Author Topic: Strasburg and the 2012 NLDS  (Read 7315 times)

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Offline Hondo

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #150: October 13, 2012, 11:40:57 AM »
If Strasburg pitches (he'd likely only be give one start), Detwiler doesnt.  Ross pitched great....I dont see what we would have gained.

Offline BerkeleyNat

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #151: October 13, 2012, 11:43:29 AM »
If Strasburg pitches (he'd likely only be give one start), Detwiler doesnt.  Ross pitched great....I dont see what we would have gained.

This. Strasburg wasn't the reason we lost this series. We had to get one more strike..that was it.

Offline heeman82

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #152: October 13, 2012, 11:48:41 AM »
USF_Football, have you met TribeTime?

Offline GburgNatsFan

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #153: October 13, 2012, 11:53:00 AM »
Do you think he even knows that Strasburg is not a reliever?
Trump is a silver spoon moron.


Offline PowerBoater69

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #154: October 13, 2012, 11:53:34 AM »
Do you think he even knows that Strasburg is not a reliever?


Neither is JZ or EJax

Offline jhuterp

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #155: October 13, 2012, 12:00:16 PM »
Very serious. Win or lose, it was the right decision. You always put the health of the player first and that's REALLY what's best for the organization on many levels and that has been covered at length.

Yup.  When the doctors say he's not medically ready to exceed the innings limit, you shut him down.  Made very little difference down the stretch as Lannan won 2 of 3 starts (I think). 

Offline PowerBoater69

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #156: October 13, 2012, 12:03:54 PM »
Yup.  When the doctors say he's not medically ready to exceed the innings limit, you shut him down.  Made very little difference down the stretch as Lannan won 2 of 3 starts (I think). 

The doctor said that there was no medical evidence one way or the other, Rizzo made a gut decision that the doctors supported.

In a series that was decided in the last inning of the last game one player could have made a difference.  With Stras we certainly would be preparing to host San Fran tomorrow.

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #157: October 13, 2012, 12:08:01 PM »
Irrelevant. Likely would have skipped the Det start, not a Jax start. Also, Wainright looked like a guy recovering from surgery who was tiring. No idea what SS would have done. It's an unknown, and it is meaningless. He rarely went past six innings and you need to rely on the same relievers. A closer who refuses to throw strikes when staked to a 2 run lead makes who started the game irrelevant.

Offline jhuterp

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #158: October 13, 2012, 12:19:17 PM »
Irrelevant. Likely would have skipped the Det start, not a Jax start. Also, Wainright looked like a guy recovering from surgery who was tiring. No idea what SS would have done. It's an unknown, and it is meaningless. He rarely went past six innings and you need to rely on the same relievers. A closer who refuses to throw strikes when staked to a 2 run lead makes who started the game irrelevant.

May be injecting way too much rationale thought into this discussion.

Offline DPMOmaha

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #159: October 13, 2012, 12:29:15 PM »
How did it work out?  Check back in 5 years.

Offline NatsTheFats

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #160: October 13, 2012, 12:45:36 PM »
Braves played Medlen "perfectly", right?  Got that wild card and were a one and done.  Without stras starting every fifth day, we don't win the division. 

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #161: October 13, 2012, 01:07:19 PM »
Irrelevant. Likely would have skipped the Det start, not a Jax start. Also, Wainright looked like a guy recovering from surgery who was tiring. No idea what SS would have done.

I said precisely that.  Wainwright has hit the Tommy John Wall.  Every pitcher coming off TJS hits it at some point.  Wainwright has been bad for most of the last month+.  Strasburg had hit the wall.  Jordan Zimmermann hit it last season.  Medlen would have hit if he hadn't already. His last few performance weren't as good as his earlier ones.


Offline GburgNatsFan

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #162: October 13, 2012, 01:15:29 PM »
True. And Zimm worked out. But E-Jax didn't.

Bringing Stras in to relieve after a month of the mound could have been a complete disaster.

Neither is JZ or EJax


Offline HalfSmokes

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #163: October 13, 2012, 03:44:14 PM »
Rizzo has shown more leadership this season than any GM I know

Expect the GMs who still have teams alive

Online Baseball is Life

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #164: October 13, 2012, 03:47:06 PM »
Expect the GMs who still have teams alive

By that logic than more than the guys who didn't even make the postseason. I'll take that.

Online JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #165: October 13, 2012, 05:18:56 PM »
Harold Reynolds and Al Leiter made a point that, while I disagree with it, ought to be considered.

What Reynolds said was that there was a cascading effect on the rest of the staff from the shutdown decision.  The Nats bullpen became exposed in the playoffs because the starters did not go deep.  Once JZ and Jackson only went a few innings, then the Davey had to pinch hit and make the bullpen throw more innings.  He said that JZ made up for it by getting an extra inning in Thursday to help lengthen the bullpen, but Jackson kind of fell on his butt.  What he did not say is that Det might have been a useful bullpen asset that Davey could have trusted in a tight game, instead of Gorzo / Gonzo / Garcia and Mattheus, who he ended up avoiding in the last 2 home games.

I don't quite buy it, because even if the Strasburg innings could have been managed to be available in the NLDS, he was not going to bump any of Gio, JZ, and E-Jax from a playoff start. Det was not the weak link on the staff, so replacing the 6 he got you with 6 from Stras at most gives him 2 -3 innings of relief in a set up role.

Offline nfotiu

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #166: October 13, 2012, 05:32:11 PM »
Harold Reynolds and Al Leiter made a point that, while I disagree with it, ought to be considered.

What Reynolds said was that there was a cascading effect on the rest of the staff from the shutdown decision.  The Nats bullpen became exposed in the playoffs because the starters did not go deep.  Once JZ and Jackson only went a few innings, then the Davey had to pinch hit and make the bullpen throw more innings.  He said that JZ made up for it by getting an extra inning in Thursday to help lengthen the bullpen, but Jackson kind of fell on his butt.  What he did not say is that Det might have been a useful bullpen asset that Davey could have trusted in a tight game, instead of Gorzo / Gonzo / Garcia and Mattheus, who he ended up avoiding in the last 2 home games.

I don't quite buy it, because even if the Strasburg innings could have been managed to be available in the NLDS, he was not going to bump any of Gio, JZ, and E-Jax from a playoff start. Det was not the weak link on the staff, so replacing the 6 he got you with 6 from Stras at most gives him 2 -3 innings of relief in a set up role.

I'd buy what he was selling if strasburg was going to be an 8 inning shut down pitcher at this point in the season.  So many of these types of comments come from guys who weren't watching his games.  I can't imagine that after 4 or 5 more starts that we'd be hoping for more than 5 innings of solid pitching, and even that was not a guarantee by any means.  This was not going to be the year he was going to be a workhorse ace that led us through the playoffs, no matter what tey did with him. 

The team has given him the best chance to be that guy next year. 

Offline KnorrForYourMoney

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #167: October 13, 2012, 05:35:08 PM »
I'd buy what he was selling if strasburg was going to be an 8 inning shut down pitcher at this point in the season.  So many of these types of comments come from guys who weren't watching his games.  I can't imagine that after 4 or 5 more starts that we'd be hoping for more than 5 innings of solid pitching, and even that was not a guarantee by any means.  This was not going to be the year he was going to be a workhorse ace that led us through the playoffs, no matter what tey did with him. 

The team has given him the best chance to be that guy next year. 

Sanity

My god people, Storen giving up 4 runs sinks us with or without Strasburg.  Enough already.

Offline Fan037

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #168: October 13, 2012, 05:42:52 PM »
Blaming the Strasburg shutdown is ridiculous.  We lost last night because our bullpen didn't execute properly.  We went into the 9th two runs up and blew it.  End of story.  Rizzo made a tough decision and it was the correct one for the pitcher's well-being and the long-term of the organization. 

Online spidernat

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #169: October 13, 2012, 05:43:59 PM »
I'd buy what he was selling if strasburg was going to be an 8 inning shut down pitcher at this point in the season.  So many of these types of comments come from guys who weren't watching his games.  I can't imagine that after 4 or 5 more starts that we'd be hoping for more than 5 innings of solid pitching, and even that was not a guarantee by any means.  This was not going to be the year he was going to be a workhorse ace that led us through the playoffs, no matter what tey did with him. 

The team has given him the best chance to be that guy next year. 

"sanity"  :clap:  Although I believe he will not become the 8 inning guy until 2014.

Sanity

My god people, Storen giving up 4 runs sinks us with or without Strasburg.  Enough already.

"double sanity"  :clap: :clap: 

Blaming the Strasburg shutdown is ridiculous.  We lost last night because our bullpen didn't execute properly.  We went into the 9th two runs up and blew it.  End of story.  Rizzo made a tough decision and it was the correct one for the pitcher's well-being and the long-term of the organization. 

"triple sanity"  :clap: :clap: :clap:



Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #170: October 13, 2012, 07:05:22 PM »
Strasburg should have been pitching every 5 days all season period.  Rizzo should be fired over this crap, but the Lerners don't have the guts.

Offline WerthHisWeight

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #171: October 13, 2012, 07:21:37 PM »
Strasburg should have been pitching every 5 days all season period.  Rizzo should be fired over this crap, but the Lerners don't have the guts.

Wow.  Just wow.

Offline GburgNatsFan

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #172: October 13, 2012, 09:17:26 PM »
Hard nosed. Old School. And wrong. ;)

Strasburg should have been pitching every 5 days all season period.  Rizzo should be fired over this crap, but the Lerners don't have the guts.


Offline USF_Football

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #173: October 14, 2012, 12:27:20 AM »
Not wrong according to Tommy John... But hell, what would he know?

Offline DPMOmaha

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Re: The Strasburg Mistake
« Reply #174: October 14, 2012, 12:31:47 AM »
Not wrong according to Tommy John... But hell, what would he know?

Is he a doctor?