The Weather (2017)

[bluestreak]

U.S. response in Puerto Rico pales next to actions after Haiti quake - The Washington Post
https://apple.news/AID56Z8OaSCi8MriIwXLlDQ

There are many complicating factors but I think this shows that we *could* have done more considering last time I checked:
1) earthquakes come with less warning than Hurricanes
2) Haiti is an island in the Greater Antilles
3) Haiti has poor infrastructure.

I don’t find the excuse that they are waiting to be asked to be compelling. But others may differ.

[Slateman]

Two days after Katrina, did George Bush mention poor infrastructure or debts? Two days after Sandy was Obama saying how logistically difficult it was? Both these guys said “this is awful and we will do whatever it takes.” It was unqualified.

This was not the response that came after Maria. And in many ways the response from the top sets the tone for how the whole country sees the disaster. And in my opinion, seemingly blaming the Puerto Ricans  for their problems at this particular time is a bad look.

The response on the ground seems to be getting better. And the response from the administration seems to be getting better too.
But if you think the initial response was ideal, well we will just have to agree to disagree.

Trump didn't blame Puerto Ricans. He simply pointed out the issues with PR. If anything, he highlighted how much work was ahead and how it was a long term issue. And as we're seeing he is dead on in regards to the infrastructure issue. There is a literal mount of relief supplies on the island right now, without a realistic way to deliver them where they're needed.

Maybe if Obama had gotten on TV or twitter and released information about how freaked up the electrical grid was after Sandy, more could have been done?

No response is ideal, but right now Trump is light years ahead of where Bush and Obama were at this point.

[Slateman]

U.S. response in Puerto Rico pales next to actions after Haiti quake - The Washington Post
https://apple.news/AID56Z8OaSCi8MriIwXLlDQ

There are many complicating factors but I think this shows that we *could* have done more considering last time I checked:
1) earthquakes come with less warning than Hurricanes
2) Haiti is an island in the Greater Antilles
3) Haiti has poor infrastructure.

I don’t find the excuse that they are waiting to be asked to be compelling. But others may differ.

The damage in Haiti pales in comparison to the damage in PR. But I'll give the Puerto Ricans some credit. At least they aren't shooting at the Marines. Yet.

[tomterp]

That's how I initially read that too and figured that Slate just wrote that sentence poorly.

It turns out this is the case. 

[Natsinpwc]

Another one coming.

https://weather.com/storms/hurricane/news/tropical-depression-storm-caribbean-gulf-of-mexico-central-american-gyre

[Natsinpwc]

Why was this thread allowed to become political?

[bluestreak]

Why was this thread allowed to become political?

I think that most folks were talking about the poor response to the storm, which seems in bounds . Only one poster made it overtly political.

[Natsinpwc]

I think that most folks were talking about the poor response to the storm, which seems in bounds . Only one poster made it overtly political.

If I even joke about someone in politics they tell me to watch it.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

I think that most folks were talking about the poor response to the storm, which seems in bounds . Only one poster made it overtly political.

well, I wanted to say that Gorbachev would have completely messed this one up, if he was given a chance, but I'm laying off my conspiracy theories in year 5778.

[Natsinpwc]

It is just a bit ironic the PR governor announced this tonight.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/hurricane-maria-death-toll-jumps-34-puerto-rico/story?id=50267118

I don't think FEMA messed this up the same way as Katrina but the response has been lacking.  If people lack communications its hard for them to assist in their own recovery.  They will learn some lessons and apply the next time.  It's a poor island.  Not quite Haiti but still very poor. Hope they can bounce back.

[GuyFromCO]

Whatever. It's not like this is part of my job or anything. It's not like I've written analysis of disaster recovery in the US for the last 40 years or anything.

 

Slate, you're doing a heck of a job!

[skippy1999]

It is just a bit ironic the PR governor announced this tonight.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/hurricane-maria-death-toll-jumps-34-puerto-rico/story?id=50267118

I don't think FEMA messed this up the same way as Katrina but the response has been lacking.  If people lack communications its hard for them to assist in their own recovery.  They will learn some lessons and apply the next time.  It's a poor island.  Not quite Haiti but still very poor. Hope they can bounce back.

Have they become poorer since they drove the Navy out and closed Roosevelt Roads?  I can't help but think they'd be in much better shape right now if that base were still open, but I could be totally wrong about that. 

[Mathguy]

Are you sure "they" drove the Navy out or was it a series of different White Houses that wanted less military bases ?  There has been alot of effort put toward military base closings over the past 35 years. 

Have they become poorer since they drove the Navy out and closed Roosevelt Roads?  I can't help but think they'd be in much better shape right now if that base were still open, but I could be totally wrong about that. 

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Have they become poorer since they drove the Navy out and closed Roosevelt Roads?  I can't help but think they'd be in much better shape right now if that base were still open, but I could be totally wrong about that. 

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/03/national/after-closing-of-navy-base-hard-times-in-puerto-rico.html

12 year old article talking about the town around the base, Ceiba, struggling dealing with the loss of 6000 jobs a year after the base closed.  There was local opposition to using Vieques Island as a bombing range which led to its closing, and Roosevelt Roads more or less oversaw the bombing range.  at the time of the article, Ceiba had 18,000 people.  Roosevelt Roads spent about $300MM / yr.  They are still looking for a follow-on uses.  Off and on, there's been interest in the airport.

I don't know the status of the clean up of Vieques but it is supposed to have a lot of tourism potential, especially diving. 

[skippy1999]

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/03/national/after-closing-of-navy-base-hard-times-in-puerto-rico.html

12 year old article talking about the town around the base, Ceiba, struggling dealing with the loss of 6000 jobs a year after the base closed.  There was local opposition to using Vieques Island as a bombing range which led to its closing, and Roosevelt Roads more or less oversaw the bombing range.  at the time of the article, Ceiba had 18,000 people.  Roosevelt Roads spent about $300MM / yr.  They are still looking for a follow-on uses.  Off and on, there's been interest in the airport.

I don't know the status of the clean up of Vieques but it is supposed to have a lot of tourism potential, especially diving. 

yea we went to visit my friend who was stationed at Rosey Roads back in 97 or 98 and they wee protesting Vieques then, I remember Teri saying she didn't think it was going to be good for that island is they ended up closing the base because of that.  I've been to Puerto Rico twice, in the early 80's and then again late 90's and I don't remember it seeming desperately poor and the last time we went we traveled all over that island because my friend knew so many cool out of the way places, was just wondering when it went so downhill because I mean, the El Conquistador was one of the most gorgeous resorts I've ever seen, the tourism potential on the island itself was tremendous. We hiked the rainforests and swam in waterfalls, it should be able to make a killing in tourism. 

[bluestreak]

I have gone to PR many times. I usually stay on the west part of the island in Rincon. We go often enough that we stay in the same house and have our favorite restaurants and know some locals. We have been to Vieques a couple of times. It's seems to be super poor. It's gorgeous but very very rustic. Now that the Navy is gone, commercial development is coming in, so I imagine economically that its close to a watch. For instance, a large W Hotel opened there recently. Whether this is a good thing is up for debate, since Blue Beach and Bravo beach were some of the most beautiful, secluded beaches I have ever seen. But it took a 4x4 to get there and even then it was dicey.

The thing that started the protests were a civilian being killed by ordinance. I must say I would not like my home being used as a bombing range.

[skippy1999]

I have gone to PR many times. I usually stay on the west part of the island in Rincon. We go often enough that we stay in the same house and have our favorite restaurants and know some locals. We have been to Vieques a couple of times. It's seems to be super poor. It's gorgeous but very very rustic. Now that the Navy is gone, commercial development is coming in, so I imagine economically that its close to a watch. For instance, a large W Hotel opened there recently. Whether this is a good thing is up for debate, since Blue Beach and Bravo beach were some of the most beautiful, secluded beaches I have ever seen. But it took a 4x4 to get there and even then it was dicey.

The thing that started the protests were a civilian being killed by ordinance. I must say I would not like my home being used as a bombing range.

I know that started the major protests but we were there before that and it was pretty well known then that they wanted the military out of there.  I get what you're saying but they test bombs at Eglin Air Force base not far from me, I mean if Eglin packed up and left that part of the panhandle would dry up and die, there's not a single other place for people to work.  Ok I've derailed this enough, back to weather, soooo praying for a tropical storm day in the next week

[imref]

Hey Skippy, keep an eye on Tropical Depression 16.  Current modeling shows a direct hit centered around Destin FL on Sunday at as Cat-1 hurricane.

[Slateman]

TS Nate is heading towards the panhandle. We gonna run out of letters to name them after again?

[Vega]

TS Nate is heading towards the panhandle. We gonna run out of letters to name them after again?

Hurricane will be a weird one to be sure. Probably has never been a hurricane with purple rain before.

[GburgNatsFan]

Hurricane will be a weird one to be sure. Probably has never been a hurricane with purple rain before.

[JCA-CrystalCity]

Hurricane will be a weird one to be sure. Probably has never been a hurricane with purple rain before.

I propose next year they name all the hurricanes after dead musicians.  Hurricane Axl, Hurricane Bowie, Hurricane Captain and Tennile, ...

[mitlen]

I propose next year they name all the hurricanes after dead musicians.  Hurricane Axl, Hurricane Bowie, Hurricane Captain and Tennile, ...

Isn't Captain a title?    Can you imagine Hurricane Daryl?      Followed by Darryl and Larry   ....   

[imref]

just hold a naming contest - the first one of the season of course would be hurricane huri-mc-huriface 

[dracnal]

just hold a naming contest - the first one of the season of course would be hurricane huri-mc-huriface

More likely 'Hurricane Did Nothing Wrong!'