Author Topic: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?  (Read 2234 times)

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Online HalfSmokes

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #25: October 20, 2015, 03:25:28 PM »
There couldn't have been much purchasing power left in the STH base by '92.  Other than Carnegie Mellon, was anyone still in business in Pittsburgh in those days?  The 80s were quite unkind to that part of the universe as I recall.     

PNC

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #26: October 20, 2015, 03:26:58 PM »
PNC
Also, isn't GNC a Pittsburgh company?

Offline mitlen

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #27: October 20, 2015, 03:30:59 PM »
Also, isn't GNC a Pittsburgh company?

Yep

Offline mitlen

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #28: October 20, 2015, 03:33:49 PM »
There couldn't have been much purchasing power left in the STH base by '92.  Other than Carnegie Mellon, was anyone still in business in Pittsburgh in those days?  The 80s were quite unkind to that part of the universe as I recall.     

You're right.   The mills really began to close around '82.    There had been some closures but '82 hit my hometown hard.    5,000 jobs at one time  ...   poof.    Aliquippa had about 8,000 at J & L   ....  poof.    Homestead, McKeesport, Ambridge, Beaver Falls, Braddock, etc.   ...  poof.      Heinz was still in business but they may have been over taken by then.   But even with the ancillary business/employers in the area, steel had been king for generations.   I was in DC through all that and I remember a lady saying to me, "Well, if you can't work in the mill, get a job at McDonalds."     I was stunned.    I told her, "When the mills close, McDonald's closes  ...  stores closed."    There were no jobs.   Imagine what the DC area would look like if  the Federal government moved lock, stock and barrel to Kansas.       I'm not sure how to find it but Haynes Johnson wrote an excellent piece in the Washington Post about the loss of the mills and the after effects in the communities   ...  alcohol, spousal abuse, suicide, etc.   There are places where it's still unkind.    Aliquippa comes to mind.    From his obituary:

"Mr. Johnson joined The Post as a national correspondent, where his portfolio included many presidential campaigns; he was later an assistant managing editor as well as a columnist there. He was a finalist for the 1983 Pulitzer Prize in National Reporting for his coverage in The Post of the impact of the recession on communities nationwide."

OT   Article in the Pittsburgh papers about 1983.

http://www.post-gazette.com/business/businessnews/2012/12/23/In-desperate-1983-there-was-nowhere-for-Pittsburgh-s-economy-to-go-but-up/stories/201212230258

"In January 1983, the regional economy officially -- that is, numerically -- bottomed out. Unemployment in Allegheny County hit 13.9 percent, a rosy figure compared to the rest of the Pittsburgh metropolitan statistical area, where the adjusted unemployment rate hit an astonishing 17.1 percent (unadjusted, the number was actually higher, 18.2 percent)."

...   and in Aliquippa's home county, "In industrialized Beaver County, the rate hit 27.1 percent in January 1983 -- greater than the peak U.S. unemployment rate during the Great Depression."

Season tickets?    Hell, they couldn't even go to a game.    Thanks for lettin' me rant.    These times (1980s) delineate "yunz" and "yinz".

EDIT:

Added from recent WP articles

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/in-sight/wp/2015/11/04/the-former-steel-town-that-dimmed-its-light-to-help-pittsburg-shine/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/in-sight/wp/2015/11/11/part-ii-the-life-and-slow-death-of-a-former-pennsylvania-steel-town/

Offline BeltwayBaseball

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #29: October 20, 2015, 04:01:47 PM »
I look at what happens when a team with a budget signs a guy like that- it basically crippled the Rangers, the Mariners have Cano eating 1/5 of a 76 win team's payroll, even a hometown guy like Mauer never really won anything after getting paid. Teams like the Angels, Yankees, Red Sox... can absorb those huge salaries and build teams around those guys, I just question whether or not harper earning $35 million per would leave the nats room to build a roster.   

I see Washington as one of those kinds of franchises, with the money to butt against LA and NY, partially because of the affluence of the area and partially because of the affluence of the owner, and last but not least, I see the Lerners as willing to eat parts of that money themselves if it means growing baseball in the market.

Offline MarquisDeSade

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #30: October 20, 2015, 05:19:14 PM »
Are you new to this team?

Offline BeltwayBaseball

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #31: October 20, 2015, 08:41:50 PM »
Are you new to this team?

After Jayson Werth and Max Scherzer, LAC is dead. $5 billion net worth in just the principal owner alone, most of the richest counties in the country in the Nat's market, I see no reason why this team can't outbid NY and LA. I don't think they should do it with every single player at every position, like the Yankees and Dodgers...but I don't know why they wouldn't be able to afford Harper's services.

Though maybe LAC just a little bit, what with no payroll for 2015 for Clippard and Parra, that whole thing, but that still doesn't mean they'll let the Yankees beat them for Harper.

Offline MarquisDeSade

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #32: October 20, 2015, 08:51:24 PM »
Though maybe LAC just a little bit, what with no payroll for 2015 for Clippard and Parra, that whole thing, but that still doesn't mean they'll let the Yankees beat them for Harper.

I'm not suggesting LAC, I'm suggesting LAROIF (Lerners Are Return On Investment Focused), which is what every ownership group is interested in if they don't view the team as an annuity stream (most do).  They aren't going to go into their own pockets to boost payroll, the payroll is set based on gate/teevee/other team related revenues, not Lerner Enterprises money.  Besides, if money wasn't an issue why stand pat at the trade deadline?

Offline BeltwayBaseball

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #33: October 20, 2015, 08:53:43 PM »
I'm not suggesting LAC, I'm suggesting LAROIF (Lerners Are Return On Investment Focused), which is what every ownership group is interested in if they don't view the team as an annuity stream (most do).  They aren't going to go into their own pockets to boost payroll, the payroll is set based on gate/teevee/other team related revenues, not Lerner Enterprises money.  Besides, if money wasn't an issue why stand pat at the trade deadline?

I think they'd consider it a personal investment to keep Harper around, wouldn't Harper leaving kill ticket sales? Harper's a special case, and I wouldn't doubt the Lerner's pride. That alone could get them to keep him.

Online HalfSmokes

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #34: October 20, 2015, 08:54:56 PM »
Yep, I have no doubt that the lerners will spend as much as revenue allows, but I don't see them letting the team run in their red

Offline Count Walewski

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #35: October 22, 2015, 12:24:49 AM »
Is there anyone who thinks the Dodgers are spending money well? At least Cashman seemed to get value for his money during the notorious days of the Yankees buying every major FA.

Offline Vega

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #36: October 22, 2015, 12:27:24 AM »
Is there anyone who thinks the Dodgers are spending money well? At least Cashman seemed to get value for his money during the notorious days of the Yankees buying every major FA.
I think we need to wait a couple of years for Friedman to flush out all of Coletti's questionable expenditures to determine that.

Offline tomterp

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #37: October 24, 2015, 08:52:32 PM »
I think they'd consider it a personal investment to keep Harper around, wouldn't Harper leaving kill ticket sales? Harper's a special case, and I wouldn't doubt the Lerner's pride. That alone could get them to keep him.

No, it's all business. There is no personal side/business side thing happening. The team can afford what it can afford.

Offline welch

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #38: October 25, 2015, 02:23:28 PM »
No, it's all business. There is no personal side/business side thing happening. The team can afford what it can afford.

I hope -- no evidence -- that Ted Lerner wants to see a pennant winner. He is about 90...doesn't have the long view that Mark and the family might. Old Ted was about eight when the Joe Cronin Nats won the AL pennant in 1933. Ted lived through years of under-funded Griffith teams afterward; then the New Senators fiasco after Calvin moved to Minneapolis.

So...a hope and a hunch that Ted might say, "It's my hobby...take a billion or so and get me the modern equivalent of Ted Williams, Bob Feller, and Willie Mays. I want to raise a pennant. Choke Wilbon and his little team. Pay the Mets to take Papelbon".

(Chelsea Piers, which belongs to Lerner Enterprises, might be more valuable than the Mets. The Lerners bought a section of the old Manhattan waterfront and turned the passenger terminals into a fancy sports complex and film recording studio. See: http://www.lerner.com/detailSports.php?id=72 and

http://www.chelseapiers.com/  So successful that Lerners have opened a Chelsea Piers in Stamford, CT)



Offline Kevrock

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #39: October 25, 2015, 04:21:27 PM »
No, it's all business. There is no personal side/business side thing happening. The team can afford what it can afford.

It happened in Detroit, I could see it happening here. The Lerners are meddlesome, Harper is a shiny thing with constant Yankee rumors. Wouldn't be surprised if they threw him a Stanton+ contract at him.

Offline PC

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Re: Big Money Buys You What in Baseball?
« Reply #40: October 25, 2015, 05:35:42 PM »
Stanton++ would be required.