MY IMITATION OF ANDREW ON THIS DAY

[nospinzone1]

(TO DAVID GREGORY) YOUR AND OTHERS IN THE MEDIA ARE CROSSING THE LINE IN YOUR DISRESPECT FOR THE PRESIDENCY. AS A MATTER OF FACT I WOULD PUT YOU, PERSONALLY , IN THE CATEGORY OF jerk FULL OF **** AND WITH AN INFLATED EGO OF WHAT A NEWS CORRESPONDENT SHOULD BE. WHEN YOUNGER I KNEW AP CORRESPONDENTS FROM WORKING THERE. THEY WOULD NEVER IN THEIR WILDEST DREAM WOULD TALK TO A PRESIDENT THE WAY YOU DO. YOU ARE A DISGRACE TO JOURNALISM. JIM KORICKI, ROCKVILLE, MD.

t: I AM A LEGAL HISPANIC IMMIGRANT AND OPPOSE ILEGALS
To: CAVUTO@FOXNEWS.COM
    WHAT PART OF BREAKING THE LAW don't the ilegals do not understand???? my family and I had to wait for our visas and there are millions of people in line waiting to get their visas. why should LAWBREAKERS be rewarded? I am a registgered Republican and I am changing my affliation to Independent after seeing how the President and some Republican politicians are selling me and the country down.

[kimnat]

Very cool!  Let me know if you get a response.

Love the topic title!  Andrew railed on me something fierce today.  Dern near got his mouth washed out!  Instead, got a lot of fun taken away.

[Dave B]

I would hardly think illegals are getting away with much and they are a vital part of the economy. yeah they are somewhat mooching off us, but i dont envy their position. 

they work for hardly nothing and that savings is passed along to us.

[nospinzone1]

I would hardly think illegals are getting away with much and they are a vital part of the economy. yeah they are somewhat mooching off us, but i dont envy their position. 

they work for hardly nothing and that savings is passed along to us.

I AM NOT AGAINST IMMIGRANTS. just the ones that break the law. there are millions of people waiting in line around the world to come here legally. WHAT PART OF BREAKING THE LAW DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND.???? When we start condoning breaking the law then we are not different than Cuba, Haiti, Santo Domingo, Mejico, which is one if not the most corrupt country in the hemisphere, etc. etc. I do not want to see my adopted country, which I love, to become a third world country.

[Dave B]

i dont think it is so cut and dried. legal immigrants dont work for cheap.

who is going to mow your lawn for cheap? who is going to work in the restaurants to keep the food cheap.

i really dont know how much these people make, but there is a reason they have all these jobs. they do it cheap, likely less than minimium wage. i probably spend 70 bucks a week eating out. some people probably get their lawn cut for what 20 bucks (i really dont know). others might get some home improvement done, like a couple of grand.

if we didnt have cheap labor, I might spend 85 dollars eating out, 25-30 on my lawn, add 500 to my home improvement.

15 dollars times 52 weeks = 780$
5-10 dollars time 20 lawn cuttings = 100$-200$
500 dollars for home labor.

that is savings on the order of thousands of dollars a year. fine, mooch a couple of precriptions and doctors visits off me, we'll call it even.

if you are a doctor or some other professional looking to make a good living, you probably have to wait and go through the process.  if you want to live in sqwalor (sp?) and cut lawns in 95 degree heat then bus tables at night, you can come here illegally.

these people probably work for about the same as what a citizen can make collecting unemployment.  i suppose that one could argue that if they werent here, then we wouldnt have to pay people to be unemployed.  that remains to be seen.

i dont feel as though anybody is screwing me by being here illegally

[nospinzone1]

IN OTHER WORDS YOU CONDONE BREAKING THE LAW SO YOU DONT GET CHARGED WHAT WE ALL SHOULD BE CHARGED. SORRY, IT DOES NOT RING A BELL BY ME. AGAIN, WHAT PART OF BREAKING THE LAW DO NOT YOU UNDERSTAND?

DO YOU CONDONE DRUG DEALING IN SCHOOLS SO THE KIDS WONT HAVE TO ASK FOR MORE MONEY TO BUY THEIR DRUGS?

DO YOU CONDONE ROBBING A BANK SO THEY WILL NOT HAVE SO MUCH MONEY AND CHARGE YOU INTEREST ON YOUR LOANS?

[Senators2005]

You aren't educated about what the reality is...you need to think more than just the present day situation.

Illegal workers work for cheap because they are used to having next to nothing.  They are willing to do more than just mow your lawn...eventually they and their children will be wanting more than just mowing your lawn.  Soon they will be willing to work cheaper in the factories...and after that the cubicles.  They depreciate American job value and cause companies to lower salaries.  That's the crux of the matter...

More profits for the upper level executive suits...more jobs for people that are willing to work for nothing - and the people in the middle - the everyday American who goes to a mid-level college and gets a middle class job who isn't rich OR poor - gets the shaft.

You won't be singing the same tune when you get laid off because a foreign worker will be willing to do the same thing you do for half the salary.  Then you won't have to worry about someone mowing your lawn...cause then you won't have a yard to mow.

[nospinzone1]

You aren't educated about what the reality is...you need to think more than just the present day situation.

Illegal workers work for cheap because they are used to having next to nothing.  They are willing to do more than just mow your lawn...eventually they and their children will be wanting more than just mowing your lawn.  Soon they will be wiling to work cheaper in the factories...and after that the cubicles.  They depreciate American job value and cause companies to lower salaries.  That's the crux of the matter...

More profits for the upper level executive suits...more jobs for people that are willing to work for nothing - and the people in the middle - the everyday American who goes to a mid-level college and gets a middle class job who isn't rich OR poor - gets the shaft.

You won't be singing the same tune when you get laid off because a foreign worker will be willing to do the same thing you do for half the salary.  Then you won't have to worry about someone mowing your lawn...cause then you won't have a yard to mow.

BY THE WAY WHAT DO YOU CONSIDER A FAIR PRICE FOR CUTTING A LAWN?
WITH THE BIG MACHINES LAWN CUTTERS ONLY SPEND AT THE MOST 15 MINUTES DOING IT.

AGAIN AND AGAIN TIL YOU UNDERSTAND IT....WHAT PART OF BREAKING THE LAW DONT YOU UNDERSTAND. SEEMS YOU ARE CONDONING BREAKING THE LAW.

ALSO I WONT GET LAID OFF SINCE I AM RETIRED ON FIXED INCOME WHICH IS EVEN WORSE THAN YOUNGER ONES .... MY RETIREMENT CHECKS DO NOT GO UP, EXCEPT FOR SS THAT GIVES YOU A COST OF LIVING INCREASE A YEAR.

[Senators2005]

MY RETIREMENT CHECKS DO NOT GO UP, EXCEPT FOR SS THAT GIVES YOU A COST OF LIVING INCREASE A YEAR.

YOU ARE LUCKY...YOU ARE OLD ENOUGH TO DRAW SOCIAL SECURITY, BY THE TIME I RETIRE THERE WILL BE NO MONEY LEFT.  THE 12 MILLION ILLEGALS WILL DRAW WHEN THEY RETIRE EVEN THOUGH THEY DID NOT CONTRIBUTE TO IT.  THERE WILL BE NO SOCIAL SECURITY FOR OUR CHILDREN.  THERE IS ALREADY NOT ENOUGH MONEY TO FUND THE SYSTEM, LET ALONE ADDING ANOTHER 12 MILLION (TRIPLE THAT BECAUSE THEY WILL ALL PETITION FOR THEIR FAMILIES WHO WILL ALSO DRAW).

THE 12 MILLION IS ONLY THE TIP OF THE ICEBERG.  ONCE YOU ARE A CITIZEN YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO PETITION YOUR IMMEDIATE RELATIVES (MOTHER, FATHER, SISTERS, BROTHERS AND THEIR FAMILIES).  SO YOU ARE REALLY LOOKING AT AROUND 60 MILLION NEW AMERICAN CITIZENS.  THEN MULTIPLY THAT BY THEIR CHILDREN AFTER 20 YEARS.

[kimnat]

Nospin, I think, if I read correctly that Sens may have been agreeing in part w/ you.  I saw that as more of a response to Dave.  Am I right on this one or out in LF, Sens?

[NatsAddict]

According to a report this week, the average unskilled illegal alien household cost the legal taxpayers an average of $19,588 annually.  There are an estimated 4.5 million such households.  The tab comes to just under $90 billion annually.

You can also check out the summary

[Senators2005]

Nospin, I think, if I read correctly that Sens may have been agreeing in part w/ you.  I saw that as more of a response to Dave.  Am I right on this one or out in LF, Sens?

No you're right...I took it as such.

[kimnat]

According to a report this week, the average unskilled illegal alien household cost the legal taxpayers an average of $19,588 annually.  There are an estimated 4.5 million such households.  The tab comes to just under $90 billion annually.

You can also check out the summary

Holy Cow!  No wonder we're spiraling out of control!  And those immigration rallies really tick me off.  They're not even legal residents so where do they get off making demands of our gov't.  If you don't like it, don't stay.  They weren't invited to begin w/.  Plus if the U.S. is so great, then why the fuss is all this Mexico is great stuff.  If Mexico is so great, GO BACK.  This just really gets my goat.  And where's that fence?

[Senators2005]

Holy Cow!  No wonder we're spiraling out of control!  And those immigration rallies really tick me off.  They're not even legal residents so where do they get off making demands of our gov't.  If you don't like it, don't stay.  They weren't invited to begin w/.  Plus if the U.S. is so great, then why the fuss is all this Mexico is great stuff.  If Mexico is so great, GO BACK.  This just really gets my goat.  And where's that fence?

The fence is a joke...unfortunately none of this is going to be solved one way or another.  Do something and it makes things worse...don't do anything and they are still going to flood the border and come across.  This is the perfect storm against the typical American "Joe six-pack"...because NOBODY is looking out for them.

The Republicans want low cost cheap labor for their Big Bussiness Daddies who contribute to their political war chests...and the Democrats want easy votes.  The predominance of immigrant voters (except Cubans) vote democratic. 

Meanwhile, the ordinary everyday guy with a mini-van, mortgage, two mouths (or more) to feed and bills to pay is going to get the worm.  He'll get the pink slip from his employer because somebody who has just been made legal said he would do his $70,000 a year job for $8 bucks an hour.

[2k6nats]

With my legal career starting in full swing at the age of 27, hopefully I won't need Social Security.

[Senators2005]

With my legal career starting in full swing at the age of 27, hopefully I won't need Social Security.

You won't need it, because you won't be able to find it...it will be like the dinosaurs, they will have to excavate it from fossil rock.  No.  Guys like you and me need 401Ks and IRAs to survive retirement unfortunately.

[NatsAddict]

All this puts a double whammy on guys like NoSpin.  The spending, and deficit, devalues the dollar and creates inflation on all imported goods.  Since we've inexcusably been net importers of food for the past two years, and import much of our energy, this is having a direct and negative impact on those items.  However, when measuring inflation, the feds ignore food and energy, using the so-called core inflation rate, when giving him his cost of living increase.  Yet, food and energy make up a proportionately larger percentage of a retirees spending than for those of us in the working class.

Even with record annual deficits, the illegals are still responsible for 20% of the true annual deficit (or roughly 40% of the deficit in the manner in which the OMB calculates it).

[2k6nats]

Remember when Clinton was president in 1998 or so?  The economy was great; we had countries OWING US money instead of us OWING THEM money.  God, I just can't picture what the economy will be like fifty years from now at this rate.  Or I could just move to France; I speak French pretty well.  I mean, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em

[Ericas Nats]

Nospin,

YOU ARE MY HERO!

I dont care who you are, or what color, or religion you are. you better pay taxes just like it do!

My great-great grandparents were from ireland. they were imigrants. they got their papers, so to speak. they PAID TAXES.

and im sorry, you dont dissss the leader of the free world like that. im sorry but as much as i am a republican. if a dem would win the white house next election. i would not disrepect him/her. (well mabey if it was hillary...i would puke)



Anyways, women who are both dem and rep say GOP men are much better. casue who wants to date a man who drives a prius?

go-green, NOT

[Senators2005]

Remember when Clinton was president in 1998 or so?  The economy was great; we had countries OWING US money instead of us OWING THEM money.  God, I just can't picture what the economy will be like fifty years from now at this rate.  Or I could just move to France; I speak French pretty well.  I mean, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em

Actually our economy is BOOMING...Wall Street and the Dow is at an all-time high.  What they are not telling you is that the success is not being distributed (in laments terms, all the rich people are keeping it for themselves).  While corporate profits are up, mid-level salaries are stagnant.  So much for "trickle down economics".

Cost of living is up. inflation is up, price of gas is up, cost of a loaf of friggin bread is up, personal debt is now on the rise.  It's really getting bad...these upper crust snobs better get a grip or they are going to screw the pooch on the greatest country in the world.

[NatsAddict]

Remember when Clinton was president in 1998 or so?  The economy was great; we had countries OWING US money instead of us OWING THEM money.  God, I just can't picture what the economy will be like fifty years from now at this rate.  Or I could just move to France; I speak French pretty well.  I mean, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em

Actually, the last time we were a creditor nation, or even had an annual surplus, was in the late 50's.  But, in general, you are correct that things were much better fiscally before W.  I've already setup my US escape to New Zealand.  My wife is 52, and they will not permit you to immigrate if you are 56+.  My daughter graduates HS in 2009, and we're leaving. 

[Dave B]

Nospin,

Breaking some laws is not as bad as breaking others. I drive over the speed limit all the time

Others,

I do not claim to be an expert on these things.  I was just trying to say that this is not a clear cut issue. These people do bring value to our nations and essentially global economy.  Engineering jobs are being farmed out to India because they work for cheap.  Cheap work does not need to only be performed inside our borders.  So I really think the cheapening of labor will only occur at those menial jobs if illegals are let in, because nothing is stopping high paying jobs from being cheapened on the global level now. 

In what is becoming an increasingly global economy, there will be millions if not billions of equally qualified people willing to work for much less than we are in almost all walks of life, as long as that job doesnt require speaking english.  We've kind of had it too good for too long.  And now it is starting to even out.

In terms of the illegals working for cheap, they can only work for cheap because they are illegal and can be paid less than minimum since they dont exist on the books. 

Keeping illegals out is putting a finger in the dyke.  I remember a stat from a professor that I heard a while ago: the US is 6% of the worlds population and consumes half of it resources.  Those might not be the exact numbers, but the point is we are insanely wealthier than other countries and if things equilibriate, as most things do, there is nowhere for us to go but down.

[Senators2005]

Those might not be the exact numbers, but the point is we are insanely wealthier than other countries and if things equilibriate, as most things do, there is nowhere for us to go but down.

That's right and excuse me for not being politically correct: but I don't want to "equilibriate" with India & Mexico.  I don't want my quality of life to depreciate so that the people of the world can have a job...I elect and pay my politicians (supposedly anyways) to make sure that doesn't happen.

[nospinzone1]

Very cool!  Let me know if you get a response.

Love the topic title!  Andrew railed on me something fierce today.  Dern near got his mouth washed out!  Instead, got a lot of fun taken away.

USUALLY THEY DO NOT REPLY....THEY ARE TOO FULL OF THEMSELVES....EXAMPLE, EUGENE ROBINSON , COLUMNIST WASH. POST....HE LIKES TO RAG ON THE PRESIDENT AND GIVE HIM NAMES LIKE "THE DECIDER" SO I DECIDED TO GIVE HIM A NAME: DISIN GENE NOUS AND HE NEVER RESPONDS TO MY EMAILS, OTHERS, HOWARD CONFLICT OF INTEREST? KURTZ WORKS FOR THE POST AND CNN; WHEN I POINTED TO HIM HE MIGHT HAVE A CONFLICT OF INTREREST, NO REPLY. RICHARD JANE FONDA COHEN; HE HIGHTAILED TO CANADA DURING VN AS A DRAFT DODGER; POINTED IT OUT TO HIM, NO REPLY. I CAN GIVE GO MORE EXAMPLES, BUT WHY BORE YOU.

[nospinzone1]

YOU ARE LUCKY...YOU ARE OLD ENOUGH TO DRAW SOCIAL SECURITY, BY THE TIME I RETIRE THERE WILL BE NO MONEY LEFT.  THE 12 MILLION ILLEGALS WILL DRAW WHEN THEY RETIRE EVEN THOUGH THEY DID NOT CONTRIBUTE TO IT.  THERE WILL BE NO SOCIAL SECURITY FOR OUR CHILDREN.  THERE IS ALREADY NOT ENOUGH MONEY TO FUND THE SYSTEM, LET ALONE ADDING ANOTHER 12 MILLION (TRIPLE THAT BECAUSE THEY WILL ALL PETITION FOR THEIR FAMILIES WHO WILL ALSO DRAW).

THE 12 MILLION IS ONLY THE TIP OF THE ICEBERG.  ONCE YOU ARE A CITIZEN YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO PETITION YOUR IMMEDIATE RELATIVES (MOTHER, FATHER, SISTERS, BROTHERS AND THEIR FAMILIES).  SO YOU ARE REALLY LOOKING AT AROUND 60 MILLION NEW AMERICAN CITIZENS.  THEN MULTIPLY THAT BY THEIR CHILDREN AFTER 20 YEARS.

12 MILLION IS A CONSERVATIVE ESTIMATE....IT COULD POSSIBLY BE AS HIGH AS 20 OR 25 MILLION. AGREE SS WILL NOT BE THERE IN A FEW YEARS AND THAT IS WHY I AM ALWAYS COUNSELING PEOPLE TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THEIR 401KS AND MATCHNG FUND PROGRAMS OF EMPLOYERS.