Author Topic: Closer Watch: 2017  (Read 55212 times)

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Online JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #325: March 30, 2017, 03:22:41 PM »
Don't have time to read that, who overrode him then, Rizzo?? Is it a stupid service time issue?
Rizzo thinks Treinen is Zach Britton. Some analysts say he has the second best sinker.  He has been Rizzo's candidate.

Oddly enough, if Treinen succeeds, he's arb eligible next year and this will get him paid.  Going with Glover would have been the cheap way to go.  I/M/O, if Glover is good and Treinen isn't, he gets the next shot. 

Offline skippy1999

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #326: March 30, 2017, 03:25:23 PM »
Rizzo thinks Treinen is Zach Britton. Some analysts say he has the second best sinker.  He has been Rizzo's candidate.

Oddly enough, if Treinen succeeds, he's arb eligible next year and this will get him paid.  Going with Glover would have been the cheap way to go.  I/M/O, if Glover is good and Treinen isn't, he gets the next shot. 

Oh ok good, I just hate when we keep our better options in the minors just to get another cheap year out of them. I get business-wise why it's done but still, to me you go with your best option to win, money be damned. 

Online JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #327: March 30, 2017, 03:29:50 PM »
The other thing that is mentioned by Janes (Janes says) is that there's a bit of concern early in the year over Glover's hip labrum.  They want to minimize the wear and tear.  You can expect that they'll nurse Kelley and Glover along early a bit in order to have them around later in the year.

Online varoadking

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #328: March 30, 2017, 03:30:02 PM »
Does this mean that Treinen will have to choke Harper out?

Treinen will have Harper choke himself out...


Offline RobDibblesGhost

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #329: March 30, 2017, 04:06:10 PM »
Perfect take. I think this is a very good approach and Glover to the minor allows us to keep Gutherie  i& Perez in the fold.

Dusty said Glover is making the team.

Offline dshawg77

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #330: March 30, 2017, 04:54:51 PM »
Ross to DL, Guthrie, Glover and Perez all make the team.

Offline whytev

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #331: March 30, 2017, 06:12:23 PM »
Oh ok good, I just hate when we keep our better options in the minors just to get another cheap year out of them. I get business-wise why it's done but still, to me you go with your best option to win, money be damned.

A little seasoning for Glover would do him solid. I don't think he's even thrown a ball in AAA yet. Get him closing down there, manage his innings, hope he doesn't mind the racially insensitive team name, call him up when Kelley's elbow turns to jell-o.

Offline whytev

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #332: March 30, 2017, 06:13:10 PM »
Ross to DL, Guthrie, Glover and Perez all make the team.

Ross is your long man for the first two rotations. Lots of off days.

Offline RobDibblesGhost

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #333: March 30, 2017, 06:26:33 PM »
Ross is your long man for the first two rotations. Lots of off days.

A fifth starter will be needed on April 9 which is less than a week into the season. Off day on April 4 then eight games in a row.

Offline whytev

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #334: March 30, 2017, 06:30:55 PM »
A fifth starter will be needed on April 9 which is less than a week into the season. Off day on April 4 then eight games in a row.

You're right! Looked at something wrong.

Offline Truconfidence

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #335: March 30, 2017, 07:10:01 PM »
A little seasoning for Glover would do him solid. I don't think he's even thrown a ball in AAA yet. Get him closing down there, manage his innings, hope he doesn't mind the racially insensitive team name, call him up when Kelley's elbow turns to jell-o.
Glover pitched at Syracuse last year.

Offline whytev

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #336: March 30, 2017, 07:36:55 PM »
Glover pitched at Syracuse last year.

Still. If they're obsessed with a long man I would rather option Glover than waive Romero.

Offline RobDibblesGhost

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #337: March 30, 2017, 07:40:03 PM »
Still. If they're obsessed with a long man I would rather option Glover than waive Romero.

Agreed.

Offline Ali the Baseball Cat

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #338: March 30, 2017, 10:48:00 PM »
For what, like a game?  He pretty much went straight up
Glover pitched at Syracuse last year.

Offline mmzznnxx

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #339: March 31, 2017, 03:12:59 AM »
I think it's dumb to take Treinen's DP balls out of the middle/late innings and leave it up to the wolves. That's an automatic loss basically every Gio start.d





Offline Truconfidence

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #340: March 31, 2017, 06:03:01 AM »
For what, like a game?  He pretty much went straight up

huh? 18 games 24 innings.

Online JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #341: March 31, 2017, 09:15:39 AM »
I think it's dumb to take Treinen's DP balls out of the middle/late innings and leave it up to the wolves. That's an automatic loss basically every Gio start.d

I think the middle inning depth (Blanton, Solis, Kelley, and Glover) give us plenty of options and looks.  Blanton in particular is going to have a heavy load.  Looks like they are emphasizing K rate for the middle guys. Maybe they think Treinen should have clean innings so if he walks a guy, he can bail himself out with a DP?

Online JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #342: March 31, 2017, 11:19:24 AM »

Offline skippy1999

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #343: March 31, 2017, 11:40:42 AM »
I think the middle inning depth (Blanton, Solis, Kelley, and Glover) give us plenty of options and looks.  Blanton in particular is going to have a heavy load.  Looks like they are emphasizing K rate for the middle guys. Maybe they think Treinen should have clean innings so if he walks a guy, he can bail himself out with a DP?

I thought strike out guys were closers ground ball pitchers were more middle inning guys, was I completely backwards in my thinking? 

Offline Mattionals

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #344: March 31, 2017, 12:25:43 PM »
I thought strike out guys were closers ground ball pitchers were more middle inning guys, was I completely backwards in my thinking?

Treinen still strikes out nearly one guy per inning. The mop up guy, long relief, ground ball machines are more like how Doug Fister was. Treinen is like Zach Britton lite, and Britton is in the same conversation as Mariano with respect to poor contact. Britton obviously generates more grounders than Mariano did, but Mariano was never the strikeout machine that say Miller, Betances, or Chapman are. If you can dependably get poor contact on a soft fly ball or on a weak grounder, the value there is high.

My only issue with Treinen is that I worry about the free passes he issues. Britton has shown much better command of the zone than Treinen, so regardless of the groundball thing, Treinen's biggest saving grace will be to lower the walks. If he can limit how many guys get on, he shouldn't be pitching 20-30 pitches an inning and in theory can be used multiple days in a row with less fatigue than someone who is getting the strikeouts, but is constantly working counts up to set up the right pitch. Treinen should throw that turbo sinker low in the zone and generate outs one way or another.

Offline Ray D

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #345: March 31, 2017, 02:15:39 PM »
I thought strike out guys were closers ground ball pitchers were more middle inning guys, was I completely backwards in my thinking? 
No, you weren't.  For a closer, high strikeout/low walk rates are most important.  Ground balls are important when you need  doubleplays, which requires men on base, and a closer comes in at the beginning of an inning, does not inherit any runners and is not supposed to let a man on base.

Offline CoryTheFormerExposFan

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #346: March 31, 2017, 02:39:44 PM »
Ross has options and will start the year in AAA until we need a 5th starter.  Guthrie and Glover both make the team and then when Ross' turn comes up, if we haven't had any injuries ot the rest of the bullpen, then I'd guess Guthrie is the odd man out. 

Offline CoryTheFormerExposFan

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #347: March 31, 2017, 02:41:17 PM »
With Treinen being prone to walking guys...can't he be his own "fireman" with the groundballs he induces?  He can walk a leadoff guy then promptyly get a groundball hit for a DP.

Offline whytev

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #348: March 31, 2017, 03:10:55 PM »
Ross has options and will start the year in AAA until we need a 5th starter.  Guthrie and Glover both make the team and then when Ross' turn comes up, if we haven't had any injuries ot the rest of the bullpen, then I'd guess Guthrie is the odd man out.

If Guthrie is nails I'd still rather season Glover a little.

Offline bluestreak

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Re: Closer Watch: 2017
« Reply #349: March 31, 2017, 03:15:08 PM »
No, you weren't.  For a closer, high strikeout/low walk rates are most important.  Ground balls are important when you need  doubleplays, which requires men on base, and a closer comes in at the beginning of an inning, does not inherit any runners and is not supposed to let a man on base.

This makes some sense but not completely to me. Even the the best pitchers aren't going to strike everyone  out. So for balls put in play ground balls > fly balls > line drives. Also as mentioned before if someone does have some control issues being able to induce ground balls after walking would be desirable. I do agree that in a closer, the ability to throw strikes is very important. But it's not like the Nats have a proven healthy pitcher that strikes out 2 batters per inning in the wings somewhere.