Author Topic: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.  (Read 2243 times)

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Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #25: June 10, 2011, 03:32:35 PM »
And where'd you get it from? My post on WNFF?

No. I looked up his name on Twitter.

Offline sportsfan882

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #26: June 10, 2011, 03:39:10 PM »
I posted it 2 days before you posted it. We were talking about it on there well before you posted it on your blog. You may have looked his name up on Twitter, but only after seeing those posts. But all the more power to you, you have the blog but for someone who is bashing the media for not giving credit..

http://www.wnff.net/index.php?topic=22890.msg778989#msg778989

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #27: June 10, 2011, 03:46:26 PM »
I posted it 2 days before you posted it. We were talking about it on there well before you posted it on your blog. You may have looked his name up on Twitter, but only after seeing those posts. But all the more power to you, you have the blog but for someone who is bashing the media for not giving credit..

http://www.wnff.net/index.php?topic=22890.msg778989#msg778989


Considering I didn't even respond to your post, it's pretty clear I didn't get the idea from you.

And I didn't post a story for two days because I didn't look up his name on Twitter till two days later.

If you want credit for it, go ahead take it.

Offline Glockypoo

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #28: June 10, 2011, 03:50:35 PM »
Well now I kind of feel like a dick.

You shouldn't. His language was offensive and you had every right to be concerned.

But as I insinuated earlier kids like Zach are usually the least racist people on the planet. They're just ignorant.

I write recruiting articles for rivals.com and follow most of the kids I interview on Facebook. The stuff they post is insane. Just a different world they live in.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #29: June 10, 2011, 03:53:59 PM »
How much you want to bet the summer interns at the Nats office right now are googling each draftee, finding if they are on twitter, looking at their facebook pages, to see if there are other remarks that do not look right when public.

Linty, this was still a nice job.  Something Post interns should have done.  Then Kilgore could have broken it. 

Nice leg work by SF and others too.  To be fair, if it was written about here earlier, it did not have the same impact as FLOTN had.  It's kind of like Leif Ericsson to Columbus.  As a practical matter, Columbus worked independently and his later "discovery" had the impact, but it does not take away what Ericsson did.  Or the Native Americans, who knew they were here already.

Online Kevrock

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #30: June 10, 2011, 03:57:19 PM »
You shouldn't. You're far from the only person who interpreted what he said that way. Without your post, he may never have had this lesson and it may have become an issue when he couldn't come back from it.

This. It's a tough lesson that he needed to learn. It's a shame, but it's definitely not on you, Linty.

Offline RD

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #31: June 10, 2011, 04:23:47 PM »
Im glad he got a chance to at least explain his side.

Like I said, I saw nothing offensive in it. There is a huge difference between the word ending in A and ending in ER. Any black person would tell you the same.

A is a term of endearment essentially. I guess it has a lot to do with how and where you were raised. I am white, but I was in the minority at my high school. In any urban area, this is commonplace. Whites call whites it, blacks call whites it. Whites call blacks it. Asians call mexicans it. Twice this week, I have been called it. By a 48 year old black guy at work, and a 27 year old white friend. I admit, when I was in high school, I used it as well. Its like whats up dude, whats up bro, things along those lines. It's not derogatory.

Certainly, you dont walk up to a person on the street and call them it. But among friends, it is a commong slang word. Whether you think its right or not, thats how society is. I dont believe Ive used it since I was in high school(maybe 18/19) but don't see the wrong in it, when it's amongst friends who understand.

Hopefully the kid can get past this, and it's a lesson learned.

Offline Evolution33

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #32: June 10, 2011, 04:25:42 PM »
What would be funny is if the Nats knew about this all along and that when it came out in this age of twitter and blogs it would force him to sign for less or at least not go to ECU.

Offline GburgNatsFan

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #33: June 10, 2011, 04:37:05 PM »
It's interesting how much variation there is in our American culture. Just to get a little more clarification, would you use it on Twitter, not with a friend in an interpersonal exchange, but leave it out there for everyone to see?

Or maybe kids that are college age just don't realize that anything you ever wrote can follow you around, forever.

Im glad he got a chance to at least explain his side.

Like I said, I saw nothing offensive in it. There is a huge difference between the word ending in A and ending in ER. Any black person would tell you the same.

A is a term of endearment essentially. I guess it has a lot to do with how and where you were raised. I am white, but I was in the minority at my high school. In any urban area, this is commonplace. Whites call whites it, blacks call whites it. Whites call blacks it. Asians call mexicans it. Twice this week, I have been called it. By a 48 year old black guy at work, and a 27 year old white friend. I admit, when I was in high school, I used it as well. Its like whats up dude, whats up bro, things along those lines. It's not derogatory.

Certainly, you dont walk up to a person on the street and call them it. But among friends, it is a commong slang word. Whether you think its right or not, thats how society is. I dont believe Ive used it since I was in high school(maybe 18/19) but don't see the wrong in it, when it's amongst friends who understand.

Hopefully the kid can get past this, and it's a lesson learned.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #34: June 10, 2011, 04:51:20 PM »
Also, as Ben and Kilgore have pointed out, there were misogynist statements and racial epithets directed at Asian people.  It may even be a convenient excuse to say "oh, it's just how I talk with my friends, who are mostly African- Amnerican."  The scattershot nature of his epithets makes him less credible. But I can see how he may not have meant it the way it was initially taken. I hope that is right but, before the Nats trust, I want them to verify.  It's pretty clear they had not investigated this before the draft (hard to do, I guess, with several hundred players on their board).

Offline RD

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #35: June 10, 2011, 05:06:09 PM »
It's interesting how much variation there is in our American culture. Just to get a little more clarification, would you use it on Twitter, not with a friend in an interpersonal exchange, but leave it out there for everyone to see?

Or maybe kids that are college age just don't realize that anything you ever wrote can follow you around, forever.


I dont have a twitter account, so Im not really familiar with how everything works. I know the basics though.

I saw his page for a minute but it wasn't anything too crazy IMO. It appears that most of his comments were directed at other people; friends. So yeah, I think it definitely makes sense there. If he's just making a statement about what he's up to or whatever, again, it's generally for his friends to see.

I definitely think he's being naive and not really thinking about the big picture here. This stuff gets out to everyone -the entire world. Being that he's 18, I think you can forgive him for that. I have friends in their late 20's that it still hasn't dawned on them about all this stuff. My best friend's sister put on facebook that she was pregnant before telling her brothers or family. Obviously a completely different situation - Just noting that some people like the attention of putting things out there and don't consider the value of saying things face to face(whether thats in person or over the phone). Its the way the world is right now.

He's got some growing up to do, but Im sure there are bigger issues involved with that than certain words he uses on twitter.

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #36: June 10, 2011, 05:10:58 PM »
RD, you can't say it's not offensive.

Regardless if its 'a' or 'er' the majority of people DO find it offensive.

Offline RD

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #37: June 10, 2011, 05:54:56 PM »

Like I said, if you're near any type of urban area, you will hear this type of talk in every day communication.

Im not going to say that nobody finds it offensive. Im sure there are, from all types of races. But, you can't make everyone happy. Thats why he needs to learn the lessen to not broadcast everything over the internet for people to see. But if he speaks that way to his friends and people that he knows, and they know how hes using it, it's not offensive. So you shouldn't be judging his character before you know the details. That was the entire premise of my original post.

He's learning the lessen the hard way. But he shouldn't be punished or crucified in the media or by people that don't know anything about him, or the way he speaks. If you don't know, don't judge.

Online mitlen

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #38: June 10, 2011, 06:53:23 PM »
Like I said, if you're near any type of urban area, you will hear this type of talk in every day communication.

Im not going to say that nobody finds it offensive. Im sure there are, from all types of races. But, you can't make everyone happy. Thats why he needs to learn the lessen to not broadcast everything over the internet for people to see. But if he speaks that way to his friends and people that he knows, and they know how hes using it, it's not offensive. So you shouldn't be judging his character before you know the details. That was the entire premise of my original post.

He's learning the lessen the hard way. But he shouldn't be punished or crucified in the media or by people that don't know anything about him, or the way he speaks. If you don't know, don't judge.
   
Please don't misconstrue my comment but "you're trying too hard to explain this".   I'm a white man in my '60s.   I know what it means.

Offline PANatsFan

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #39: June 10, 2011, 06:57:15 PM »
Like I said, if you're near any type of urban area, you will hear this type of talk in every day communication.


On the occasions that I do hear it, it's like fingernails on a chalkboard. And I've only heard a white person use it once, in a gas station in hicksville, and he was talking about his friend, and it was still galling.

Offline SkinsNats

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #40: June 10, 2011, 07:50:06 PM »
   
Please don't misconstrue my comment but "you're trying too hard to explain this".   I'm a white man in my '60s.   I know what it means.

What it means to you is not the same as what it means to Zach Houchins though. It is understandable that you would be offended by the word given your age and experiences. It is also understandable that he doesn't think of the word the same way given his different age and different life experiences. There is actually a big difference between -a and -er.

Online mitlen

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #41: June 10, 2011, 07:52:34 PM »
What it means to you is not the same as what it means to Zach Houchins though. It is understandable that you would be offended by the word given your age and experiences. It is also understandable that he doesn't think of the word the same way given his different age and different life experiences. There is actually a big difference between -a and -er.


As I mentioned, don't misconstrue.   I know what he's writtin'/sayin'.   But as a white man, it's not what I would call my sister-in-law (with an "a", an "er" or an "ette").    I don't have to go near an urban area to live life and have diversity.   I go to a family reunion.  

Offline CALSGR8

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #42: June 10, 2011, 08:00:31 PM »
First of all Linty did nothing wrong.  I read about this issue in the Post.  Apparently the "N" word wasn't the only offensive word he used.  Anti-Asian and Homophobic language was also used.

RD, I see your point that that's the way his friends talk amongst themselves.   HOWEVER, that doesn't make it right!  That word along with other offensive language should Not be used casually!   Even "These days". 

Also, he may not post it any more but who's to say he doesn't get quoted by someone who does!  Once its in your casual conversation,  it can slip into your professional conversation.

I don't think he shouldn't be signed but he has to learn that words can hurt and he should face some kind of consequences.   

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Offline GburgNatsFan

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #43: June 10, 2011, 08:44:53 PM »
I get what you are saying, although I would never, never use that word, and have taught my children the same (we're suburban, white, and I think it would be incredibly in-appropriate).

I'm curious about your last sentence though, "don't judge." How do you know someone, except by their actions, by what they say, by what they do?

Like I said, if you're near any type of urban area, you will hear this type of talk in every day communication.

Im not going to say that nobody finds it offensive. Im sure there are, from all types of races. But, you can't make everyone happy. Thats why he needs to learn the lessen to not broadcast everything over the internet for people to see. But if he speaks that way to his friends and people that he knows, and they know how hes using it, it's not offensive. So you shouldn't be judging his character before you know the details. That was the entire premise of my original post.

He's learning the lessen the hard way. But he shouldn't be punished or crucified in the media or by people that don't know anything about him, or the way he speaks. If you don't know, don't judge.

Offline Terpfan76

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #44: June 10, 2011, 09:43:07 PM »
Like I said, if you're near any type of urban area, you will hear this type of talk in every day communication.

Im not going to say that nobody finds it offensive. Im sure there are, from all types of races. But, you can't make everyone happy. Thats why he needs to learn the lessen to not broadcast everything over the internet for people to see. But if he speaks that way to his friends and people that he knows, and they know how hes using it, it's not offensive. So you shouldn't be judging his character before you know the details. That was the entire premise of my original post.

He's learning the lessen the hard way. But he shouldn't be punished or crucified in the media or by people that don't know anything about him, or the way he speaks. If you don't know, don't judge.


Working in a prison, I hear that word used in any and every context imaginable every day. There are times I hear it said by a white guy to a black guy and think "Oh crap, here we go..." pulse racing type stuff... and nothing happens. It's after the fact that you realize that they are "friends" and fellow gang members in this situation. I guess it's acceptable to them... I personally don't quite understand it, I grew up in a small town with a population of something like 90+ percent white folk of the approx 21,000 citizens. Those of you who follow HS Football will recall that my Alma mater Fort Hill High School got into some heat over an alleged racial slur during a game against Dunbar (D.C.). I'm not gonna sit here and act like I'm someone special, I've used it before. Most of us have whether you want to admit it or not. That being said, I didn't make it a part of my regular lexicon and do not use it anymore. I'm amazed however at the casual way that word is tossed around these days. I think the young man needs to realize that regardless of whether he's friends with black folks or not, it's not just his friends reading this stuff now, there's a lot of people reading it including his future employers. You have to remember that when you Tweet, Facebook or Myspace, you should assume that strangers will be reading what you say and post accordingly.

Online mitlen

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #45: June 10, 2011, 09:48:59 PM »
I don't wanna denigrate anybody.   My son is 1/4 Japanese.   I have relatives who are black, mixed race, gay/lesbian, ethnic, etc.    I don't wanna be on a soap box either.   I simply think there's a certain respect we owe each other.   I don't care what words you use, I don' use 'em.    As someone mentioned, it's like finger nails on a chalkboard.   To me, it's respect.   I'm done preachin' (LOL), I'm off to the Nats' vs Padres game.  

Offline Terpfan76

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #46: June 10, 2011, 09:55:18 PM »
I don't wanna denigrate anybody.   My son is 1/4 Japanese.   I have relatives who are black, mixed race, gay/lesbian, ethnic, etc.    I don't wanna be on a soap box either.   I simply think there's a certain respect we owe each other.   I don't care what words you use, I don' use 'em.    As someone mentioned, it's like finger nails on a chalkboard.   To me, it's respect.   I'm done preachin' (LOL), I'm off to the Nats' vs Padres game.   

 :cheers:

I've got the same in my family, minus the 1/4 Japanese. Growing up and maturing goes a long way in changing ones perceptions. I'm not proud, I'm just honest. And I'm not for a second suggesting otherwise of you or anyone else, I'm just of the belief that because it's such a hot button issue that people will swear up in down that they don't say or do something, when in fact, they are but hypocrites. Not everyone mind you, just more than not. All things considered, I hope this kid learns his lesson and reevaluates himself. He sounds more ignorant than anything.

Online mitlen

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #47: June 10, 2011, 10:00:36 PM »
:cheers:

I've got the same in my family, minus the 1/4 Japanese. Growing up and maturing goes a long way in changing ones perceptions. I'm not proud, I'm just honest. And I'm not for a second suggesting otherwise of you or anyone else, I'm just of the belief that because it's such a hot button issue that people will swear up in down that they don't say or do something, when in fact, they are but hypocrites. Not everyone mind you, just more than not. All things considered, I hope this kid learns his lesson and reevaluates himself. He sounds more ignorant than anything.

We've all used those words.   Those of us who have learned our lessons know that those words hurt people.   I agree that someday he'll look back and know.

Offline NatsGM

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #48: June 10, 2011, 10:16:34 PM »
I think that GM Mike Rizzo should be holding that area scout's feet to the fire...  this is a rather large screw up and the exact reason teams have area scouts(to find out if a kid will sign, find out about his makeup, and embarrassing stuff exactly like this.)  There were posters on here that found that "stuff" within minutes and hours, an area scout who spends 12 months a year studying his territory should have caught this well before selecting him on day 2 of the draft.

For the Nationals to have taken this kid in round 15, an area scout saw that kid at least twice and someone else likely saw him as well.  Very strange that they would miss this-

Offline welch

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Re: Zach Houchins needs to shut up.
« Reply #49: June 10, 2011, 10:19:39 PM »
He sounds like John Rocker.

Here is Rocker live one Saturday night:

http://www.blinkx.com/watch-video/snl-will-ferrell-is-john-rocker/5XnvNroJGOhzVSq9d6hAaQ