Author Topic: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1  (Read 5085 times)

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Offline bklynnats

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #350: July 21, 2009, 11:33:41 AM »
The Mutts suck this year so all their bandwagon fans are keeping well away.

You would think the bandwagoners would come out to watch the Mets against a team they can actually beat :bag:

Good call on Clippard, Linty. He had a great night last night. The rest of the game was so pathetic that what he contributed will probably be lost, but that's the best (and most confident) he's looked since his call up. Hopefully he can carry it over to his next appearance.

Offline DPMOmaha

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #351: July 21, 2009, 11:36:55 AM »
The Bad

JD Martin - Not a pretty first start. I'll withhold judgment until after start number two later in the week. What I did see though was a flat fastball and a curveball that hung when it was up in the zone.
It seemed as though JD was much better in the 3rd and 4th after he got over the initial nerves.  We'll see if we see more life on that fastball vs. San Diego.

Online sportsfan882

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #352: July 21, 2009, 12:24:21 PM »
Bard is awful despite the two doubles. He cost us 2 runs by coming out to far to catch that throw from Morgan.

His defense outweighs his offense. Nieves should be starting more games.

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #353: July 21, 2009, 12:25:25 PM »
Bard is awful despite the two doubles. He cost us 2 runs by coming out to far to catch that throw from Morgan.

His defense outweighs his offense. Nieves should be starting more games.

Nieves is a worse overall defensive catcher than Bard is. His game calling skills are worse overall than all of Bard's other problems. Unless you still want to claim Nieves isn't calling horrible game after horrible game.

Offline shoeshineboy

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #354: July 21, 2009, 12:30:26 PM »
Bard is awful despite the two doubles. He cost us 2 runs by coming out to far to catch that throw from Morgan.

His defense outweighs his offense. Nieves should be starting more games.

Bard may give a decent effort, and has some more pop in his bat, but his defense is awful. There are too many games where his failings have cost this team big time and it doesn't show up in the stats. Forget about the actual errors, his inability to catch balls really hurt. The nightmare inning against the Cubs on Sunday was a Bard lowlight reel. If he catches the foul tip that landed right in his glove, Soriano strikes out. Instead, he stays alive and jacks a homer. The subsequent wild pitches were more like passed balls that moved up runners into scoring position and out of DP position on several occasions. Sure the pitching had its issues, but the defense didn't help, and you just can't give away bases and outs and expect a pitcher to control the damage. I think I counted at least 5 bases and an extra out yielded by Bard in the course of 1 inning.

Online sportsfan882

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #355: July 21, 2009, 12:31:15 PM »
Nieves is a worse overall defensive catcher than Bard is. His game calling skills are worse overall than all of Bard's other problems. Unless you still want to claim Nieves isn't calling horrible game after horrible game.
It doesn't matter who is behind the plate, the pitching is absolutely terrible.

Giving up 3 hits to Francoeur in 1 game last night?! ridiculous. He should never get a hit off of us if we pitched him smart. Throw the ball out of the strike zone and he will chase.

Nieves can throw the ball and catch it unlike Bard. Bard just scares me behind home plate because you know his defense is going to bite us in some form or fashion every night. Nieves is swinging a decent bat right now and has been going to RF a lot lately. No reason for him to only play once a week. At least split the time like 60/40. not 80/20 like it is now.

Offline DCFan

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #356: July 21, 2009, 12:32:54 PM »
Forget about the actual errors, his inability to catch balls really hurt.

9 times out of 10, if there's a play at the plate, you'll see the ball bouncing around somewhere after he's dropped it or misplayed it.

Offline shoeshineboy

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #357: July 21, 2009, 12:38:38 PM »
9 times out of 10, if there's a play at the plate, you'll see the ball bouncing around somewhere after he's dropped it or misplayed it.

And Sunday wasn't the first time where he failed to catch foul tips for Ks. Sure, every catcher deals with that, but Bard fails on the ones that should be caught on a regular basis. And he fails to get into proper position and field the ball the way he should. Both of these guys are backup catchers. But relying upon Bard is sacrificing defense up the middle for a mild offensive consideration. Nieves has batted well in limited at bats, and is able to produce and knock in runs even batting 8th. He's a good contact hitter with better skills. The team needs better defense.

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #358: July 21, 2009, 12:58:02 PM »
Nieves can throw the ball and catch it unlike Bard. Bard just scares me behind home plate because you know his defense is going to bite us in some form or fashion every night. Nieves is swinging a decent bat right now and has been going to RF a lot lately. No reason for him to only play once a week. At least split the time like 60/40. not 80/20 like it is now.

Stats -

Bard - 317.1 Innings played, 3 errors, 2 PB, 9/28 CS/S = 32.14, .986 fielding %
Nieves - 285.0 Innings played, 4 errors, 2 PB, 8/25 CS/S = 32.0, .982 fielding %

So, as you guys were saying... Nieves is THAT much better than Bard?

Offline PANatsFan

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #359: July 21, 2009, 01:27:27 PM »
I miss Jesus :(

Offline spidernat

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #360: July 21, 2009, 02:27:29 PM »
Bard is awful despite the two doubles. He cost us 2 runs by coming out to far to catch that throw from Morgan.

His defense outweighs his offense. Nieves should be starting more games.

Aren't you supposed to be banned from this particular game thread?  :lol:

Online sportsfan882

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #361: July 21, 2009, 02:33:15 PM »
Stats -

Bard - 317.1 Innings played, 3 errors, 2 PB, 9/28 CS/S = 32.14, .986 fielding %
Nieves - 285.0 Innings played, 4 errors, 2 PB, 8/25 CS/S = 32.0, .982 fielding %

So, as you guys were saying... Nieves is THAT much better than Bard?
yes. the stats don't tell everything. Nieves should be getting more starts.

Aren't you supposed to be banned from this particular game thread?  :lol:
I guess. thanks for that Chief. I cut the game off after Martin left the game and skipped forward through the DVR recording of the game later last night. This team isn't worth the time.

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #362: July 21, 2009, 02:41:04 PM »
yes. the stats don't tell everything. Nieves should be getting more starts.

They would if Nieves had better stats.

Also, what stats should you look at between the two?

Hitting? 

Bard - .265/.338/.375/.713, 1 HR, 12 RBI's, 12 2B, 14 BB
Nieves - .267/.307/.319/.626, 0 HR, 10 RbI's, 6 2B, 6 BB

Offline fan

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #363: July 21, 2009, 02:59:10 PM »
What other team should I root for so that I have a dog in this year's pennant chase?

Mets?  No.
Phillies?  No.
Marlins?  No.
Cubs?  HELL NO.
Cardinals?  Perhaps....
Brewers?  Perhaps....
Astros?  Probably (but they aren't going anywhere)
Giants?  No.
Rockies?  No.
Brewers.  Brewers.  Keep Turning up the Heat!

Offline JCA-CrystalCity

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #364: July 21, 2009, 02:59:17 PM »
Josh Bard averages .652 passed balls and wild pitches per game in 2009.
Jesus Flores averaged .613.
Wil Nieves averages .474.
(http://www.hardballtimes.com/thtstats/main/index.php?view=catching&linesToDisplay=50&qual_filter=ignore&season_filter%5B0%5D=2009&league_filter%5B0%5D=All&Submit=Submit&orderBy=wpPlusPbPerG&direction=DESC&page=1)

For some reason, Wil has 2x as many assists than Bard in fewer innings (25 x 13). 

Offline Lintyfresh85

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #365: July 21, 2009, 03:02:19 PM »
Josh Bard averages .652 passed balls and wild pitches per game in 2009.
Jesus Flores averaged .613.
Wil Nieves averages .474.
(http://www.hardballtimes.com/thtstats/main/index.php?view=catching&linesToDisplay=50&qual_filter=ignore&season_filter%5B0%5D=2009&league_filter%5B0%5D=All&Submit=Submit&orderBy=wpPlusPbPerG&direction=DESC&page=1)


Wild pitches aren't always the catchers fault though... and in fact are charged on the pitcher.

While some will be the catchers fault, not all are.

For some reason, Wil has 2x as many assists than Bard in fewer innings (25 x 13). 


That's because Nieves doesn't know how to pitch to the bottom of the order. He shows too much respect to 8 hitter who gets on and then the pitcher sac bunts him over... thus the reason he has twice as many assist. He has twice as many sac bunts to pick up and throw out.

Online sportsfan882

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #366: July 21, 2009, 03:04:42 PM »
that's laughable. we are just as terrible with Bard behind the plate calling games. He's a joke.

Our pitchers bend over like losers time and time again with 2 outs and against the bottom of the lineup.

Stammen got beat because he gave up a hit to the pitcher. JZ got beat because he rolled over and threw a meat slider to Soriano.

Offline GMUNat

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #367: July 21, 2009, 03:08:23 PM »
Wil Nieves is a complete joke as a game caller. I still remember a game JZ had a man on second with 2 outs and the 8 Hitter was coming up. JZ gets ahead 0-2, then throws a fastball middle-in that goes for a hit making a 2-0 deficit. I don't blame Nieves for the placement, but the fact they called for a fastball anywhere near the plate in that situation to a #8 hitter with the pitcher coming up.

Online sportsfan882

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #368: July 21, 2009, 03:12:50 PM »
JZ doesn't know how to pitch yet. I don't blame that on the catchers.

He throws too many strikes in pitchers counts and doesn't know how to bury the ball or throw it out of the zone to get people to chase or hit the ball weakly.

He'll get better but right now he is the rawest pitcher on our staff and makes a ton of mistakes.


Offline Minty Fresh

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #369: July 21, 2009, 03:13:43 PM »
that's laughable. we are just as terrible with Bard behind the plate calling games. He's a joke.

Our pitchers bend over like losers time and time again with 2 outs and against the bottom of the lineup.

Stammen got beat because he gave up a hit to the pitcher. JZ got beat because he rolled over and threw a meat slider to Soriano.

If you watch, Bard's actually calling a great game, the pitchers are badly missing their spots.

Offline PANatsFan

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #370: July 21, 2009, 03:14:03 PM »
SF wants to get himself banned. How about some quotes about Belliard, Kearns, Tavarez, somebody who's terrible?

Offline PANatsFan

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Re: Nationals vs Mets, Game 1
« Reply #371: July 21, 2009, 03:14:39 PM »
Bard is a better hitter. Period. He'd have more double if his groin wasn't hurt.