2012/13 Offseason Discussion Thread

[NationalHeat]

nationalheat ... it's not top 10 payroll, is it?

what about all the years of them putting out laughable payrolls with laughable rosters ...

and there is still work to be done to get some of our own guys locked up (plus add some pieces).  c'mon now.

Why have a high payroll those early years when the player development aspect (and GM) stunk?

I'll agree with signing our own guys, but what in the past 2 years has led you to believe we won't sign our players? They already have.

[hammondsnats]

they have signed draft picks.  they haven't re-signed LaRoche.  we haven't gotten another pitcher.  etc.  i know there's time left, but i'm not ready to give up on LAC for good.  They should be willing to go the extra mile to get us over the hump.  There's been improvement, yes, but not out of the woods just yet.

[Squab]

According to Kilgore/Kolko Rizzo seemed more keen on finding a "dynamic" CF going forward in a radio interview this morning. May mean Bourn.

[wpa2629]

Maybe it's Goodwin ??!!

[Slateman]

According to Kilgore/Kolko Rizzo seemed more keen on finding a "dynamic" CF going forward in a radio interview this morning. May mean Bourn.

For three years? Sure. By then we'll know if Goodwin is ready. Even though I think Bourn will regress, he'd still be good enough.

This would also force the Morse/Laroche issue, and I'm not sure if I'm for that.

[tomterp]

nationalheat ... it's not top 10 payroll, is it?

well, we do have a lot of young guys so that would be expected.  I'd rather have young quality players in the ascendency than be in the Philthies' predicament.

[PC]

There's nothing dynamic about Bourne.  He strikes out far too much and he wants too much money and far too many years for what he gives you.

[sportsfan882]

William Ladson ‏@washingnats
I'm expecting Jesus Flores to be non-tendered this week. Kurt Suzuki and Wilson Ramos are the guys behind the plate next year. #Nats #MLB

[Minty Fresh]

William Ladson ‏@washingnats
I'm expecting Jesus Flores to be non-tendered this week. Kurt Suzuki and Wilson Ramos are the guys behind the plate next year. #Nats #MLB

And a small piece of fanboi has died....

[NationalHeat]

they have signed draft picks.  they haven't re-signed LaRoche.  we haven't gotten another pitcher.  etc.  i know there's time left, but i'm not ready to give up on LAC for good.  They should be willing to go the extra mile to get us over the hump.  There's been improvement, yes, but not out of the woods just yet.

Aside from Greinke, who out there is going to put us over the hump? Also keep in mind the Dodgers may give him the largest contract ever given to a SP, so the Nats could realistically offer him 120m and fall short big time.

Even LaRoche's contributions can be replaced. And really, you want to give him a 3 year deal, just to do it?

If they miss on Greinke, there is any number of players capable of being our 5 guy. That guy won't start in the playoffs anyway.

[Slateman]

There's nothing dynamic about Bourne.  He strikes out far too much and he wants too much money and far too many years for what he gives you.

3 years in a row of .340+ OBP. 3 years in a row of 40+ stolen bases. That's pretty dynamic from a leadoff hitter.

[PC]

We're not getting him three years ago. We're getting him now.

[houston-nat]

3 years in a row of .340+ OBP. 3 years in a row of 40+ stolen bases. That's pretty dynamic from a leadoff hitter.

Sure, but Werth has a higher OBP, lower K rate, higher pitch counts, higher wOBA, and more doubles. That's a superior leadoff hitter.

[HalfSmokes]

If they miss on Greinke, there is any number of players capable of being our 5 guy. That guy won't start in the playoffs anyway.

If that's the measure,  then there is a big difference between settling for lose or Sanchez and inviting filler to ST hoping something pans out.  Also,  extend Zimmermann

[NationalHeat]

3 years in a row of .340+ OBP. 3 years in a row of 40+ stolen bases. That's pretty dynamic from a leadoff hitter.

I'd agree, but year 4 and 5 (and 6?) will look bad for Bourn, IMO.

[Upark25]

After the Braves got Bourn I think its more and more likely Bourn and Hamilton end up in the NL East too. My guess Bourn to DC and Hamilton to Philly

[Upark25]

CF Bourn
LF Werth
3B Zimmerman
RF Harper
1B Morse
SS Desmond
2B Espinosa
C Ramos

It's happening.

[Slateman]

We're not getting him three years ago. We're getting him now.

By that logic we should never get any free agent. Ever.

Bourn isn't even 30 yet. He still posted high "speed" related numbers. Let's not pretend that he's already washed up.

Sure, but Werth has a higher OBP, lower K rate, higher pitch counts, higher wOBA, and more doubles. That's a superior leadoff hitter.

Morse moves to first base leaving us a hole in the outfield. Werth plays LF, Harper plays RF, Bourn plays CF. Werth's numbers look just as decent in the number 2 hole. To high OBP guys who can run decently for our Zimmerman/Morse/Harper/Desmond to drive in. Two years from now, Goodwin will be getting a September call up and legit try out for the next season. Bourn will be on his downward slope and Goodwin will take over. We'll be sucking up Bourn's contract at the same time we're sucking up Werth's.

[HalfSmokes]

Only if the price comes way down,  Rizzo seems too shrewd to pay for speed.

[cletusvandamme]

Bourn is garbage.

[Upark25]

I personally would prefer Josh Hamilton if he would accept something like a 3 year 75million dollar deal but I feel there is no way he takes that.

[wpa2629]

Bourn seemed to really fall off down the stretch last year and strikes out a ton (relatively speaking) and is getting up there in age - I don't see him as an upgrade over Harper in CF or Werth at lead-off and you'll have to really over pay to get him.

So yeah - No to Bourn

I want Goodwin - let's give him a shot

[hammondsnats]

tomterp, i get that, but the phils did win a world series. 

i'm not saying laroche needs a 5 year deal. 

[houston-nat]

Morse moves to first base leaving us a hole in the outfield. Werth plays LF, Harper plays RF, Bourn plays CF. Werth's numbers look just as decent in the number 2 hole. To high OBP guys who can run decently for our Zimmerman/Morse/Harper/Desmond to drive in. Two years from now, Goodwin will be getting a September call up and legit try out for the next season. Bourn will be on his downward slope and Goodwin will take over. We'll be sucking up Bourn's contract at the same time we're sucking up Werth's.

But that's a downgrade three times over. Bourn is a downgrade when he's on his downward slope and we're saddled with his future contract for a fourth outfielder. Bourn is a downgrade on Harper's future production on center. And Morse is a downgrade from LaRoche at 1B.

[imref]

Nats make a signing, per Craig Heist: F.P. Santangelo is coming back to the booth next year.  They offered a contract to Carp as well.