Strasburg TJ surgery & ongoing recovery news

[PatsNats28]

While simultaneously performing open heart surgery at an opera with a ballpoint pen? Now if only he knew which car to choose...

[chemist]

Stras will be getting PT in a building that's connected to the building that I work in, and if he moves up to weights, he will be lifting where I lift.  This is nuts.  I hope I get to see him soon.

[Minty Fresh]

ask him what he thinks of Dibble.

[tomterp]

Stras will be getting PT in a building that's connected to the building that I work in, and if he moves up to weights, he will be lifting where I lift.  This is nuts.  I hope I get to see him soon.

 

[tomterp]

Baseball Prospectus, 9/6

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=11920

The Long Road Back for Strasburg
by John Perrotto

Stephen Strasburg will begin the first day of the rest of his life Tuesday morning, and we're not trying to be cliché here. The Nationals' pitching phenom will start his rehabilitation work at the Scripps Clinic in La Jolla, California, the first step in his long road back from Tommy John reconstructive elbow surgery.

Strasburg had the surgery Friday with Dr. Lewis Yocum performing the operation and Nationals team orthopedist Dr. Wiemi Douoguih assisting at the Jobe-Kerlan Clinic in Inglewood, California. The three-hour surgery did not contain any surprises, as Yocum cultivated a tendon from Strasburg's left thigh and transplanted it into his right elbow to replace the ruptured ulnar collateral ligament.

Much of the Nationals' future is riding on Strasburg making a full recovery. They made him the first overall pick in the 2009 amateur draft from San Diego State, then signed him for a draft-record $15.1 million. It is not hyperbole to say Strasburg's major-league debut on June 8 against the Pirates at Nationals Park in Washington was the most anticipated first game of any player in baseball history, and he did not disappoint by striking out 14 in seven innings.

The plan of having Strasburg leading the Nationals back to respectability will have to wait a year, though. The 22-year-old almost certainly won't be ready to take a regular turn in the major-league rotation until the start of the 2012 season.

It would be enough to depress any general manager. However, the Nationals' Mike Rizzo is upbeat about Strasburg's future.

"I sleep well at night because I know this is only going to be a blip on the radar and Stephen will come back stronger than ever and resume on his path to having the type of outstanding career we believe he will have," Rizzo said. "I really feel it's just a bump in the road. Now, if there was a labrum tear or a rotator cuff injury, I wouldn't be sleeping so well at night. If it were a shoulder problem, I'd be very concerned."

Indeed, the recovery rate is extremely high for pitchers undergoing Tommy John surgery. What gives Rizzo even more hope that Strasburg will return to become a dominant pitcher is the quality of care he will receive during his rehab.

Strasburg will start out at Scripps, near his home in San Diego. The rehab will then move to the state-of-the-art training facility agent Scott Boras provides for his clients in Newport Beach, California. Once spring training nears in early February, Strasburg will report to the Nationals' complex in Viera, Florida, and work under the watchful eye of respected veteran minor-league pitching coach Mark Grater, who oversees the organization's rehabbing pitchers.

"Stephen is going to have a lot of very good people watching over him and taking care of him," Rizzo said.

Strasburg will also have a teammate to lean on for advice and support during his rehabilitation. Highly regarded right-hander Jordan Zimmermann underwent Tommy John surgery last year on August 19.

The 24-year-old returned to the major leagues one year and one week after the operation, starting August 26 against the Cardinals and allowing five runs in four innings. However, in his second start last Tuesday, he pitched six scoreless innings against the Marlins and allowed only one hit.

"Stephen and I have talked," Zimmermann said. "Naturally, he was a little apprehensive about everything but he also knows that it's an injury and a surgery you can come back from. The most difficult part of the rehab is mental, especially the first four months when you're not allowed to throw a baseball. I told him that those four months will seem like they're forever but then the time really starts to fly once you begin throwing. A year seems like a long time but it's really not and I know Stephen, with his work ethic, will put in all the work necessary to make a strong recovery."

The Nationals had a very detailed and structured plan on how to handle Strasburg's entry into professional baseball this season after he signed too late to play last year, except for a stint in the Arizona Fall League. Yet Strasburg's golden arm still blew out.

"People ask me if I'm disappointed but I'm not," Rizzo said. "I know we did everything the right way. Nothing we did compromised Stephen's health. It's really one of those things where all you can say is 'that's baseball.' Sure, it's a bad break for Stephen and for us, but it's not the end of the world, not at all."

[imref]

I heard Dr. Mike Marshall, 1974 NL Cy Young award winner and now a PhD focused on sports medicine on the radio a few days ago.  He argues that pitchers today are running into arm trouble due to mechanics, and pitch counts, innings limits, etc., won't fix the problem.  He also argues that pitchers wouldn't need TJ surgery if they mechanics were addressed.  He said he worked with Bowden at the Reds for a while until Bowden got fired.

Has anyone ever heard of his methods?  Is there any validity to his claims?

Here's an article about him:

http://www.cantstopthebleeding.com/upending-dr-mike-marshalls-inverted-w-among-other-things

[Lintyfresh85]

Have you seen what the pitchers look like after he 'changes' them?

It's the ugliest looking motion I've ever seen.

[Sharp]

Don't all the pitchers Mike Marshall trains end up throwing like 80 mph?  Regardless of how wonderful your mechanics are, the average UCL snaps at about the force it takes to throw a baseball 100 mph.  Unless you are lucky like Nolan Ryan and have a completely ridiculous outlier arm, if you throw as hard as Strasburg you are likely to need TJ surgery at some point.  Let him relax and recover with his old mechanics, they seemed to be working okay for him.

[tomterp]

I heard Dr. Mike Marshall, 1974 NL Cy Young award winner and now a PhD focused on sports medicine on the radio a few days ago.  He argues that pitchers today are running into arm trouble due to mechanics, and pitch counts, innings limits, etc., won't fix the problem.  He also argues that pitchers wouldn't need TJ surgery if they mechanics were addressed.  He said he worked with Bowden at the Reds for a while until Bowden got fired.

Has anyone ever heard of his methods?  Is there any validity to his claims?

Here's an article about him:

http://www.cantstopthebleeding.com/upending-dr-mike-marshalls-inverted-w-among-other-things

Marshall's a bit like a mosquito at a picnic.  He's more annoying than anything.  He's tried like crazy to get clubs to take him seriously, but nobody does.  Only the truly desperate seem to go to him.  All that being said, sometimes geniuses don't get traction immediately. 

[Sharp]

Marshall's a bit like a mosquito at a picnic.  He's more annoying than anything.  He's tried like crazy to get clubs to take him seriously, but nobody does.  Only the truly desperate seem to go to him.  All that being said, sometimes geniuses don't get traction immediately. 

I just read a study (I can't remember if it was linked in the article or not) that basically concluded that Marshall's pitchers were putting just as much stress on their shoulders and UCLs but generating less velocity than "normal" pitchers, and apparently there are others that have reached the same conclusion, so I'm guessing the reason nobody takes him seriously is because his methods don't work.  But I understand the desire to believe in what he says... people like order and logic and don't like being told that "sometimes crap just happens."

[imref]

so the bottom line is that if you turn everyone into Livan, they can pitch forever?

[tomterp]

I'm guessing the reason nobody takes him seriously is because his methods don't work. 

Probably, but I leave the door open on this one.  The clubs tend to emulate each other, not be trailblazers.  Beane is one of the few innovators, and once people saw what he was up to, they ran like lemmings to adopt his principles, thus eliminating the advantage.  Watch if the Rangers win the series, everyone will begin to try to stretch out pitchers in accord with Ryan's philosophies.

[Sharp]

Probably, but I leave the door open on this one.  The clubs tend to emulate each other, not be trailblazers.  Beane is one of the few innovators, and once people saw what he was up to, they ran like lemmings to adopt his principles, thus eliminating the advantage.  Watch if the Rangers win the series, everyone will begin to try to stretch out pitchers in accord with Ryan's philosophies.

I'd be much more inclined to believe that Ryan's methods work than I would that Marshall's did, since the pitch count theory is basically predicated on one or two very flawed studies and there's no solid conclusive evidence that it matters all that much.  But if you actually look at how long the Rangers starters are going, it's only like a third of an inning longer than the MLB average per start, so no matter how they do this postseason I don't think other teams are going to change how they operate significantly.

[tomterp]

  But if you actually look at how long the Rangers starters are going, it's only like a third of an inning longer than the MLB average per start

I'd be more interested how they are trending vs. their own recent history.  Definitely a work in progress, and talent is always going to be a limiting factor.  And boy, the heat is just brutal down there for much of the season (I lived there two years and went to a number of games) which can wear down pitchers in the late innings.

[welch]

I'm pretty sure that throwing a screw-ball, which is Strasburg's change-up, is touchy. I've tried it, and it hurts my elbow without even throwing the ball. You-tube has an example. When I learned -- and I wasn't a pitcher -- the curve felt pretty natural. The screw-ball requires you to snap your arm in reverse.

Pitchers used to learn the screw-ball after 30, when their fast-ball was dying. Strasburg is a little young for that pitch.

Otherwise, what do we really know???

(We know how to hope that he comes back with a hard fastball and a big slow curve. For the rest???)

[Lintyfresh85]

This is video of Marshall's pitching style.



One, it's weird as the dude is just in compression shorts.

Two, the motion is horrible and if I ever faced off against this kid, I'd have a hard time not laughing at him during his windup.

[Sharp]

How does Strasburg have a slow curve, exactly? Last time I checked it was the fastest of any starting pitcher in the major leagues.  That and its break are a huge reason for its effectiveness.  As for Strasburg's changeup--and it is a changeup, just a really hard one--I know that even before his injury some scouts opined that he threw it harder than his fastball.  He got a ton of swinging strikes on it (he was basically destroying the Phllies with it), so I certainly don't want him to abandon it, particularly not with his newer, thicker ligament.  Maybe he could lower the velocity a tad, but I really don't think changing how he pitches at this point is a good idea.  Honestly, I don't think there's all that much wrong with his mechanics except for the speed at which he throws--and as numerous pitchers have shown, you don't need to sacrifice velocity after TJ surgery.

[Kevrock]

This is video of Marshall's pitching style.



One, it's weird as the dude is just in compression shorts.

Two, the motion is horrible and if I ever faced off against this kid, I'd have a hard time not laughing at him during his windup.

Don't forget the training video:

No one is going to take an MLB pitching staff and re-teach professional pitchers to throw this way.

As far as eliminating injuries, Marshall can scream as loud as he wants but the sample size is way too small to make any judgments.

[Kevrock]

http://www.baseballdailydigest.com/2010/09/16/stras-wars-iv-the-dark-side/

[Coladar]

Anyone else concerned about these comments on Zuckerman"s blog? Could be a joke, could be he just wants *some* time off after he can't find five seconds to himself. That said, it is his freaking pitching coach, and while we all suspect what kind of pitching coach he is,these quotes are really worrisome to me. Not Strasburgs performance or anything coming back, just his attitude, leadership and desire to actually be here. Yes, these quote are beyond nothing in the grand scheme, but they mean something.

Strasburg, whose zealous quest for privacy has made family members off-limits for interviews, has also apparently had time to tend to his Facebook page, moving virtually all its elements behind a privacy wall. In other words, no longer will non-friends be able to see that among his "likes" are John McCain and "Kenny Powers from 'Eastbound & Down.' "

There are also signs that his communications freeze-out may finally be thawing. Nationals rookie closer Drew Storen, whose march through the minor leagues this season roughly mirrored Strasburg's, said he exchanged a couple of text messages with him recently.

"Just wanted to check up on him," Storen said. "He said he was doing fine."

When McCatty found out that Strasburg had responded to one of Storen's texts, he got the latter to help him send one from McCatty's own phone.

"Then, finally, [Strasburg] called me the other day when I was on the way to the ballpark. But I missed it, and when I went to call him back, he didn't answer again," McCatty said, smiling and shaking head. "Maybe I should take a hint."

[The Chief]

So I guess you're implying that maybe Strasburg blames McCatty for his injury?

[PANatsFan]

Everyone with a brain has their facebook page behind the privacy wall, and I imagine he might be grumpy and not willing to take work calls.

[Coladar]

Well, I'd agree accept for taking Zimmermann's call. I'm really, really, really sleep deprived right now, so I might be missing somehing. That said, it is never a good sign when you haVe a player ignoring coaches phone calls and screening them.

Chief, that thought never entered my mind, but would it shock me? Probably not. Does seem like quite a laugher of a theory though.

[blue911]

Well, I'd agree accept for taking Zimmermann's call. I'm really, really, really sleep deprived right now, so I might be missing somehing. That said, it is never a good sign when you haVe a player ignoring coaches phone calls and screening them.

Chief, that thought never entered my mind, but would it shock me? Probably not. Does seem like quite a laugher of a theory though.

He probably doesn't have any idea who was calling him. Why on earth would he blame McCatty for anything?

[The Chief]

@ blaming McCatty - I don't necessarily think that's the case, it just seemed to be what Colodar's post was implying.  Misinterpretation on my part.