Author Topic: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams  (Read 15276 times)

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Offline Kevrock

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #250: November 30, 2011, 06:33:59 AM »
mlbtr says the Mariners are going after Fielder, if there's a team that is the perfect fit for him, it's seattle.  They desperately need hitting, they can move him into the DH role eventually, and they have plenty of good seafood restaurants (assuming he eats fish).

He's a vegetarian, bro.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #251: November 30, 2011, 08:50:04 AM »
Quote
I'll admit, it's a little dumb. But I just don't like him as a person, seeing him on tv and such.  But mostly I feel like the Red Sox needed someone stable after the circus that last season ended up being, and Valentine is/was a fiery dude that shoots off his mouth a bit much and butts heads with GMs. But thats all my opinion, I'm just not a Valentine fan.
I'm not in awe of Valentine and did not think he was the obvious manager, but he does have a few things going for him.  First, he'll call out loafers and have the stature to stand up to vets.  As you put it, the team was disfunctional down the stretch, and everyone, including Francona, said they needed a kick in the butt.  One reason Francona left he says is he did not think he was the right guy to do it due to his history with the players.  Second, for an older manager, they say he is very statistically oriented.  He was an early adopter of some of Bill James's ideas, so it is likely he can deal  with input from James and others in the Red Sox operations department.  That said, he has the stature to tell them to f'off if he feels something will not work.  Third, it probably would not take much to be better than Francona at this, but he is a knowledgeable in game manager.  His problem always was warring with his GM and owners and not his game managing. If I'm Cherington, then I watch my back, especially since this guy is Lucchino's choice.  Bottom line is Farrell was not available, Mills has not shown much in Houston, and Hale was too closely tied to the 2011 season to be the change they were looking for.  IF Valentine works, then great.  If he doesn't, Farrell will have his contract run out soon.

Offline DPMOmaha

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #252: November 30, 2011, 12:29:45 PM »
Cubs sign David DeJesus

Offline hammondsnats

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #253: November 30, 2011, 12:32:54 PM »
Cubs sign David DeJesus

good signing for them.  i believe he's gonna be their everyday RF.

linty is going to be :(

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #254: November 30, 2011, 12:47:51 PM »
Smart move by Theo.

Better hope Upton comes available. Soon it'll be him or Ankiel as the only choices left.

We don't need two pitchers in the lineup every day again.

Online sportsfan882

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #255: November 30, 2011, 01:08:23 PM »
DeJesus sucks balls. Mediocre player. Sub .700 OPS last year with Oakland

Offline hammondsnats

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #256: November 30, 2011, 01:10:23 PM »
i wonder if soriano ends up staying in chicago.  seems like theo could be pushing him out and willing to take a bite out of the contract.

Offline hammondsnats

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #257: November 30, 2011, 01:12:37 PM »
DeJesus sucks balls. Mediocre player. Sub .700 OPS last year with Oakland

almost .800 OPS (i think it was like .789 or something) in his career with royals though.

Online KnorrForYourMoney

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #258: November 30, 2011, 01:13:18 PM »
Hah, I love it.  Another polarized set of opinions from Linty and Assclown in which they're both wrong.

Dejesus is marginal/slightly below average.  He isn't the worst option in the world, but wouldn't be much of an upgrade for the Nats either.  This team needs to aim higher.

Offline hammondsnats

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #259: November 30, 2011, 01:15:31 PM »
Hah, I love it.  Another polarized set of opinions from Linty and Assclown in which they're both wrong.

Dejesus is marginal/slightly below average.  He isn't the worst option in the world, but wouldn't be much of an upgrade for the Nats either.  This team needs to aim higher.

they have the greatest rivalry in message board history.  or it ranks up there. 


Offline Minty Fresh

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #260: November 30, 2011, 01:16:10 PM »
I fail to see where Linty proclaimed DeJesus's impending HoF induction.

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #261: November 30, 2011, 01:24:44 PM »
Hah, I love it.  Another polarized set of opinions from Linty and Assclown in which they're both wrong.


All I said was that it was a smart move by Theo.

:shrug:


Online KnorrForYourMoney

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #262: November 30, 2011, 01:56:14 PM »
You implied that the Nats were missing out on FA OF'ers that we could use.  Dejesus doesn't represent some significant upgrade over last year's production.

Online sportsfan882

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #263: November 30, 2011, 01:56:52 PM »
Quote
Kevin_Goldstein Kevin Goldstein
Average NL RF hit .271/.345/.449 last year. I'll take the under on DeJesus.

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #264: November 30, 2011, 02:03:06 PM »
You implied that the Nats were missing out on FA OF'ers that we could use.  Dejesus doesn't represent some significant upgrade over last year's production.

I'll bet you a wooden nickel that in 2012 DeJesus out produces the triple slash line of all Nats CF'er from 2011 which was .245/.307/.371/.678

Online sportsfan882

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #265: November 30, 2011, 02:07:48 PM »
He'll be playing RF, not CF

Online KnorrForYourMoney

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #266: November 30, 2011, 02:49:26 PM »
I'll bet you a wooden nickel that in 2012 DeJesus out produces the triple slash line of all Nats CF'er from 2011 which was .245/.307/.371/.678

Wouldn't doubt that, but by how much?  Ankiel had 1.4 WAR and Dejesus 2.2 last year.  Not a big difference.  And as Assclown just pointed out, Dejesus is now relegated to corner OF, so I'd expect that WAR to drop if he performs poorly at CF.

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #267: November 30, 2011, 03:03:38 PM »
Wouldn't doubt that, but by how much?  Ankiel had 1.4 WAR and Dejesus 2.2 last year.  Not a big difference.  And as Assclown just pointed out, Dejesus is now relegated to corner OF, so I'd expect that WAR to drop if he performs poorly at CF.

Wait... nearly a win difference isn't a big deal?

Offline tomterp

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #268: November 30, 2011, 03:10:41 PM »
Wait... nearly a win difference isn't a big deal?

If you buy that the stat is highly accurate, yes.  If you believe there are relevant factors outside the measurement in which Ankiel may be superior, then the difference may not be such a big deal. 


Online KnorrForYourMoney

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #269: November 30, 2011, 03:20:36 PM »
^That, and...

Wait... nearly a win difference isn't a big deal?

Did you miss my last part about Dejesus only being able to play corner OF?

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #270: November 30, 2011, 03:41:59 PM »
^That, and...

Did you miss my last part about Dejesus only being able to play corner OF?

I'm still missing the point where you said I was slobbering over DeJesus.

I think his below average defense would be made up for with an above average bat for CF. Most baseball people, including the Cubs seem to disagree.

Having said that, I think he has a fine season in Chicago.

Online KnorrForYourMoney

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #271: November 30, 2011, 03:55:24 PM »
I'm still missing the point where you said I was slobbering over DeJesus.

:bang: I never said that.  Read my exact post like ten posts up.  You implied he was a "miss" for the Nationals and I don't really think so.

A 91 OPS+ is not an above average bat at any OF position, including CF.

Anyway, I've said all there is to say on this.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #272: November 30, 2011, 05:14:02 PM »
Knorr - If the Nats had signed DeJesus, he would have been our leadoff hitter for 2012 and likely performed well enough.  Even last year's .323 OBP would have been better than what we ran out there in 2011.

Here is some discussion of his 2011 off numbers. Note the BABIP and the maintenance of his career walk rate.
Quote
Why did DeJesus have such a poor year offensively? When you dig into his numbers, it becomes apparent that DeJesus hasn’t suffered a skill degradation at the plate. His walk rate (8.9%) was the highest its been since 2007, and he didn’t lose any power either (.136 ISO, .137 career ISO). His strikeout rate spiked up a considerable amount to 17% (normally sits around 11-13%), but his plate discipline statistics haven’t gotten noticeably worse. He swung at 39% of pitches overall and only 24% of pitches outside the zone, both of which are considerably better than league average and very similar to his tendencies over the previous two seasons.

Instead, DeJesus’ “slump” seems to have been a product of his .274 BABIP – the worst of his career. That may not seem low, but DeJesus has a .316 career BABIP. I didn’t watch the Athletics consistently, so I don’t feel comfortable commenting on why DeJesus’ BABIP was depressed last year. Was it a product of bad luck? Was it him not making consistent solid contact? Did injuries play a role? It’s likely a little bit of all three reasons. Regardless, though, it still remains quite likely that he’ll improve in 2012 and have a better overall offensive season.

Between him and Werth, we probably had a passable CF, and I would have liked to have seen him in left with Morse at 1st and LaRoche sleeping with the fishes (Rays).  FWIW, Bill James projects a bounce back year in terms of OBP - .349 - which is still off his career avereage of .356.

figures it'd be and Linty who be saying he could be an adequate leadoff guy.

Offline hammondsnats

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #273: November 30, 2011, 05:25:13 PM »
tigers interested in coco crisp

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: 2011 - 12 offseason for other teams
« Reply #274: November 30, 2011, 05:26:18 PM »
I heard he wanted to stay out west.

Wonder how much money it'll take to change his mind?