basically hacking for the fences at every at bat rather than trying to get on base and help the lineup score runs. I'm not saying that's all he's trying to do. I'm just saying that those are his numbers and that we shouldn't be excited about 12 HRs from a number 3 hitter unable to get on base more often than almost every regular in the lineup or Robert Fick.

I don't care that he's only 22. So is Jesus Flores, and he shouldn't be batting 3rd either.

Offline ronnynat

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #43: July 01, 2007, 05:29:33 PM »
Well, let's just all hope he has a great second half. I wouldn't mind him moving to #5, but he'll probably stay at #3 or move to #4 when Dmitri leaves. Then, it's really all going to be on him. He's not getting to many at-bats w/ people on base (especially in the first, which dictates the whole game a lot of time for hitters), which is why I give him some credit for keeping those numbers up, somewhat.

Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #44: July 01, 2007, 07:19:01 PM »
ya know what, i would take zim's slump over JP's & escabar's DL stint any day...

Ya know what, I just bet that JP and Escobar would too.  It an't no fun to be on the DL!

Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #45: July 01, 2007, 07:22:45 PM »
Where's this coming from? Is there documentation about Church's injury?  :icon_mrgreen:

When have most of the posters on this board worried about documentation???

Offline spidernat

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Re: Someting has to be done about ZImmerman?
« Reply #46: July 01, 2007, 07:53:15 PM »
When have most of the posters on this board worried about documentation???

It was ¼ joke, ¼ sarcasm and ½  :roll:

But while we're at it, people at this forum do care about documentation. The problem is that you take offense to everything that is said that doesn't  :worship: JP. Most people here are concerned with the Nationals, first and foremost, and have therefore accepted the reality that JP cannot be counted on to contribute to this organization.

As I said earlier, maybe JP can get beamed up to the Enterprise to see if Dr. 'Bones' McCoy can fix his arm   :icon_mrgreen:

Offline The Chief

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Re: Should something be done about Zimmerman?
« Reply #47: July 01, 2007, 07:53:20 PM »
I fixed your thread title, metssuck.  Sorry, it was driving me nuts ;)

Offline spidernat

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Re: Should something be done about Zimmerman?
« Reply #48: July 01, 2007, 08:03:03 PM »
I fixed your thread title, metssuck.  Sorry, it was driving me nuts ;)

I guess I didn't pay much attention to it. What did it say before you fixed it Chief?

Offline Kenz aFan

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Re: Should something be done about Zimmerman?
« Reply #49: July 01, 2007, 08:13:30 PM »
When have most of the posters on this board worried about documentation???

YEAH, what she said....