Author Topic: Red Sox fire sale  (Read 1517 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline BigMeech

  • Posts: 2777
  • BM Punk
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #25: August 24, 2012, 11:15:08 PM »
Where does Crawford even fit in? They already have Kemp, Ethier, and Victorino out there.

He doesn't.  That's the funniest part. 

Offline Slateman

  • Posts: 21898
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #26: August 24, 2012, 11:32:00 PM »
Where does Crawford even fit in? They already have Kemp, Ethier, and Victorino out there.

Victorino is a free agent at the end of the season. Crawford is getting TJS

Offline DPMOmaha

  • Posts: 17897
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #27: August 24, 2012, 11:51:15 PM »
Dollars to donuts Beckett gets motivated by being thrown into a pennant race.

Offline zimm_da_kid

  • Posts: 6174
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #28: August 24, 2012, 11:58:41 PM »
crawford won't be back til next year due to tommy john and by then victorino will be gone.

Offline zimm_da_kid

  • Posts: 6174
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #29: August 25, 2012, 12:00:02 AM »
have to imagine this takes the dodgers out of the running for hamilton

Offline amanuel

  • Posts: 381
  • Go NATS!
    • RBSL
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #30: August 25, 2012, 12:26:58 AM »
Its LA they like to make big deals (just look at what the Angels did and the Lakers)... And with the TV deal they probably have they can afford it. Like DPMOmaha said if Beckett gets motivated they have a very scary 1-2-3 (Kershaw, Billingsley and Beckett) and a very potent offense.

Offline Mattionals

  • Posts: 2351
  • A mindless domestic pet
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #31: August 25, 2012, 12:32:48 AM »
This is partly a shock and awe trade but I don't think it is as bad as many are putting it.  Dodgers get a legit First baseman that they desperately need.  Crawford will come back from TJ surgery and he is still young enough to play partly back to a level he did in Tampa.  Beckett always has up and down years.  This is a down year and yes he is a clubhouse problem, but Donnie Baseball is a no frills guy and even though Hanley is a crapskeet (new word) he has played well since moving to LA.  Punto is bench assurance for a team with a bad bench honestly.

Victorino walks in FA anyway so there is no logjam in the outfield.  To me the Sox get some good pieces in pitching, but aren't giving up much as far as position players plus they get TONS of salary relief that can now be applied to David Ortiz and fixing the rotation.

Offline blue911

  • Posts: 16232
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #32: August 25, 2012, 12:52:22 AM »
Chad Billingsley got pulled tonight with more elbow issues.

Offline Ali the Baseball Cat

  • Posts: 10537
  • babble on
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #33: August 25, 2012, 01:00:42 AM »
Perhaps, but now I'm REALLY rooting for the Giants

Cameron can't see the logic behind this deal, other than to possibly boost LA attendance.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/red-sox-hit-reboot-dodgers-pick-up-pieces/



Online Vega

  • Posts: 3934
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #34: August 25, 2012, 01:05:52 AM »
I personally don't hate the deal for Los Angeles. Yeah, Beckett is likely dead weight, but Gonzalez is good and Crawford was playing pretty well before he had the surgery. It has massive potential to totally blow up in their faces, but it could also work out really well. It's a gamble; one of the biggest in MLB history.

Offline blue911

  • Posts: 16232
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #35: August 25, 2012, 01:09:17 AM »
Cameron can't see the logic behind this deal, other than to possibly boost LA attendance.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/red-sox-hit-reboot-dodgers-pick-up-pieces/


The Dodgers cable deal is about to expire. Kershaw, Kemp, Gonzalez,Ramirez, Crawford, Ethier and Beckett are a damn sexy team. Maybe not very good but sexy enough to set a record for largest RSN contract.

Offline Hogie

  • Posts: 480
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #36: August 25, 2012, 06:18:19 AM »
The Ethier deal was ridiculously stupid.

And this is even worse.

I remember when the team was sold. I wondered why they couldn't/wouldn't just be the west coast Yankees. I guess this is why.

Offline Minty Fresh

  • Posts: 16334
  • GOOOOOOOOOOD MORNIN' VIETNAM!
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #37: August 25, 2012, 07:50:38 AM »
People are focusing on how this will affect them long-term but this really helps them in the short term and we're good now.  Our chances of making the World Series have been reduced - perhaps significantly.

Offline blue911

  • Posts: 16232
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #38: August 25, 2012, 09:10:37 AM »
People are focusing on how this will affect them long-term but this really helps them in the short term and we're good now.  Our chances of making the World Series have been reduced - perhaps significantly.

They upgrade firstbase but Beckett is taking over Billingsley spot which is a downgrade. Maybe better, but the Dodgers rotation is a mess.

Offline Kevrock

  • Posts: 10886
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #39: August 25, 2012, 09:19:58 AM »
People are focusing on how this will affect them long-term but this really helps them in the short term and we're good now.  Our chances of making the World Series have been reduced - perhaps significantly.

The Dodgers need to make the playoffs for this to even matter. We do play them three times down the stretch, though.

Not to go all clubhouse chemistry on you but teams that try to buy a ton of talent fast often don't have success right away... see the Angels, and... well, the Red Sox.

It is one of the most fascinating trades in history, though. Should be fun to watch.

Offline CALSGR8

  • Posts: 11182
  • Be Loud * Be Proud * Be Positive
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #40: August 25, 2012, 10:55:14 AM »
I wonder if this is all due to the scuttlebutt about Valentine!

Offline houston-nat

  • Posts: 15785
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #41: August 25, 2012, 11:00:38 AM »
People are focusing on how this will affect them long-term but this really helps them in the short term and we're good now.  Our chances of making the World Series have been reduced - perhaps significantly.

Crawford's out for the year. Punto's kind of a zero. So it comes down to Gonzalez and Beckett, and while Gonzalez does improve the team's lineup a lot, Beckett is a complete mystery. He could be an okay pitcher or he could bomb. Baseball Prospectus currently gives the Dodgers 34.4% chances of making the playoffs; we'll see what happens after this trade is official.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 17170
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #42: August 25, 2012, 01:06:54 PM »
Adrian Gonzalez is in the tier of 1Bs right after Pujols and Votto.  Depending on your taste in defense, power, average and OBP, the next tier has Fielder, Texeira, and Gonzalez in some order.  Gonzalez's power was down from the ASB last  year to the ASB this year, but only Pujols and Ike Davis have more homers among MLB 1st basemen since the 2012 ASB.

As for Crawford, normal recovery and he'll be ready for spring training.  Getting out of Fenway is the best thing for his career.  He is a dead pull hitter who uses make up speed, not reads, for his outstanding defense.  Those two skills are wasted in Fenway. histrorically, he had a relatively bad record in Fenway for the Rays, and the Sox were infatuated idiots to think it would be otherwise. Epstein always had a mancrush on him, like he had on Julio Lugo. It was a desperate signing which they felt compelled to do after Werth signed here.  Going forward, athletic enough to anticipate a bounce back next year.  The contract has some dead money at the end of it, but I'm pretty sure he'll be good for them for a few years. 

Beckett is learning to pitch with less MPH on his 4 seem and without the great curve that made him a top tier pitcher.  This article says he's really a 2 / $15MM pitcher now.  the sox are covering 50 - 60% of his overpay by sending $12MM along with him.  If you count taking back Loney, it is slightly more that the Sox are assuming.  If Beckett's just an attitude problem and now motivated, then he's an extra asset.  More likely, he should be an upgrade over most 5th starters.

Offline HalfSmokes

  • Posts: 14595
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #43: August 25, 2012, 01:10:29 PM »
So is this the end of an era of the red sox spending with the Yankees

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 17170
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #44: August 25, 2012, 01:14:20 PM »
Era?  A couple of years when they were within 1/3 of the NYY payroll (2010 - 2012).

Offline Hogie

  • Posts: 480
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #45: August 25, 2012, 01:16:24 PM »
Seems to me this is just them shedding bad contracts so they can give out more (hopefully good) big contracts.

Offline blue911

  • Posts: 16232
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #46: August 25, 2012, 01:47:24 PM »
Era?  A couple of years when they were within 1/3 of the NYY payroll (2010 - 2012).

The Red Sox will be able to put in a credible bid on Greinke and Hamilton. I don't think that you get that kind of value out of Beckett,Gonzalez and Crawford.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 17170
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #47: August 25, 2012, 01:57:29 PM »
After this last episode, I wonder if they would take the chance on Greinke and his head.  They may, but I have to wonder.  De La Rosa is a very nice arm and would slot into the rotation next year.  He's essentially Jordan Zimmermann.  I think Webster is less, but he was their #2 prospect per BA coming into the year.

Offline blue911

  • Posts: 16232
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #48: August 25, 2012, 02:11:12 PM »
After this last episode, I wonder if they would take the chance on Greinke and his head.  They may, but I have to wonder.  De La Rosa is a very nice arm and would slot into the rotation next year.  He's essentially Jordan Zimmermann.  I think Webster is less, but he was their #2 prospect per BA coming into the year.

The knock on De La Rosa is his size, but he has a nice arm and there is no reason not to believe he could slide into the closer role next season. Webster isn't too shabby either, a BA top 100 prospect is nothing to complain about.

Offline DPMOmaha

  • Posts: 17897
Re: Red Sox fire sale
« Reply #49: August 25, 2012, 05:51:28 PM »
I wonder if this is all due to the scuttlebutt about Valentine!

Seems to me this is just them shedding bad contracts so they can give out more (hopefully good) big contracts.

Seems to me like they're choosing Valentine over the star players.