Author Topic: Nats and the 2012 Non-Waiver Trade deadline watch  (Read 28907 times)

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Offline welch

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I'm not sure that Ramos's knee injury will let him continue as a catcher, and he was not as smooth defensively at Flores. Of course, Flores is not as good defensively as Pudge, but nobody is.

However, yes, let Solanno start more. Don't over-work Flores, and get Solanno more experience.

Offline Jordanz Meatballz

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Any chance Morse could be a piece in an Upton trade? Either Upton I suppose.

Offline Lintyfresh85

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A torn ACL isn't a death sentence. Posey and Santana's injuries were much worse than what Ramos went through and they're both fine.

Offline comish4lif

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Any chance Morse could be a piece in an Upton trade? Either Upton I suppose.

Diamondbacks have Goldschmidt, don't need a 1B.

Offline PANatsFan

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From your favorite fanbase, Philadelphia.

Maybe now that we are not so good we can lose some of the bandwagon fans.

Any Idea how much longer Werth is out for?



A polite Phillies fan? That's unpossible!


Please hang out and act reasonable and buck the trend :)

Offline Mattionals

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I don't get why people think Ramos isn't a good defensive catcher.  He was better than Flores last year.  This year he looked bad but I wonder how much of that was not shaking off the rust of what happened to him in the winter, or maybe he played TOO much by playing winter ball.  Ramos was always considered to be a defense first catcher and the bat needed MLB development.  Last year he showed great D with a great bat.

Aside from the last two games where Solano struggled a bit defensively, I take him as a better backup to Ramos over Flores.  Trade Flores and Lannan for Shoppach, please.

Offline Jordanz Meatballz

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Diamondbacks have Goldschmidt, don't need a 1B.

Hmm. Doesn't the Rays' DH suck?

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Kelly Shoppach is certainly available.  Mostly plays v. LHP.  some pop, having a pretty good year, and can throw.

I'd trade Shoppach for Flores/Solano and Lannan/Duke/whatever other non-important arm.

What would the Red Sox be looking for in return?

My guess is pitching prospects.  They could use MLB rotation upgrades, but they are a little sclerotic in terms of their starting staff (the expensive guys stink and take up space).  They have too many outfielders, so nothing there.  Maybe an MI, but I don't see them needing a long term fix with their best position prospect a SS (Bogaerts) and a guy with an MLB glove at AAA (Iglesias).  DeRosa I don't think is better than Punto, so I think they'd look for minor league depth and bring up Lavarnway to backfill for Shoppach.

Offline Korzagg

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A polite Phillies fan? That's unpossible!


Please hang out and act reasonable and buck the trend :)


LOL, Yeah I get that alot.

Its a nice little site you have here, there are about 20 of us that left posting on ESPN about 18 months ago we made a forum much like this just not as advanced since we really dont let anyone new in.

but just talking to fans of your team you lose the insight from what other fanbases around the league are thinking so when I stumbled on your site I figured I would give it a shot. after all the worst that could happen is you guys chase me off and dont respond

Offline Slateman

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Dangle Morse or LaRoche and see what you can get. Offer to eat LaRoche's salary. Whatever prospects we get, package him/them and go get Span or Ellsbury (if by some miracle he's available). Now we have out CFer for the next three years till Goodwin is ready.

If Rendon had played up to his potential, I'd say we have something to offer for Upton. But he didn't and we don't.

Span fills a need. Morse/LaRoche is after first. We improve our outfield defense and get a real leadoff hitter.

Lombardozzi and Espinosa can platoon at second. Lombo is hitting .291/.345/.373 against righties, Espinosa hitting .300/.388/.489 of lefties. That's great for our number 2 hole. Move Harper down in the order and work with him to re-establish his approach to the strike zone.   

Offline CurlyDoubleyou

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Lombo and Espy platooning at 2nd makes a ton of sense as does trading one of Morse or LaRoche (preferably LaRoche). Ellsbury would be a ridiculous option to have in center, but unless the sawx GM is tripping on peyote I doubt he would be available. Span seems like the most logical guy to plug in until Goodwin is ready. While I briefly had the hots for Justin Upton I can't live with the thought of having to trade Rendon. Yes he has been injury prone recently, but I think the team would regret selling him low, big time, the guy is going to be amazing.

As far as where Harper fits in the lineup... Tough for me to judge, but if I had to guess I would leave him in the 2 hole. It seems like a good spot for him at the moment. Eventually I hope to see him in the 4 hole like the rest of us (I assume) but I think he has to earn it. If batting 2nd means more AB's and more plate experience, the better. Zimm is solid being 3rd, finally rebounding from his awful start.

A sweet near future lineup might look like this.

1st- Span, CF
2nd- Harper, RF
3rd- Zimm, 3B
4th- Morse, 1B
5th- Desmond, SS
6th- Werth, LF
7th- Espinosa/Lombo, 2B
8th- Flores/Solano, C

In the future Goodwin replaces Span's leadoff spot. Rendon will have to fit in somewhere, not sure if he's going to be an infielder or outfielder. My gut says he ends up at 2nd with Espy moving into a utility role or being dealt. Rendon will bat 2nd moving Harper to 4th moving Morse and the rest down the lineup.



Offline TylerDC

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Fangraphs has a really stupid article up proposing we trade Rendon, Espinosa, Meyer, and Leon for a 2 month rental of Hamels.

Offline Squab

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Fangraphs has a really stupid article up proposing we trade Rendon, Espinosa, Meyer, and Leon for a 2 month rental of Hamels.

We discussed it on page 8.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Slateman - don't laugh, but there is a shot Ellsbury would be available in the offseason.  He has one more year of arb and then is an FA.  he's rep'd by boras.  They have Jackie Bradley Jr., who is already in AA and kicking butt, plus possibly Kalish.  I think they are somewhat resigned to having to pay through the eyeballs to retain him and may look to deal him.  I don't see them bailing on this season with the expanded playoffs, so I don't see a deal this year.

Offline HalfSmokes

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Speed is just the tool I'd love to pay a free agent for-  look how well it worked for the red sox two years ago and the fish this year

Offline KnorrForYourMoney

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Really?  You think speed was the only tool owned by Crawford and Reyes?

That was just bum luck.

Offline blue911

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Really?  You think speed was the only tool owned by Crawford and Reyes?

That was just bum luck.

Not all luck. Aging effects quickness and speed much more than any other physical abilities. As we get older/stronger we develop those muscle groups which diminish of our speed/quickness.

Offline Tyler Durden

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Getting Span would probably mean losing LaRoche - I don't think I'd make that trade.  Especially not right now as we've got a pretty good thing going and LaRoche seems to be playing a pretty big part in that.  He also has a solid glove at 1B and brings some left-handed power - without him, it would leave Harper alone as the lefty power bat.

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Slateman - don't laugh, but there is a shot Ellsbury would be available in the offseason.  He has one more year of arb and then is an FA.  he's rep'd by boras.  They have Jackie Bradley Jr., who is already in AA and kicking butt, plus possibly Kalish.  I think they are somewhat resigned to having to pay through the eyeballs to retain him and may look to deal him.  I don't see them bailing on this season with the expanded playoffs, so I don't see a deal this year.

I am shocked by how advanced Bradley is.

Last time I checked, he had more walks than strikeouts.

Offline Tyler Durden

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My guess is pitching prospects.  They could use MLB rotation upgrades, but they are a little sclerotic in terms of their starting staff (the expensive guys stink and take up space).  They have too many outfielders, so nothing there.  Maybe an MI, but I don't see them needing a long term fix with their best position prospect a SS (Bogaerts) and a guy with an MLB glove at AAA (Iglesias).  DeRosa I don't think is better than Punto, so I think they'd look for minor league depth and bring up Lavarnway to backfill for Shoppach.

I wouldn't trade much for a part-time catcher - maybe a future 4th/5th starter type plus a AAA reliever who could help their pen right now?

If it costs more than that, Nats are better sticking with Flores or looking elsewhere.


Offline Lintyfresh85

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Really?  You think speed was the only tool owned by Crawford and Reyes?

That was just bum luck.

If speed was the only thing one needed, Nyjer Morgan would have been a star.

Offline HalfSmokes

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If speed was the only thing one needed, Nyjer Morgan would have been a star.

Speed was the primary tool for both Crawford and Reyes, they have other tools, but both were lead off hitters who could get on base and create havoc


Offline Lintyfresh85

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Speed was the primary tool for both Crawford and Reyes, they have other tools, but both were lead off hitters who could get on base and create havoc



So they also had bat skills and some knowledge of the strike zone.

You can't steal first base, as they say... and I think you're undervaluing the ability to reach first when you look at Reyes/Crawford.

Offline Slateman

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Slateman - don't laugh, but there is a shot Ellsbury would be available in the offseason.  He has one more year of arb and then is an FA.  he's rep'd by boras.  They have Jackie Bradley Jr., who is already in AA and kicking butt, plus possibly Kalish.  I think they are somewhat resigned to having to pay through the eyeballs to retain him and may look to deal him.  I don't see them bailing on this season with the expanded playoffs, so I don't see a deal this year.

He won't be. Kalish has been awful and Bradley is probably on the same time table as Goodwin. So at least two years away.

Only way we could get Ellsbury would be to give up some huge pitching prospects. Which we don't have anymore. Maybe if Purke had pitched well this season, we might be able to pull something off. About the only thing we could offer is bullpen help, which isn't enough. So, to get Ellsbury, we'd have to be willing to deal someone like Zimmermann or Detwiler if he continues to pitch well this season in addition to a few prospects.

Getting Span would probably mean losing LaRoche - I don't think I'd make that trade.  Especially not right now as we've got a pretty good thing going and LaRoche seems to be playing a pretty big part in that.  He also has a solid glove at 1B and brings some left-handed power - without him, it would leave Harper alone as the lefty power bat.

LaRoche is a streaky hitter. He's hot right now. Soon he'll be cold. Why does it matter about leaving Harper as the lone lefty power bat? He's already getting lefty specialists used on him and not LaRoche. We have enough depth at first and LaRoche will most likely not be back unless he wants to be a platoon player.



I am shocked by how advanced Bradley is.

Last time I checked, he had more walks than strikeouts.

In High A he did. Not so much this year. 24 strike outs to just 12 walks. Still walking at a 10% rate, but he's clearly striking out a lot too.

Offline Kevrock

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Slateman - don't laugh, but there is a shot Ellsbury would be available in the offseason.  He has one more year of arb and then is an FA.  he's rep'd by boras.  They have Jackie Bradley Jr., who is already in AA and kicking butt, plus possibly Kalish.  I think they are somewhat resigned to having to pay through the eyeballs to retain him and may look to deal him.  I don't see them bailing on this season with the expanded playoffs, so I don't see a deal this year.

JBJ never should have slid as far as he did.

I wouldn't trade Morse or LaRoche. Our lineup is anemic enough as is.