Author Topic: 2009/2010 Hot Stove Thread  (Read 20675 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline ronnynat

  • Posts: 23269

Offline Potomac Cannons

  • Posts: 3279
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #301: December 14, 2009, 09:42:14 PM »
puke. The rich get richer.

The Mariners are really making a push this off-season. Why aren't we doing the same thing?

Really?  Exactly how many times does it have to be explained that we have very little to trade?  Even what we do have is the kind of stuff that nets you Brian f'n Bruney, not Roy Halladay or Cliff Lee.  Give it time.

Offline sportsfan882

  • Posts: 93631
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #302: December 14, 2009, 09:53:47 PM »
Who is Seattle giving up? Aumont ain't that special.

Offline Potomac Cannons

  • Posts: 3279
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #303: December 14, 2009, 10:02:59 PM »
I was talking before they got Lee.

Ian Snell? Carlos Silva? Jason Vargas? Ryan Rowland-Smith? Garrett Olson?

The Nats starters are no worse.

Um....Erik Bedard.  That's 15 starts that are better than the entire starting staff of the Nats combined.  He's a punk, a clubhouse pariah, and a quitter, but he's fantastic when he bothers to pitch.  Let's look at their pitchers, other than Felix, with 10 or more starts last year.

Rowland-Smith has been league average or better in K/9 his two of his three years, had his WHIP go 1.4, 1.37, and 1.18 in those three years, and has had a league average or better FIP each of those years.  He'll be 27 at the end of January and is just hitting his stride.

Vargas, who is 27 in February, put up his highest IP total so far and had league average K/9 and WHIP. 

Luke French, a 24 year old rookie, struggled.

Ian Snell was worse than league average in K/9 for the first time in his career.  His WHIP and FIP were both below league average as well. 

Garrett Olson, all of 25 last year, had league average WHIP but below average K/9 and FIP.

Doug Fister, a 25 year old rookie, was better than average in WHIP, slightly below average in K/9 and below average FIP.

Brandon Morrow, another 25 year old, who had primarily been a reliever up to that point, had way above average K/9 and below average WHIP and FIP.

Let's see.  That gives them two potential #1 SPs until Bedard goes down.  They also had Rowland-Smith develop and a couple of rookies got their feet wet at the MLB level with good numbers. 

That's 2 guys clearly better than Lannan at this point, 1 who most would say is better, and a bunch of others who were given a shot.  Add in a good bullpen and there's no real comparison to be made as far as what Seattle had last year compared to the Nats.

Offline Potomac Cannons

  • Posts: 3279
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #304: December 14, 2009, 10:05:34 PM »
Who is Seattle giving up? Aumont ain't that special.

Wow.  A 20 year old who dominated high-A ball and had great K/9 and FIP at AA isn't that special?  He's a back of the bullpen prospect who should be there in 2 years max.

Offline sportsfan882

  • Posts: 93631
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #305: December 14, 2009, 10:10:02 PM »
Drew Storen is better.

Aumont as a reliever doesn't have nearly the value he did as a starter. Aumont also got lit up in the AFL against premium competition.

Offline Potomac Cannons

  • Posts: 3279
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #306: December 14, 2009, 10:39:39 PM »
Drew Storen is better.

Aumont as a reliever doesn't have nearly the value he did as a starter. Aumont also got lit up in the AFL against premium competition.

Aumont is 2 years younger than Storen.  He tore up high-A and his only struggle at AA/AFL was with his control even though his K/9 and FIP were still stellar.  He's earned his way to AA at 20.  That's a premium prospect who closes well even with the struggles.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 39750
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #307: December 15, 2009, 08:44:22 AM »
Frankly, no one on g-d's green earth knows who will be better, Aumont or Storen.  We are talking about two of the best relief prospects in baseball.  They are quite comparable.  Storen is more mature, Aumont has a higher upside and has had a track record that does not indicate he'll miss his upside.

If the Ms keep Fields, then Aumont is a dealable chip and to get Lee is a good use of the chip.  What the mouths on MLBNetwork were saying is that Aumont was a key that allowed Philly to put the pitcher Toronto wanted into the deal.

Offline sportsfan882

  • Posts: 93631
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #308: December 16, 2009, 09:02:52 PM »
Quote
The Orioles are nearing a two-year deal with lefty reliever Mike Gonzalez, reports Jeff Zrebiec of the Baltimore Sun.  Gonzalez's physical should occur this week.  Since the Braves offered arbitration to Gonzalez, a Type A free agent, the Orioles will surrender their second-round pick (currently #43) to them.

Offline PatsNats28

  • Posts: 8522
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #309: December 16, 2009, 10:22:28 PM »
would he have been good for us?

Offline cmdterps44

  • Posts: 15551
  • Future
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #310: December 16, 2009, 11:22:33 PM »
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/12/orioles-sign-garrett-atkins.html

The O's also have Garrett Atkins now. They're being aggressive. I want us to sign all the spots we need like this.

Offline Potomac Cannons

  • Posts: 3279
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #311: December 16, 2009, 11:32:11 PM »
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/12/orioles-sign-garrett-atkins.html

The O's also have Garrett Atkins now. They're being aggressive. I want us to sign all the spots we need like this.

They signed a 30 year old 3B who is well below average defensively and whose bat has been in steady decline for 3 years, and was never good outside of Coors Field, and you want us to go that route?  That's what got us Pudgy Rod at 2/6m instead of a good catcher.

Offline cmdterps44

  • Posts: 15551
  • Future
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #312: December 16, 2009, 11:34:35 PM »
I never said sign someone who sucks... They're just signing to fill positions. I want us to sign quickly, the positions we need.

I don't know what goes beyond the curtain but I just want to know who else were negotiating with.

Plus, I think its good for them since they are probably going to replace him with their prospects.

Offline Potomac Cannons

  • Posts: 3279
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #313: December 16, 2009, 11:46:51 PM »
I never said sign someone who sucks... They're just signing to fill positions. I want us to sign quickly, the positions we need.

I don't know what goes beyond the curtain but I just want to know who else were negotiating with.

Plus, I think its good for them since they are probably going to replace him with their prospects.

I want us to sign good players and I don't give a flying monkey pile when it happens.  We aren't going to be in contention for the top tier FAs at this point and there's no reason to sign someone merely to do so.  We are going for guys like Pineiro, Marquis and Garland who are going to have multiple options and may want to take their time and see what other offers come along.  Tomorrow, or two days before ST starts, just sign the best players we can.

Offline PANatsFan

  • Posts: 37398
  • dogs in uncensored, nudes in gameday
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #314: December 17, 2009, 12:16:41 AM »
The impatience is silly. Sign bad players like Atkins now, or wait a bit and get the Garlands. Hmm.

Offline cmdterps44

  • Posts: 15551
  • Future
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #315: December 17, 2009, 12:22:00 AM »
I'm not implying us sign terrible players now. I'm just trying to avoid coming to that time late in the offseason when theres 1 or 2 players left and they don't sign here.

I understand theres alot of time left but I'd just like to see an offer out there sometime soon. I also understand its the players choice to wait around and see the options but at least try and make an impressionable offer to draw them closer.

Offline tomterp

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 33783
  • Hell yes!
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #316: December 17, 2009, 08:06:49 AM »
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/12/orioles-sign-garrett-atkins.html

The O's also have Garrett Atkins now. They're being aggressive. I want us to sign all the spots we need like this.

They also are reported to have signed Mike Gonzalez, and if I heard XM right this morning (big "if"), it was for 2 years at $6m per, or $12m.  Hope that I heard that wrong, because that's an extraordinary price to pay for a reliever, even Gonzalez.

MLBtraderumors also has them rumored to be among Holliday's more aggressive suitors.

Offline tomterp

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 33783
  • Hell yes!
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #317: December 17, 2009, 08:16:04 AM »
Update, no, I didn't hear it wrong.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/12/orioles-near-agreement-with-mike-gonzalez.html

Quote
9:38pm: Not a surprise given the money he's making, but Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports (via Twitter) confirms that Gonzalez will indeed be the closer in Baltimore.

8:07pm: Yahoo Sports' Tim Brown tweets that an agreement has been reached for $12MM, with incentives that could make it worth as much as $16MM.


Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 39750
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #318: December 17, 2009, 09:26:24 AM »
 
They also are reported to have signed Mike Gonzalez, and if I heard XM right this morning (big "if"), it was for 2 years at $6m per, or $12m.  Hope that I heard that wrong, because that's an extraordinary price to pay for a reliever, even Gonzalez.

MLBtraderumors also has them rumored to be among Holliday's more aggressive suitors.

Reminds of the year they went out and signed Bradford, Walker, Danys Baez, and Scott Williamson, all for a ton of money, and they got an acceptable year out of only Walker (and a tradeable year out of Bradford).

Holliday?  I thought the Os had 4 good young outfielders.  Also saw a rumor that they were pursuing A-Gon, which makes mroe sense but costs prospects / major leaguers.

Online HalfSmokes

  • Posts: 21641
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #319: December 17, 2009, 09:36:46 AM »

Reminds of the year they went out and signed Bradford, Walker, Danys Baez, and Scott Williamson, all for a ton of money, and they got an acceptable year out of only Walker (and a tradeable year out of Bradford).

Holliday?  I thought the Os had 4 good young outfielders.  Also saw a rumor that they were pursuing A-Gon, which makes mroe sense but costs prospects / major leaguers.

Rheinhold (sp?) to DH, Jones in Center and Markakias (sp?) in right- who am I forgetting

Offline Minty Fresh

  • Posts: 20386
  • BOOM!
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #320: December 17, 2009, 09:39:39 AM »
They signed a 30 year old 3B who is well below average defensively and whose bat has been in steady decline for 3 years, and was never good outside of Coors Field, and you want us to go that route?  That's what got us Pudgy Rod at 2/6m instead of a good catcher.

:clap: :clap: :clap:

Offline doubler

  • Posts: 154
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #321: December 17, 2009, 11:26:24 AM »

Reminds of the year they went out and signed Bradford, Walker, Danys Baez, and Scott Williamson, all for a ton of money, and they got an acceptable year out of only Walker (and a tradeable year out of Bradford).

Holliday?  I thought the Os had 4 good young outfielders.  Also saw a rumor that they were pursuing A-Gon, which makes mroe sense but costs prospects / major leaguers.

I think Mike Gonzalez is better quality than those RP's you mentioned. I think the Gonzalez signing is a good one for them.

The Atkins signing....eh, its only for one year, and he is bridging the gap to Josh Bell, so I dont think its a terrible move.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 39750
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #322: December 17, 2009, 11:54:25 AM »
Rheinhold (sp?) to DH, Jones in Center and Markakias (sp?) in right- who am I forgetting

Pie.  Also, Luke Scott, though he might end up at first.

Offline Potomac Cannons

  • Posts: 3279
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #323: December 17, 2009, 04:39:28 PM »
Pie.  Also, Luke Scott, though he might end up at first.

Felix Pie.  Finally showed signs of realizing his potential last season.  He's only 25 in February, already a plus defender, and now he's coming around at the plate.

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

  • Global Moderator
  • ****
  • Posts: 39750
  • Platoon - not just a movie, a baseball obsession
Re: 2009 Hot Stove Thread
« Reply #324: December 17, 2009, 05:02:30 PM »
Felix Pie.  Finally showed signs of realizing his potential last season.  He's only 25 in February, already a plus defender, and now he's coming around at the plate.

If I were filling out the Os line up right now, it'd be:

Roberts - 2d
Jones - CF
Markakis - RF
Reimold - DH
Weiters - C
Scott/ Wigginton - 1B
Atkins - 3B
Pie - LF
Izturis - SS