right, Chief. I was really looking for the Ramos ROTY thread but did not dig further back than 3 pages. I/M/O, the Fangraphs piece understates just how good of a rookie year Ramos had. There was the article from NBC saying it was one of the top 5 rookie years for a catcher in the past 50 or so. That is darn impressive. As much of a Norris fan as I am, I no longer consider Ramos a place holder and think he may really be a block for Norris, making him trade bait. Deal him to the Twins in a Span package, perhaps, and see if we can keep Clip and Storen.