Author Topic: Who should replace FR?  (Read 2929 times)

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Offline LetsGoNats

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Who should replace FR?
« Topic Start: August 03, 2005, 08:00:56 PM »
Let's start a list of candidates we'd like to see hired once we get an owner:

Jim Leyland
Lou Pinella (presuming he gets out of TB after this year)

Add yours

Offline tomterp

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #1: August 03, 2005, 10:09:30 PM »
Is Davey Johnson a possibility?

I still want to hire Jon Miller as radio play by play guy, Davey Johnson as manager, and have Cal Ripken as minority owner.

Not that I'm bitter at anyone.....

Offline esoteric

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #2: August 03, 2005, 10:11:50 PM »
Quote from: "tomterp"
Is Davey Johnson a possibility?

I still want to hire Jon Miller as radio play by play guy, Davey Johnson as manager, and have Cal Ripken as minority owner.

Not that I'm bitter at anyone.....


Somebody's trying to import the old-fashioned O's into the Nats organization, eh?  I'd love to have someone like Jon Miller doing play-by-play...that guy's the best radio announcer I've had the pleasure to hear calling a game.

Offline Nationalzfanatic88

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #3: August 03, 2005, 10:14:15 PM »
um... how about Frank Robinson, Lou Pinella is a nut head. ANd FR is the only one that could get along with Jose Guillen. He's a flipping hall of famer come on. When we were winning u guys didnt have any problems with him, come on give him a chance!!!

Offline esoteric

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #4: August 03, 2005, 10:32:16 PM »
Quote from: "Nationalzfanatic88"
um... how about Frank Robinson, Lou Pinella is a nut head. ANd FR is the only one that could get along with Jose Guillen. He's a flipping hall of famer come on. When we were winning u guys didnt have any problems with him, come on give him a chance!!!


The problem with Frank (and I remember him from the O's miracle season back in '89 as well) is that...

a.) He has a terrible habit of needlessly alienating certain players, and of developing inexplicable prejudices against certain others.  Case in point: Brendan Harris.  This is simply unacceptable when you're in a do-or-die pennant race.  

b.) He makes a heck of a lot of inexplicable in-game decisions.  I mean, have you forgotten all those nutty substitutions and unnecessary out-eating sacrifice bunts?  

c.) It seems he's encouraged a very, very bad habit in the team: playing hurt, to be 'tough' and 'play through the pain.'  It's this attitude which has arguably reduced Jose Guillen's power, which made Ryan Church come back too early (he's swinging through pain right now - he should have waited until he was 100%) and which has rendered Vinny Castilla useless.

For the record, I think Piniella is the no-brainer choice.  Unless we go to the playoffs, I suspect he will be managing the Nats next year.  At least, I hope he is.  I like the fiery, nutty type.

Offline Nationalzfanatic88

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #5: August 04, 2005, 12:31:52 AM »
Quote from: "esoteric"
Quote from: "Nationalzfanatic88"
um... how about Frank Robinson, Lou Pinella is a nut head. ANd FR is the only one that could get along with Jose Guillen. He's a flipping hall of famer come on. When we were winning u guys didnt have any problems with him, come on give him a chance!!!


The problem with Frank (and I remember him from the O's miracle season back in '89 as well) is that...

a.) He has a terrible habit of needlessly alienating certain players, and of developing inexplicable prejudices against certain others.  Case in point: Brendan Harris.  This is simply unacceptable when you're in a do-or-die pennant race.  

b.) He makes a heck of a lot of inexplicable in-game decisions.  I mean, have you forgotten all those nutty substitutions and unnecessary out-eating sacrifice bunts?  

c.) It seems he's encouraged a very, very bad habit in the team: playing hurt, to be 'tough' and 'play through the pain.'  It's this attitude which has arguably reduced Jose Guillen's power, which made Ryan Church come back too early (he's swinging through pain right now - he should have waited until he was 100%) and which has rendered Vinny Castilla useless.

For the record, I think Piniella is the no-brainer choice.  Unless we go to the playoffs, I suspect he will be managing the Nats next year.  At least, I hope he is.  I like the fiery, nutty type.


Here are a few problems with your theory
1) we WILL make the playoffs
2)Lou Pinella would not work in DC, the players would hate him and so would the fans.
3)I repeat, you all are hating on FR because we are losing, once we start winning again and beat the White Sox in the World Series, all of you will be praising FR.

Offline Kenz aFan

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Re: Who should replace FR?
« Reply #6: August 04, 2005, 01:07:21 AM »
Quote from: "LetsGoNats"
Let's start a list of candidates we'd like to see hired once we get an owner:

Larry Dierker
Jim Leyland
Art Howe
Davey Johnson
Jimmy Williams

Offline Senators2005

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #7: August 04, 2005, 04:03:00 AM »
I think Mike Scioscia will be available next year.   :lol:

Offline Senators2005

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #8: August 04, 2005, 04:05:40 AM »
In all seriousness you guys are missing the one true selection for manager of the Washington Nationals in 2006:

A guy named FRANK HOWARD.

Sure he's in the Yankee system as a coach for the Colombus Clippers.   And yes yes..he said he loves it there.   But if the price tags right...and c'mon it's every guys dream to be a major league manager!   You know I'm right.

Can you imagine?  Dare to dream :!:

Offline JMW IV

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #9: August 04, 2005, 10:35:55 AM »
Quote from: "Nationalzfanatic88"
When we were winning u guys didnt have any problems with him, come on give him a chance!!!


yes.

yes we did.

BigRChurchfan

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #10: August 04, 2005, 11:31:58 AM »
Quote from: "Nationalzfanatic88"
Quote from: "esoteric"
Quote from: "Nationalzfanatic88"
um... how about Frank Robinson, Lou Pinella is a nut head. ANd FR is the only one that could get along with Jose Guillen. He's a flipping hall of famer come on. When we were winning u guys didnt have any problems with him, come on give him a chance!!!


The problem with Frank (and I remember him from the O's miracle season back in '89 as well) is that...

a.) He has a terrible habit of needlessly alienating certain players, and of developing inexplicable prejudices against certain others.  Case in point: Brendan Harris.  This is simply unacceptable when you're in a do-or-die pennant race.  

b.) He makes a heck of a lot of inexplicable in-game decisions.  I mean, have you forgotten all those nutty substitutions and unnecessary out-eating sacrifice bunts?  

c.) It seems he's encouraged a very, very bad habit in the team: playing hurt, to be 'tough' and 'play through the pain.'  It's this attitude which has arguably reduced Jose Guillen's power, which made Ryan Church come back too early (he's swinging through pain right now - he should have waited until he was 100%) and which has rendered Vinny Castilla useless.

For the record, I think Piniella is the no-brainer choice.  Unless we go to the playoffs, I suspect he will be managing the Nats next year.  At least, I hope he is.  I like the fiery, nutty type.


Here are a few problems with your theory
1) we WILL make the playoffs
2)Lou Pinella would not work in DC, the players would hate him and so would the fans.
3)I repeat, you all are hating on FR because we are losing, once we start winning again and beat the White Sox in the World Series, all of you will be praising FR.


brilliant.  He offers actual analysis, and you just offer opinion (bad ones too).

mar (AKA pasqual AKA JMG)

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #11: August 04, 2005, 02:05:45 PM »
Few guys I would look at:

Hal McRae.
Good record with some not very good KC teams (over .500 record 3 of 4 years). Dismal with D-Rays but then that ain't stopping anybody from wanting Sweet Lou.

Definite problem adjusting to managing in KC coming off his playing career (seemed to be one of those great players who had a hard time accepting that not everybody on the roster could play like him) but that's quite awhile ago. He's mellowed.

Still in baseball as a hitting coach and just turned 60. I think the KC blowups are fixed in peoples mind which is why he isn't managing but that's ancient history.

Bob Brenly
WS in 2001 (He definitely had the horses but he also managed extremely well). over .500 in 2002, 2003.
Younger than a lot of possibles at 54. Why wouldn't you look at this guy?

Tony Pena
Hey! He did get a very poor KC team to .512 in 2003. Could be the Ozzie Guillen of 2006.

Cito Gaston (sentimental favourite for me, probably nobody else).
Guy won two world series with TO. The subsequent failure of the Jays had more to do with the front office than him. 61 years old and available.

Offline Kenz aFan

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #12: August 04, 2005, 02:12:05 PM »
Quote from: "Senators2005"
In all seriousness you guys are missing the one true selection for manager of the Washington Nationals in 2006:

A guy named FRANK HOWARD.

Star players don't always make good managers and to prove my point, take a look at Frank Robinson.  :roll:

Things related to the Senators should remain in the past. We're talking about the Nationals, not the Senators. Leave Frank Howard in DC's history and record books, besides, I don't want another (or different) 70 year old managing. Jimmy Williams is about as old as the maximum old I want to see running the team...

mar (AKA pasqual AKA JMG)

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #13: August 04, 2005, 02:39:14 PM »
Quote from: "Kenz aFan"
Quote from: "Senators2005"
In all seriousness you guys are missing the one true selection for manager of the Washington Nationals in 2006:


A guy named FRANK HOWARD.

Star players don't always make good managers and to prove my point, take a look at Frank Robinson.  :roll:

Things related to the Senators should remain in the past. We're talking about the Nationals, not the Senators. Leave Frank Howard in DC's history and record books, besides, I don't want another (or different) 70 year old managing. Jimmy Williams is about as old as the maximum old I want to see running the team...


yeah, I agree.

All respect to Hondo who was a great player, but it would be diifferent if he'd been managing in the majors for the past decade or so like Alou or McKeon. I really don't think 70 is the age to begin your MLB managing career.

Offline Senators2005

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #14: August 04, 2005, 02:57:35 PM »
Well I understand how Canadians would be less enthusiastic.  But the 70 year old thing isn't compelling at all.  After all Jack McKeon didn't do so bad back in 2003.  And Bobby Cox isn't exactly a whipper-snapper either.  Hondo is in NO WAY inexperienced,  he's been managing minor league baseball since his retirement.

And anybody who suggests Jimy Williams better be prepared for a worse odd-ball management style than Frank!  That guy is certifiable!  He had the the Red Sox players so frustrated he nearly caused the players to go on strike.  Houston figured that out after a similar experience and finally unloaded him.

mar (AKA pasqual AKA JMG)

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #15: August 04, 2005, 03:16:17 PM »
Quote from: "Senators2005"
Well I understand how Canadians would be less enthusiastic.  But the 70 year old thing isn't compelling at all.  After all Jack McKeon didn't do so bad back in 2003.  And Bobby Cox isn't exactly a whipper-snapper either.  Hondo's is ANYTHING but inexperienced.  He's been managing minor league baseball since his retirement.

And anybody who suggests Jimy Williams better be prepared for a worse odd-ball management style than Frank!  That guy is certifiable!  He had the the Red Sox players so frustrated he nearly caused the players to go on strike.  Houston figured that out after a similar experience and finally unloaded him.


I don't think its a canadian thing, just think its a MLB managerial experience thing (tho obviously only those who watched Hondo with the Senators really appreciate him for what he was).

I agree with you 100% on Jimmy Williams. I'd rather see almost anyone as manager. I thni Ernie Witt nailed him pretty accurately in his long ago book and I don't think Williams has learned much since then.

One guy who you maybe got to consider is Tim Foli. I dunno how much the fact he's managing the Nats AAA club is gonna matter to new owners-GM - probably zero - but he's doing a pretty good job, was the kind of player who is usually thought of as making a good manager and maybe deserves a shot.

I would prefer him to a big name "has been" anyway and I would definitely prefer him to Williams.

Offline Vladman1327

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #16: August 06, 2005, 11:56:00 PM »
Quote from: "esoteric"
Quote from: "tomterp"
Is Davey Johnson a possibility?

I still want to hire Jon Miller as radio play by play guy, Davey Johnson as manager, and have Cal Ripken as minority owner.

Not that I'm bitter at anyone.....


Somebody's trying to import the old-fashioned O's into the Nats organization, eh?  I'd love to have someone like Jon Miller doing play-by-play...that guy's the best radio announcer I've had the pleasure to hear calling a game.


I don't feel like reading the whole topic, so I don't know if he's mentioned or not...

But Elliott Price was a great play-by-play guy.  Very funny, and not to mention, he's been an Expos fan since 1969.

Dave van Horn was also amazing, but stupid Loria had to steal him from us...:(

Offline Kenz aFan

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #17: August 07, 2005, 01:24:26 AM »
Quote from: "Senators2005"
Well I understand how Canadians would be less enthusiastic.  But the 70 year old thing isn't compelling at all.  After all Jack McKeon didn't do so bad back in 2003.  And Bobby Cox isn't exactly a whipper-snapper either.  Hondo is in NO WAY inexperienced,  he's been managing minor league baseball since his retirement.

And anybody who suggests Jimy Williams better be prepared for a worse odd-ball management style than Frank!  That guy is certifiable!  He had the the Red Sox players so frustrated he nearly caused the players to go on strike.  Houston figured that out after a similar experience and finally unloaded him.

I read your post four times to try and figure why the hell you even mentioned anything at all about Canadians...

Anyway, I saw Williams in a TV interview last year, and he admitted he did things all wrong and he learned from it. He's not a nut case, and discounting his actions with the Red Sox, he's more qualified to manage a team than Frank Robinson or Frank Howard. Suggesting Howard is living too much in the past.

I should go back and edit my list, and insert Barry Larkin in there, but I'm not sure I want another Ex Cincinnati Red running things...

Offline Senators2005

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #18: August 07, 2005, 01:33:30 AM »
Quote from: "Kenz aFan"
I read your post four times to try and figure why the hell you even mentioned anything at all about Canadians...


The only reason I said that is because Canadians wouldn't have the same amount of love for Frank Howard as we have here in Washington.  If you can think of an ex-player that is LOVED by the fans of Montreal and were to suggest him to Washingtonians they would probably not have the same feelings as you have for him.  That's what I meant.  Nothing more.  

I know you respect what he did.  But Hondo is the Yogi Berra of Washington...he's a legend to us.  And besides, almost ALL managers are players from the past.  If you don't want to hire him because he's old then fine, or because he's never managed a major league team that's fine too.  But he's certainly qualified and I'd rather not disqualify him just because he was a star player from the past.

Offline Kenz aFan

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #19: August 07, 2005, 01:08:33 PM »
Quote from: "Senators2005"
The only reason I said that is because Canadians wouldn't have the same amount of love for Frank Howard as we have here in Washington.  If you can think of an ex-player that is LOVED by the fans of Montreal and were to suggest him to Washingtonians they would probably not have the same feelings as you have for him.  That's what I meant.  Nothing more.

There are some Canadians that are just as aware of the importance in Washington's baseball history as any Washingtonian. There are not that many ex Expos players I would want in any kind of coaching (or managerial) roll with the Nats, except possibly Tim Wallach as the hitting coach. As for all managers being players from the past, you should also emphasize that most managers are not star players from the past, most are either journeyman players, or regulars who were never among their team's stars.

As for me, I didn't disqualify him because he was a player from Washington's past, but he is too old to start managing. With all due respect to Frank Howard, if he was to become manager and blow it completely, that would hurt the legend. Legends should remain legends, making him the Nats manager could tarnish that.

Edit: Added word Expos in second sentence...

CapitolCityGoofball

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Who should replace FR?
« Reply #20: August 07, 2005, 03:00:44 PM »
RE: Piniella - Definite NO. I do not think a fiery, base-throwing, water-cooler-pucnhing manager will work in DC.  His record is curious too, some great years without big stars, some lackluster years with big stars.  Seems like more of a hitter's manager.